Dear So and So

[Crankin]

More fun household stuff.
On August 14 our go to contractor came to begin to rebuild one of the 2 small decks we have. We were on the way to the airport for our trip to Italy when dh's phone rang. The deck AND the steps leading to it, as well as the side of the house around the slider to the steps are rotted through. It was so bad, he didn't have time to continue what was supposed to be a one week job. He came back last week and we now have demolished the deck and it is not being rebuilt. He is rebuilding the walls on 2 sides, taking out the sliders in the living rm and dining rm, and just putting up a wall in both places. Both of these rooms already have plenty of light, and. Our patio in the back is totally different and looks much better!
The down side is we will most likely have unpainted drywall ( and hopefully not boards) for my birthday celebration on the 9th. No one I have to impress is attending, but... Hope it's going to be done for Thanksgiving.
We figured out we've spent 11k a year since we've lived in this house on home repair. Of course, some was the original kitchen and baths remodel, but we've done 2 roofs (don't ask), doors, 33 windows, carpet in the lower level, new hot water heater, painting, and landscaping. The chimney still needs to be fixed. Our contractor says he's never seen a house so poorly built except one from the 1880s.
This is what I get for wanting to move out of my Stepford neighborhood, which is looking pretty good right now.

[emily_in_nc]

Reading all these posts about household remodeling and repair, I am even happier that we no longer own a home. We had owned a total of five homes and one condo over the years since we married in 1985 until earlier this year. Now we are house-free and living on the payments from our condo (we sold but did owner financing) and some savings until the balloon payment on the condo comes due (4.5 years unless they pay it off early) and until we start drawing on our retirement investments and/or drawing social security.

We are renting the home we are in (a nice furnished home of friends who are cruising on their sailboat) for very little and thus able to travel frequently. Next year we will probably move to a full-time traveling lifestyle, though we're still undecided about whether we'll buy an RV or continue to go with VRBOs -- monthly rentals are often quite reasonable.

We are enjoying having minimal home and yard maintenance requirements and will have even less once we're no longer in this rental. It's a different lifestyle, to be sure. The downside is not knowing many people in our immediate community and not having any community "roots" so to speak. Most of our friends and family are in NC and Ohio, with a few scattered all over the US. But it's a nice change of pace from a home and yard and all that entails.

Eventually I suspect we'll buy a place again to use as a base, but it may be a condo or townhouse to keep maintenance to a minimum and so we can continue to travel frequently without as many worries about security and upkeep. We know quite a few folks now who snowbird (either in the US or internationally) to avoid winters in the colder states, and that sounds pretty good to us.

For right now, though, we have no desire to become homeowners again anytime soon. We see all the headaches my folks are having with their home and their vacation cabin -- like crankin's experience, there always seems to be something major needing repaired or replaced. And then there's the yard upkeep. We've done extensive work in my folks' two yards and my DH's folks' yard this year to help them out as they've all gotten nearly too old to keep up with it. At least as long as we have parents still living in homes with yards, we have NO desire for our own. We'd rather be riding our bikes, hiking, sightseeing, or doing pretty much anything else.

[Crankin]

I have a pragmatic attitude toward this, Emily. DH used to get upset, but doesn't anymore. At least not like he used to. We chose to move here rather impulsively. We had never owned a house more than 10 years old. This house was about 25 when we bought it; we were enamored of the uniqueness of a contemporary home in this area (which fits us much better, actually. I cannot stand traditional style furniture) and the neighborhood itself, with a community pond. We knew we would do the remodel when we moved in and it was fine. Everything was done on time and no catastrophes. The only catastrophe was the first roof we put on; 2 years later we had 20 inches of snow on the roof, ice dams, and water pouring in the kitchen and dining room. The house has unusual roof lines and we needed a real expert to figure out how to stop this. I could not imagine living in an apartment at this stage of my life, or maybe ever. We eventually will move to a townhome or condo, if we can find one that meets our requirements, which is hard in this area. I am not ready to get rid of all of my sports stuff, in 4-5 years. We don't want to move to the city, either. We may expand our search to a few other surrounding towns, but we also might end up just buying a smaller house and contract out all of the outside work; we don't have a lawn now, which was a requirement, after the last house, but we do have landscaping. I hate gardening, DH likes it, though. DH is hesitant about sharing any walls with neighbors.
We know we won't ever be snowbirds, as we like winter sports too much. I wouldn't be adverse to a longer trip back to AZ in the winter, but no second home there. We've actually thought of buying 2 smaller places, one around here, and one out in the Berkshires, which is really a 4 season sport/cultural place, still in Massachusetts (although people from NYC seem to think otherwise!). And none of this has affected our ability to ride or do other stuff. We've always had people do our outdoor yard work, until we moved here. My motto is to outsource everything, if you can afford it.
I just am not that enamored of any of the home "planning" things, whether it be a major remodel or a small thing, the way some women get crazy about "design." I've become more participatory in the past few years, as I've ended up with things I don't like due my own laziness over this stuff. I think this started out as a "I hate womanly things" kind of rant when I was a young married person, and I was more than happy to let DH handle it all, as he *knew* about window treatments and such when he was 23 . I'll never forget when the woman came to our second home with the "book" of window treatments after we moved in. When I said "Oh, you're here to see my husband," she truly did not know what to say. I was 8 months pregnant and more worried about starting the new school year and being about to give birth in the same time frame!

