How much do looks define your self-image?

[OakLeaf]

Hair is funny because it can change so radically so quickly. Even though it will grow back out (for most people), there's no hiding it for those weeks or months until it does. You don't get wrinkles, gain weight, get b00bsag, whatever, in 30 minutes without any ability to process the change emotionally, but your hair affects your appearance just as much as those things.

I've definitely had haircuts that have left me in tears, and pretty recently too. Granted a large part of it was tears of frustation with I think six consecutive stylists in my new town who gave me truly horrible haircuts.

Losing a chunk of my breast - even the relatively small chunk of a biopsy - has definitely affected me emotionally. Although of course it's hard to say how much of that is just the appearance (definitely some) and how much seeing it triggers all the emotions that went with it.

I think it's only natural. Look at the displays that animals go through to change their appearance, both voluntary things like puffing out fur, spreading a cobra's hood, etc.; semi-voluntary things like when an animal pumps blood to an area to change its color; and involuntary things like seasonal variations in plumage. Putting on a suit to go to court used to feel like donning a suit of armor (and if you know any mediaeval or classical literature, traditionally there are extended arming scenes where the hero puts on his armor, but also metaphorically and emotionally prepares himself for the conflict).

All anyone has to do is ask yourself whether you'd wear the same clothes to clean toilets and to go to a charity ball, and you have your answer as to how much appearance matters. You can't say that clothes matter but the body underneath doesn't. We don't have to like it, but I think we do have to acknowledge it.

[Miranda]

Hair is funny because it can change so radically so quickly. Even though it will grow back out (for most people), there's no hiding it for those weeks or months until it does. You don't get wrinkles, gain weight, get b00bsag, whatever, in 30 minutes without any ability to process the change emotionally, but your hair affects your appearance just as much as those things.

I've definitely had haircuts that have left me in tears, and pretty recently too. Granted a large part of it was tears of frustation with I think six consecutive stylists in my new town who gave me truly horrible haircuts.

I am still thinking about my overall response to this thread. Good one, lph.

However, Oakleaf...

I am a natural redhead. If you ask Mr. Google, only 1-2% of human world population is born that way. All my life, it has been the one thing I consider to be a uniqueness that makes me... "me".

Well, short of the story, major disaster with the hairdresser and finding a good new one is a freakin nightmare. Here's a tip someone gave to me, that I recently just applied...

The next time you are out and see some woman with beautiful hair you lust after etc., go talk to her. Pay her the compliment of her beautiful hair, and then ask who is her stylist. IME the woman will be flattered, and happy to tell you where to go find the stylist.

When you find this person, do not make the first meeting the actual hair cut appointment. Call ahead and/or stop by to meet the person. Some do a consult appointment. Get their opinion, and get a vibe of how the two of you gel together... and/or look at her client that might be there at the time. IF all that feels "ok", then proceed with a basic trim appointment. If you feel good about that, then do the next one to something else if desired.

Signed,
Miranda
Neurotic Vain Hair Person

[Bruno28]

Alternatively - wait until your hair is such a disaster area that you are forced to walk into the nearest hairdresser and ask for 'something short and easy to manage'

Realise that even the worst haircut will grow out in a matter of a couple of weeks.

Bruno - who's really not that comfortable with people invading her personal space.

Imagine my reaction to my friend's suggestion we have a pre-wedding spa day. (Her response - 'I sense your buttocks are clenching')

[OakLeaf]

walk into the nearest hairdresser and ask for 'something short and easy to manage'

Uh-uh. My hair is short and spectacularly easy to manage. I had no idea how much skill it takes to cut it until I learned the hard way!

Thanks, Miranda - part of that equation is also making sure the person you ask has hair like yours, too - thick or thin, coarse or fine, whether the cut is traditional or contemporary, etc. I did that once but unfortunately her stylist wasn't taking any new clients.

I've finally found someone who does a pretty good job with my hair and I'm sticking with him... even though his salon is dirty, he smells like cigarette smoke and he's constantly complaining about his son's mother, politics, or something. It's totally worth it to tolerate the nasty environment once every three or four weeks, to get a decent haircut.

[redrhodie]

That thread got me thinking, too. Society may not think I'm as hot as I was at 20, but I FEEL hotter now. If given the choice, I would not go back to my younger self. I feel stronger than ever, and I think I look better than ever, too.

