Osama Bin Laden: dead

[Xrayted]

Just so you don't keep picking at this one for the rest of the thread... Kit never said she didn't believe he was dead or the account of it. She just poked you to question it a bit for yourself. It is fishy. When you first heard how it all went down, didn't you just sit there for a moment and say to yourself... "What?" Never stop doing that on issues as important as this. We tend to wander off to the next story or angle too quickly...

[ny biker]

When you first heard how it all went down, didn't you just sit there for a moment and say to yourself... "What?"

Nope. I thought: "Shot in the head? Good." And "Buried at sea? Good, no grave to turn into a shrine."

[Xrayted]

Really? That quick you thought about not having a shrine to him? Way faster than me, I guess. It took me about 10 minutes in my own thoughts to come up with that scenario. Still, I don't see why we afforded him that kind of honor.

[NbyNW]

When you first heard how it all went down, didn't you just sit there for a moment and say to yourself... "What?" Never stop doing that on issues as important as this. We tend to wander off to the next story or angle too quickly...

Of course. I totally agree with you that a healthy dose of skepticism is always important. But there's a healthy dose vs. an over-dose, and I don't mean you or Kitsune because I think you've both done a great job of putting your comments in context.

There are people who will doubt no matter what evidence you put in front of them, and there will always be conspiracy theories.

I'm just of the opinion that terrorists really don't care to give us the time or space to verify for ourselves something that they probably already know. We're all free to believe what we want and trust who we will. OBL's followers are already moving on to figure out the next way that they can hurt us.

[Irulan]

Oh, and even if the government were to release photos, copies of DNA tests, there would probably still be people who would claim it was fake. You just can't win sometimes.

...and creating new conspiracy theories about all of it. I think I'll go get my tin foil hat now.

[Xrayted]

Now the WH press secretary guy just came on and gave a more detailed description of what happened at the compound.

He wasn't armed??

[Xrayted]

Tin foil undies would be good too.

[nscrbug]

JMO...but who cares if he was unarmed or standing there with guns a blazing??? The man was evil to the core and I don't think for one second that our military had any intentions of taking him out of there alive.

[Trek420]

Tin foil undies would be good too.

Nah, you're supposed to line the floor of your trailer with tin foil so nobody can tap your phone line.

[NbyNW]

Really? That quick you thought about not having a shrine to him? Way faster than me, I guess. It took me about 10 minutes in my own thoughts to come up with that scenario. Still, I don't see why we afforded him that kind of honor.

I wouldn't call it an honor. An honor would be giving his body over to his family (if they even want him) or followers and a cleric of his choosing. I think the burial at sea was more like taking the high road or not crossing a line. Because too many lines have been crossed by both sides already. And not throwing more fuel on an already out of control fire.

Oh, and here's a more-eloquent-than-mine piece on why not to release the photos.

[Kitsune06]

Oh, no, I'm sure we probably did get him, I mean if the RIAA can find people illegally downloading music all over the country and Corbin Fisher can seek out teens illegally downloading gay pr0n, then I would hope that in ten years we can find a man in a desert with 2 million troops deployed. I'm just saying it's odd that we didn't really gloat in it. We didn't take him and keep him in some dark little hole like Guantanimo and just say he died on-site. We didn't take him into custody and interrogate him until we knew everything about Al-Quaida's workings and then snuff him. We didn't parade him around. That's almost unAmerican for a country and culture that thrives on sensationalism and media fervor. You can spin our reasons for it however you want to. Even a broken clock is right twice a day, and if you work hard enough to find a good reason not to have some kind of evidence, you will probably find or create one.

I'm just saying that if someone told you something that seemed off, would you believe it without thinking, or would you want some form of proof to put it in context? Anything with this much meaning, symbolism and potential concequence deserves to be ruminated on instead of taken at face value.

I'm not going off on how the government collected kids' baby teeth to test for strontium-90 post nuclear testing, or how we tested the effects of radiation on pregnant women, or how downwinders in Utah and Nevada are still suffering from the effects of nuclear fallout even though the US government said it was completely safe. Yes there is a specific theme to those, these are studies we've learned about in our radiation biology class, but there are many other tests on US civillians that the government has not told us about. Forgive my relative paranoia, but after reading these, it's hard not to feel that way.

I am just saying that we need to be aware that we are not always told the truth in this world, and the important things are worth questioning. Or not. Feel free.

[Mr. Bloom]

Nope. I thought: "Shot in the head? Good." And "Buried at sea? Good, no grave to turn into a shrine."

+1. Neat, tidy, done!

[Irulan]

Really? That quick you thought about not having a shrine to him? Way faster than me, I guess. It took me about 10 minutes in my own thoughts to come up with that scenario. Still, I don't see why we afforded him that kind of honor.

Nowhere have I read that he was "Buried at sea with honor". More likely, dumped in the ocean. Where does is it written that if someone is buried at sea that it automatically infers a burial with honor...???

The not leaving a place for a shrine thing is a really big deal. DH and I were discussing that when the news first broke. I did read that the body was prepared according to religious guidelines, no need to fan the flames by disregarding that part of it.

[snapdragen]

From ABC:Officials said that, in accordance with Muslim law, bin Laden's burial at sea was conducted by a Muslim seaman, who recited the prayers and ensured that the body was washed and wrapped appropriately in cloth.

[Irulan]

from the Lede Blog

Following the firefight, the noncombatants were moved to a safe location as the damaged helicopter was detonated. The team departed the scene via helicopter to the U.S.S. Carl Vinson in the north Arabian Sea. Aboard the U.S.S. Carl Vinson, the burial of Bin Laden was done in accordance with Islamic precepts and practices. The deceased's body was washed and then placed in a white sheet. The body was placed in a weighted bag. A military officer read prepared religious remarks, which were translated into Arabic by a native speaker. After the words were complete, the body was placed on prepared flat board, tipped up, and the deceased body eased into the sea.