[SheFly]

For right now, though, we have no desire to become homeowners again anytime soon. We see all the headaches my folks are having with their home and their vacation cabin -- like crankin's experience, there always seems to be something major needing repaired or replaced. And then there's the yard upkeep. We've done extensive work in my folks' two yards and my DH's folks' yard this year to help them out as they've all gotten nearly too old to keep up with it. At least as long as we have parents still living in homes with yards, we have NO desire for our own. We'd rather be riding our bikes, hiking, sightseeing, or doing pretty much anything else.

Yup - we own three homes (that we do not rent out). I wouldn't have things any other way! Our primary home is a 1950s ranch that we have had quite a lot of work done to, and I love. Our second home in Maine is a 1980s chalet where we have also done a bunch of work (ourselves on that one). We love it so much we have decided that we can't possibly sell it - too much of us in it. And our third is a three season camp in VT built in the 70s. That one needs A LOT of work, but we enjoy that sort of effort.

Funny story. Two years after we bought the house in Maine, we were building a reasonably significant addition. It was to have a cathedral ceiling (14 feet) with a center ridge beam. We were setting the rafters with DH on the ladder and me passing the rafters up to him to set. He set one, decided he didn't like the way it fit, and asked me for another. The next thing I remember, I was sitting on the step of the shed with my hand on my head, which was GUSHING blood. The rafter (a 10x12) had fallen from 14 feet and hit me in the head . It didn't knock me out, but did require 9 staples to close (that is another story). So, that house, literally, is our blood sweat and tears .

Different wants/needs for everyone! I am lucky that despte trying to kill me once, DH and I can do those kinds of projects together (and live to tell about it!).

SheFly

[emily_in_nc]

I think one reason I'm glad for our "no house" lifestyle now is that we built three houses over the years (one a starter home and two custom homes later). We did all of the landscaping on each and a lot of interior work (painting, etc.) We had gardens and worked on the house or yard ALL the time. We have always been frugal and have rarely hired out any work, inside or outside the home. DH doesn't like having workers around, and I could never have a housekeeper for this reason (until we lived in the condo in Belize and housekeepers came with our HOA -- he still didn't like their weekly visits, but I did!)

I think we just really burned out on all that is entailed in being a homeowner. Don't get me wrong; I love not sharing walls or floors with neighbors and the privacy of a house, but there are many tradeoffs. It's kind of a "been there, done that, time for another phase of life" now for us. We are so enjoying having fewer possessions, only one car (but six bikes!) and being able to pick up and go wherever, whenever without being tied to a house and yard.

We love nature and woods and as a result, I can't ever say we'll never buy another home on acreage and make a wonderful place for ourselves (and work ourselves to death, as we have in the past), but I'm beginning to think we're past the ages to do that again, especially since we're no longer working and can finally travel the way we always wanted to.

[Crankin]

SheFly, your story had me laughing with coffee in my mouth. It's really not funny, though. You were lucky! Where in Vermont is the camp?
Emily, my DH is very handy and has done a lot of the electrical/plumbing work in th house, and other smaller jobs. He can fix anything. He remodeled 2 out of the 3.5 baths himself. But, we don't have the tolerance to live in half finished rooms for long periods of time, so the big remodel was contracted out. The kitchen/powder room was 6 wks. and the master bath was 4-5 weeks, with about 2 weeks in between the 2. Up until we lived here, our 2 houses in AZ were brand new, so no real work there, except yard work and painting. Our first house here was about 10 years old and we did a few minor things, like flooring and carpeting, changing cabinet hardware. We couldn't afford anything else. This house was also shoddily built, but it looked OK. The house we bought after that (where we lived before this one) was about a year old when we bought it, and was owned by a single guy who was never home. The neighbors threw a bag of fertilizer on the lawn, to give him a hint (Stepford neighborhood). DH spent tons of time on the landscaping/lawn, and then when we started cycling, we got a lawn service and he only did what he wanted to. We painted, got window shades, finished the basement (not ourselves), and had a rather elaborate screened porch (2 rooms) built, only 2 years before we moved. In retrospect, we've thought about what we would have to be doing if we had stayed there. We definitely would have done a kitchen remodel, though it would not have been as elaborate as this one. The windows were starting to rot, too. The house probably would have been paid off, but it's lost about 150K worth of value, maybe more, since we sold it at the peak in 2005. The house we have now, is estimated to be worth more than we bought it for; not that this matters... but generally people will pay more to live in this town, so I think it will be more helpful in the end, when we are ready to downsize. We've been talking about this more, as there's a lot of buzz in the press about 1) how people my age can't find townhomes in the suburbs, and 2) there's a housing boom in the greater Boston area. People are bidding hundreds of thousands of dollars over the asking prices of homes. My son, who has been in his house 1.5 years, has had 2 real estate agents stop by and ask if he would put his house up for sale! This is in an inner suburb, on a busy street, with no garage, up a steep hill!

