Osama Bin Laden: dead

[Irulan]

Really? That quick you thought about not having a shrine to him? Way faster than me, I guess. It took me about 10 minutes in my own thoughts to come up with that scenario. Still, I don't see why we afforded him that kind of honor.

Nowhere have I read that he was "Buried at sea with honor". More likely, dumped in the ocean. Where does is it written that if someone is buried at sea that it automatically infers a burial with honor...???

The not leaving a place for a shrine thing is a really big deal. DH and I were discussing that when the news first broke. I did read that the body was prepared according to religious guidelines, no need to fan the flames by disregarding that part of it.

[snapdragen]

From ABC:Officials said that, in accordance with Muslim law, bin Laden's burial at sea was conducted by a Muslim seaman, who recited the prayers and ensured that the body was washed and wrapped appropriately in cloth.

[Irulan]

from the Lede Blog

Following the firefight, the noncombatants were moved to a safe location as the damaged helicopter was detonated. The team departed the scene via helicopter to the U.S.S. Carl Vinson in the north Arabian Sea. Aboard the U.S.S. Carl Vinson, the burial of Bin Laden was done in accordance with Islamic precepts and practices. The deceased's body was washed and then placed in a white sheet. The body was placed in a weighted bag. A military officer read prepared religious remarks, which were translated into Arabic by a native speaker. After the words were complete, the body was placed on prepared flat board, tipped up, and the deceased body eased into the sea.

[Xrayted]

Nowhere have I read that he was "Buried at sea with honor". More likely, dumped in the ocean. Where does is it written that if someone is buried at sea that it automatically infers a burial with honor...???

The not leaving a place for a shrine thing is a really big deal. DH and I were discussing that when the news first broke. I did read that the body was prepared according to religious guidelines, no need to fan the flames by disregarding that part of it.

Actually, it's written in the Naval Military Funerals Book... NORMALLY, you can't be buried at sea off of one of our Naval Vessels unless you are in this list. Period.

AT SEA DISPOSITION
ART. 2-1. Eligibility. The regulations for the disposition of remains and inurned cremated remains (cremains) from a naval vessel, or inurned cremains
from a naval aircraft are set forth by the Bureau of Medicine and Surgery.
The following persons are eligible for at sea disposition:
1. Members of the uniformed services.
2. Retired members of the uniformed services.
3. Former members of the uniformed services honorably discharged.
4. U.S. Civilian Marine Personnel of the Military Sealift Command.
5. Dependents of members and dependents of former members of the uniformed services.
6. Other U.S. citizens who are determined eligible by notable service or outstanding contributions to the United States.



Since it seems I have to spell it out... he deserved no washing, no prayers in his native language, no 72 virgins, nothing. He got what an honored American would have gotten for a sea burial, all except (I assume) the salute, symbolic firing of rifles and the US flag draped over him until slid overboard. He most likely would have been put on the same board as an honored American (I'm assuming here that they didn't take the time to whittle a new one just for him), feet end hanging off the edge, tipped up and slid into the sea. Usually 3 bearers on each side securing the body while at rest and in motion. He got much better than he deserved and more than most Americans could have, even if they fill out the 3 million forms necessary. In triplicate, single spaced. That, ladies and gentleman, was an honor he didn't deserve. Getting shot quickly in the head, not part by part, lingering in his pain and fear over days and weeks... our troops showed him mercy. He didn't deserve it, not one iota. But he got it. I'm happy he's dead.

I still remember that morning in PA, waking up to the news broadcast showing the planes hitting the towers, the Pentagon and then finding out just 150 miles away in my state, flight 93 crashed. I remember knowing that family members were supposed to be in the towers that morning, up on the top, having a breakfast meeting for business. Their 2 year old daughter, back with my SIL, quietly playing. We wrung our hands all day, trying to get word of whether or not they were still alive, wondering how in the world we were ever going to be able to explain to that beautiful little girl what happened to her parents. Luckily, they ended up delaying the meeting with the airline reps until lunch and had not stepped foot in the towers that day. I remember smelling the slightly ashy, burnt air for days after as it floated down the east coast to our area. It's been imprinted, like a bad tattoo. I know that area flight 93 went down in. I had visited there as a teen and adult. I know that of those few brave men that banded together, stood up and risked it all on that plane, one of them was, in this country, considered a 2nd class citizen because he was gay. None of them got a proper burial, not religious nor clean. I remember praying for all those who were directly affected and sending care packages to my fellow EMT's, Medics and firefighters. Wanting to be able to help more directly but unable to. I believe bin Laden's "tidy" death and burial was an honor he didn't deserve. Plain and simple. For us to do that, to bestow any compassion or kindness upon him after what he did, shows how incredible our country and our benevolent way of life truly is. That doesn't mean I have to always like it.


Meanwhile back on the ranch, people danced in the streets and had a party or two. The dichotomy was deafening.

[Mr. Bloom]

I'm not disputing your perspective xray, but "everything is permissible, not everything is constructive".

It's sometimes better to do something that is nice but not necessary than it is to just do what's necessary.

[NbyNW]

Yeah, the partying in the streets was a bit odd. But that public expression of emotion does not necessarily reflect the feelings of all Americans. My guess is that plenty of people have NOT felt like celebrating, since this does not bring their loved ones back. For me personally it was a moment to reflect on the last 10 years and what may be ahead. Because only time will tell if this changes anything.

Oh and X, regardless of what our military did with bin Laden's body, I'm pretty sure he's going to a special place in hell and there will be no virgins to greet him.

[Irulan]

While I'm sure a lot of folks think that putting the body in a Hefty bag and tossing it over the side might be appropriate, it would also potentially incite a continuation or rise in more anti US sentiment.

[PamNY]

I sometimes find irreverent humor helpful -- anyone similarly inclined might enjoy what The Onion has to say on this topic.

[Crankin]

I guess I can put myself in the irreverent category. That was hysterical.

[zoom-zoom]

I sometimes find irreverent humor helpful -- anyone similarly inclined might enjoy what The Onion has to say on this topic.

*giggles* That was pretty awesome!

[Trek420]

I know that area flight 93 went down in. I had visited there as a teen and adult. I know that of those few brave men that banded together, stood up and risked it all on that plane, one of them was, in this country, considered a 2nd class citizen because he was gay. None of them got a proper burial, not religious nor clean.

But they do have a memorial in the Bay Area where many of the passengers were headed that day or from.

RIP passengers and crew of Flight 93.

http://www.flight93memorialsfb.com/