So, I guess I am still defined by my self image, but that image is finally something I like, not something I want to change. Who would have thought, that the girl who hated her appearance for so many years, would finally be able to feel this way! Yay for getting older!

[short cut sally]

Well said Mr. Silver...

I did feel better about myself say about 3 years ago, when I just lost 40#'s, and could fit into those "skinny jeans" -ok, my version of skinny jeans. I've gained some weight back, but I am still considering myself in better shape now than what I was in high school. I played sports too in school. I am presently 42.

[eclectic]

That thread got me thinking, too. Society may not think I'm as hot as I was at 20, but I FEEL hotter now. If given the choice, I would not go back to my younger self. I feel stronger than ever, and I think I look better than ever, too.

So, I guess I am still defined by my self image, but that image is finally something I like, not something I want to change. Who would have thought, that the girl who hated her appearance for so many years, would finally be able to feel this way! Yay for getting older!

Yeah redrhodie! ! ! !

Since I turned 50 I do feel waaaaay better about myself. I look in the mirror and think - you look pretty darn good for 52!

I do dye my hair, when I was younger I said I never would, but it faded to a very unattractive mousey gray that isn't pretty on anyone and I felt dragged me down.
I let my hair grow just for convenience - it is has a lot of natural curl (think poodle when it is short) so wearing it long and being able to ponytail or french braid it is much simpler

I am trying to lose weight partially for looks but a lot more so I can ride up hills faster and run faster.

And, Yes, I do have to admit it feels good to look "HOT" once in awhile. I am single and it is an ego boost to get "hit on" by guys in their 30's. And no . . . it wasn't that dark in there

But at the end of the day it isn't how hot you look - as Mr Silver said - it is what your personality is - a lot of "hot" people get pretty ugly after you get to know them.

Here is a story on how much value a lot of people put on looks.
True BTW the poor ex-husband works w/ a friend of mine

When they filed for divorce she put in the decree that he was to pay for her to get breast implants because in her words "she had to be on the market again and needed to look her best" (I guess she didn't care if they knew what color her eyes were)

Unbelievingly the judge upheld the request the only thing he changed was she pay for 1/2 and the ex-husband pay for 1/2.

Unbeknownst to her she is being snickered about a lot behind her back that she is that shallow and he was smart to be rid of her.
BUT she does get a lot of dates.

I, on the other hand, am now happy to be a B - they don't sag, I can run w/o a bra, and they don't define who I am as a woman AND I can button up all my shirts, and the mammogram only takes 2 shots per side . . . need I go on?

[Aggie_Ama]

I do know a lot of women who feel much better about themselves after getting implants, which I think is a perfectly fine reason to get plastic surgery. I knew someone who got a nose job, same thing. She didn't obsess over it or discuss it to the point of making us sick. She just did it and then told us once. It was the end of it. I just feel awkward and even annoyed somedays being complimented on something I didn't ask for that I find a bit trivial. And I do have a friend that I love dearly that is absolutely obssessed with wanting implants to the point that I think it is unhealthy. In the five years we have been friends my breasts and her lack of has been discussed more times than I really think is appropriate. I still cherish her friendship but I tell her about it. I also tell her if she does buy herself implants I don't think it will solve the true problem (but probably not in such a blunt way). She knows she has self-esteem issues.

Now when the only cousin (there are 5 kids) that didn't getting blue eyes goes on about my blue eyes, I laugh! And I do relish compliments on my blue eyes, they are just like my dad's. Probably why I wear make up every day, they have drawn compliments all my life. So I guess we all have the potential to be vain.

[beccaB]

My hair is turning silver and I think it is a bright vibrant color, and actually pretty. It makes my plain brown hair more interesting. But it amazes me how many people have noticed it and asked me if I will get it colored! I am NOT into that kind of maintenance!
If you want to experience what being superficial is, ride on a school bus and listen to pre-teens. I am shocked and appalled at their belief system and how easily they voice their opinions, however misguided.

[sfa]

Kinda just blathering here, so forgive me if I never get around to making a point.....