[SheFly]

Funny now, but not then. I've learned to wear a hard hat on those types of projects now It's still a good story. And we still sit in that room and marvel at the fact that only our two pairs of hands touched anything in the room to build it (including heat and electric - DH is very handy).

Crankin'- the VT camp is near the Kingdom Trails, in Kirby. We are 8.5 miles on scenic dirt roads to East Burke. DH grew up in the area, and his family is all still there.

SheFly

[Crankin]

I love that area. Was there last winter. So sad the Kingdom trails are partly being closed to x country skiers for fat bikes...

[malkin]

Is it part of construction guy training to locate the most recent project completed and then wreck it?

New floor installed Monday.
Wrecked by Drywall guy on Wednesday.
It was fun while it lasted.

[lph]

And we still sit in that room and marvel at the fact that only our two pairs of hands touched anything in the room to build it.

That, actually, thrills me no end. But then, I push papers for a living, and my idea of a really fulfilling and meaningful weekend is chopping wood until my hands don't work any more.

Sorry about your demolition gang, malkin! I'm just waiting for the first person to trash our new flooring, as we tromp all over it in boots carrying heavy machinery.

[Irulan]

Is it part of construction guy training to locate the most recent project completed and then wreck it?

New floor installed Monday.
Wrecked by Drywall guy on Wednesday.
It was fun while it lasted.

Yikes, that sounds like a contractor scheduling error!

Dear so-and-so, please send a quality contractor who would like to work my way...

I'm still trying to find a contractor for our kitchen. We are NOT having the firm that did our large remodel back.

We've interviewed an design-build firm that I found from Angie's List and Houzz that seems absolutely top,drawer....but so is their bid. I totally get the" you get what you pay for" thing with going for a low bid, but this one is really high. I have no doubts it would be stunning, however.

Then there was the guy my friend recommended with the partner who made bigoted comments during the interview. That was only part of it. They are a partnership, but when we asked how they like to be paid, one guy says "fixed bid" and the other guy says "time and materials. We ask who their suppliers are and get two different answers. I said I wanted to do the kitchen in the spring, and the bigot says, "that's when we like to do outside work" Hello- who is the customer here? We toured my friends home where they have been working and sure, the one IS meticulous, and the other guy made some really rookie tile mistakes. I'm still debating whether to put this whole experience on Angie's List or not.

I've interviewed two other firms I've found on Angie's list. One of them does a lot of work in a nicer neighborhood near me. When I drive though the neighborhood, I can see two or three jobs in progress at any given time, consistently over the last few years. That should be a good sign, right? Well, it's been several weeks and neither firm has gotten back to me with a bid or referrals to call.

Next up: I have a list that I got from the cabinet firm that did my friends house. We had gotten a cabinet bid from him when we were interviewing the partnership guys. He does beautiful work. I flat out told him that we were not going to use those guys and asked if he had any referrals. He's been around a long time, and has a big enough shop that he works with a lot of folks. So I am working my way down that list.
I'm really glad I started this process 10 months ahead of the anticipated start.

DH is very on board with this and whatever I want to do. He is driving me nuts by wanting me to select the counter, cabinet door and tile now, before I even have a contractor! I have a pretty good idea of what I want, but no specifics and I think going for specifics at this point is ridiculous as who knows which supplier we will be using. I will drag him down to Lowes and show him some stuff just to make him happy.

....and then there's the inordinate amount of time I'm spending on Houzz, lol...

Rant off.

[OakLeaf]

Heh ...

Dear contractor with whom we spoke, before we got bogged down with the bathroom remodeling before even getting started,

Two middle-of-the-night wrong-number drunk texts to my phone in two weeks makes me glad we didn't go ahead with the project. But it makes me understand why you're so hard-up for business that you apparently still have my number in your phone after all this time.

[Irulan]

Update: I told DH that we were off to Lowe's today to "preselect" door finish/counter color range as per his wishes. After looking at a few things, he said the magic words: " you are right". Now he agrees that it's too early to make these decisions. I knew that.

[snapdragen]

Update: I told DH that we were off to Lowe's today to "preselect" door finish/counter color range as per his wishes. After looking at a few things, he said the magic words: " [I]you are right[/I]". Now he agrees that it's too early to make these decisions. I knew that.

*And the heavens opened up and angels sang*

[Irulan]

*And the heavens opened up and angels sang*

I didn't say a word. :-)