Dog owners: do any of you feed raw?

[roadie gal]

I admire people who can do the raw diet, but it just isn't feasible for me. I feed the dogs and the cats the best kibble I can, that they will tolerate. Right now they're all getting Innova EVO.

I belong to a dog forum where this is an endless discussion.

[Biciclista]

I belong to a dog forum where this is an endless discussion.

ha, i'll bet.

I have two big concerns with dry food.
1/ is that it is based on carbs; wheat, rice, corn. For dogs, this is less of a problem than cats, because it is known that dogs don't need 100% meat.

2/ eating such dry food is really unnatural, in the wild, dogs and cats are eating animals, whose bodies contain a very high percentage of liquid. Your pet will eat its dry food until it is full and then drink some water. But is it really enough water to reconstitute the food, or are they fighting dehydration constantly? I think this part can be helped by wetting the food. The pet will get used to that.
I also don't believe in leaving food out all day for them, but that's another subject. Good luck.

[roadie gal]

ha, i'll bet.

I have two big concerns with dry food.
1/ is that it is based on carbs; wheat, rice, corn. For dogs, this is less of a problem than cats, because it is known that dogs don't need 100% meat.

2/ eating such dry food is really unnatural, in the wild, dogs and cats are eating animals, whose bodies contain a very high percentage of liquid. Your pet will eat its dry food until it is full and then drink some water. But is it really enough water to reconstitute the food, or are they fighting dehydration constantly? I think this part can be helped by wetting the food. The pet will get used to that.
I also don't believe in leaving food out all day for them, but that's another subject. Good luck.

You can find grainless foods (like the one I feed).

I believe that dehydration is more of a problem with cats than dogs. Dogs do have a thirst mechanism that makes them drink. Cats don't. They're "designed" to get most of their water from their food rather than drinking. A lot of folks make an argument that cats fed kibble are chronically dehydrated. I'm struggling with the best thing to do for my cats because of this. I like free feeding, but I don't want wet stuff that can go bad sitting out.

[ccnyc]

I've been feeding my two cats a homemade raw diet for 9 years. They both have beautiful coats and muscles and they love their food. I grind whole chicken and Cornish Game hen with liver, heart and gizzards and also grind beef and lamb and add calcium to make sure it's balanced nutritionally. I add additional supplements also. It takes me only a few hours from start to finish to make a big batch of food which I freeze in small containers. Then it's as easy as feeding canned food. I make food about once a month.

You can get very high quality raw food (ground whole prey and parts) from a place called Hare Today.
http://www.hare-today.com/

Carol

[TsPoet]

My dogs get dry for breakfast and 25:75 dry:raw for dinner. I started this diet when my little guy was 7 years old. His fur returned to puppy fur right away, and he lost ~1 lb (from 21 to 20, so that's significant). He also returned to being more energetic and bouncy. He was beginning to act really old. This change in an old dog to a middle-aged dog is really extreme. We even started agility at the old age of 8, and he's doing great. He could not have done agility prior to the raw food, he was too old and slow moving.
My Shiba-x also has almost normal fur, instead of the typical shiba wiry stuff. She was 1.5 when I started her on raw food, so haven't noticed any health differences in her. They've been on this diet for 1.5 years now.
Their stools were unpleasant to clean up for about a month, now cleanup is better than it's ever been.
I feed them this
http://www.columbiarivernaturalpetfoods.com/
I really like that I have a somewhat local brand to get. At first I got meat only, because I was under the impression that dogs couldn't absorb veggies. After doing research on it, they now get chicken/veggies or turkey/veggies (I'm cheap and the others are more expensive.

The other thing to note is it's gross - the chicken and turkey are the least gross (fatty). Also, at first I lightly microwaved the meat - for me. Now I just grab a handful of the stuff and plop it in the bowl, no qualms. The dogs love it.

[Norse]

After a scary bout with liver failure, our dog was switched to an all-natural diet (not raw though) and is doing wonderfully. Our two cats currently get the best canned food we can find, plus one gets low protein food sold by vets due to past liver problems. Seeing the marvelous results in our dog though, I would like to switch the cats to a natural foods diet.

Questions: Those of you grinding your own food, do you include the skin and bones? Did you buy a standard meat grinder for the task? Do you include any veggies or starch (like cooked rice) or just the meat? What supplements do you give? With raw meat, are you concerned about salmonella, e-coli and othe nasty things?

[Biciclista]

yes, i include chicken skin and bones. The only supplement I add is salmon oil. oh, and egg yolks. one yolk for every pound or so of meat..
I bought a dandy little grinder that goes right through chicken bones.

http://www.irawoods.com/Maverick-MM-5501-Meat-Grinder

[Norse]

Thanks Mimi. You mentioned that you also give them some dry food mixed with water. Is the dry food addition out of concern that they might be missing some nutrients otherwise? Also, do you cook the yokes?

[sundial]

The question about the benefits of raw feeding does indeed spark heated debates. I have friend that feed their dogs the BARF diet and swear by it. I once fostered a dog that was on a raw diet.

Although dogs are not prone to some health issues eating raw, people are and even though I have fed them out in the backyard, in my opinion it sets up the potential for problems like E coli.

Personally, I have fed my dogs home cooked foods and saw similar benefits--reduction in skin problems, a shiny coat, less tartar, and increase of energy. I think the preservatives and less than quality ingredients in some dry kibble seems to increase some health problems. I also believe it's not a coincidence that cancer is increasing in dogs due to the fact that kibble contains byproducts of poultry and cattle which are fed questionable feed.

This is just my personal observation and every owner will have to consider the pros and cons of raw feeding.

[eclectic]

Tulip

I just perused the thread very quickly so if your question was answered I missed it.

re poultry bones

I am by no means an expert and this may be folklore passed on generation to generation but I was always told not to give poultry bones to dogs because they splinter and can get caught too easily in their throat and digestive track.

BUT on the other hand when my dog is a bored, naughty, mad at us, for leaving her too long girl and gets into the trash - she has been known to eat poultry bones and has been no worse for wear because of it. I just don't intentionally give them to her. She is a large midsize dog

Someone mentioned earlier that they grind them - I would think that would take care of all the problems

Onto the other discussion Raw vs dry

IMHO I think raw would be more natural and better. I would think if they were started on that since being a puppy they wouldn't have trouble - I think switching them over would be more difficult

I on the other hand feed my dog very inexpensive dry (OK I am a bad mom )
She has eaten the same dog food since we got her in the middle of her puppy stage. She is now 12 going on 13. She had cancer when she was 7 but after having surgery she has been cancer free for over 5 years. She is just now starting to get cataracts. We thought she was going deaf but have since learned she has very selective hearing.

She is an "over the fence" breed

All our purebreds never lived past 11 - definately something to be said for mutts!

[Norse]

Having not tried raw yet, other than giving the cats an occasional few pieces of raw fish or chicken, I can't speak for it but I am curious. However, I have observed that our 8 year old dog has never looked better since switching her to a home-cooked diet. For treats, she gets raw carrots. To satisfy her urge to chew, she has big nylabone.

[ccnyc]

Questions: Those of you grinding your own food, do you include the skin and bones? Did you buy a standard meat grinder for the task? Do you include any veggies or starch (like cooked rice) or just the meat? What supplements do you give? With raw meat, are you concerned about salmonella, e-coli and othe nasty things?

When I grind chicken or cornish game hen I grind it all - skin, bones, organs, neck. It is nutritionally balanced re calcium phosphorus ratio. Meat from large animals with bones too hard to grind like beef and lamb need to have calcium added to balance the high phosphorus in the meat.

I have a Maverick grinder like Mimi, although mine is 9 years old. It's a great grinder. You can't just use any grinder. Some of the more powerful ones don't grind bones very well.
This is supposed to be a very good grinder also.
http://www.onestopjerkyshop.com/prod...products_id=47

I don't include any starch/grain because cats don't have any need for them. (I've read that dogs can utilize nutrients from grain.) I include a small amount of veggie as a fiber source.

In the 9 years I've been preparing the raw diet I've never had any problems with the cats, or myself, getting sick from the raw food.

If anyone wants further info on raw diets for cats http://holisticat.com/ is a great resource. So is their forum.

Carol

[Biciclista]

I've been feeding my two cats a homemade raw diet for 9 years. They both have beautiful coats and muscles and they love their food. I grind whole chicken and Cornish Game hen with liver, heart and gizzards and also grind beef and lamb and add calcium to make sure it's balanced nutritionally. I add additional supplements also. It takes me only a few hours from start to finish to make a big batch of food which I freeze in small containers. Then it's as easy as feeding canned food. I make food about once a month.

You can get very high quality raw food (ground whole prey and parts) from a place called Hare Today.
http://www.hare-today.com/

Carol

oh, wow, they sell rabbit! (and ergh, ground mice!)

[Kalidurga]

I've been feeding my two cats a homemade raw diet for 9 years.

Carol, your cats (in your avatar) are gorgeous. They remind me of my Ivan.

I'd love to do raw food for my cats but, like roadie gal, it's just not feasible with my schedule. So they get wet food twice a day, with a very small amount of kibble left out in between. I recently found a new kibble from Spot's Stew that apparently has no meals and the only grain is oatmeal. The cats wouldn't touch the Spot's Stew canned food, but the kibble smells like something I'd like to eat and Olive and Ivan love it.

[ccnyc]

Carol, your cats (in your avatar) are gorgeous. They remind me of my Ivan.

Thank you. I think they are very handsome. Must be the raw diet.