How I look does at least partially define my self image (maybe it's a redhead thing? When you go through your whole life with people pointing you out as "she's the redhead over there" it's hard NOT to see that as part of who you are!), but hot=looks doesn't enter into the equation. How I look is more like, um, I make sure I brush my teeth before leaving the house, and if I'm going to work and it's not a swimming day, then I'll put on makeup (but never eye makeup because I rub my eyes when I get stressed and who wants to look like a raccoon? I don't bother with makeup on swimming days because if I'm swimming at lunch, the makeup will all disappear anyway, so what's the point?). And I DO give thought to what I wear, but more so that what I wear fits the occasion--I'll wear khakis or jeans if I'm in an all-day training session, or suits if I have an outside meeting, or dress pants and sweaters on most other days (skirts and nice t-shirts in the summer). So I guess my looks are heavily influenced by practicality.

But I don't think that "hot" has really all that much to do with looks, but with how a person presents herself (or himself). If hot was about being skinny and young, then I was super-hot 20 years ago. Except I wasn't. I was awkward and often unsure of myself. I was confident in my intellectual abilities, but not my physical abilities or social skills, and that showed. I think "hot" happens when those three things align--self confidence in physical, intellectual and social abilities (even, I might add, in the absence of any particular SKILL in those areas--it's about self confidence).

Case in point is my SIL who is probably one of the most physically unattractive people I've ever met. She's short, has a kind of squishy face, is overweight, and isn't always the sharpest knife in the drawer. But she's hot, and not only does she think so, but so does her entourage of friends and boyfriends. She is supremely self confident in everything she does, and I think that is just really, really attractive. By the same measure, I'm a lot hotter now than I was 20 years ago because I'm just way more comfortable with who I am and I care a lot less about what other people might think about me or see in me.

I think that the media uses tight butts and big hair and perfect skin as shorthand for hot because it's just easier for them, the thinking being that someone who looks good must, by definition, feel good about herself and therefore is self confident. It's hard to show internal confidence in a magazine ad, so they use this shorthand. And then what happens is people who DON'T have this level of self confidence (i.e. me 20 years ago, and lots of young people, and unfortunately many older people who never got beyond this) mistake the shorthand for the substance and work to achieve what they see in the ads and not what the reality is.

I think, though, that we shouldn't condemn or pity people who work to achieve hotness, because I think there's a biological drive at work there--people want to be sexy to ensure the continuation of the species (although I doubt they'd put it that way!). We do also value a loving family, good career, supportive friends and satisfying life, but (again speaking biologically) these things are going to have higher value to someone who is older and not so concerned with procreating but rather with sustaining what was already created. Our lizard brains, in our teens and 20's, are far more concerned with just gettin' it on and popping out some babies to ensure the species survives, so I think it's somewhat natural that at that age looks are more highly valued.

Sarah

[shootingstar]

Not sure how I will feel when I truly turn grey. Right now, just still black hair at 50. Would like to think I wouldn't colour my hair. (All of my sisters ranging from 40-49 yrs. are like me. Black hair, no obvious greying. But mum turned grey fast in her late 40's..must be from having 6 children.)

It wasn't until the last 20-25 yrs. there are have been more Asian models/images of live real Asian women in North American (and European) fashion magazines, newspapers and on TV. Hot beauty really in the media is very much Western defined...very tall (to me) or at least very long slim legs, big boobs (not padded underwire ), etc.

Years ago, I used to be appalled to go into Chinatown and see padded bras on sale. But now you can go anywhere to any store to get the same type of bra in myriad of colours and materials.

I feel so sorry for women who want implants unless they have had a mascetomy. There are HUGE populations of women who are small boobed.

Do looks define my own self-image? Probably. At the very least, I did for awhile in my teens right into my late 20's, feel like the OTHER, meaning just not fitting into any Western /European beauty norm at all. It was normal for me to feel that way, when I lived in smaller cities that did not have noticeable % of Asians.

As for now, I guess looking healthy is very important to me after all. It is important that I stay active so I look alert, lively and can move easily. So this becomes a self-fulfilling prophesy.

[indysteel]

I think the average person wants to feel pretty or attractive on some level, but what that means probably differs from person to person. For some, they may be fixated on what society--or what they perceive society--sees as attractive. Others may see their attractiveness as a function of their fitness, energy, and overall health. Others may see it solely as something that you project from the inside. Still others may see it as a combination of all those things.

I will admit that I've been plagued at times with self-image problems. I've fixated, to greater on lesser degrees, on things that I perceive as being physically "wrong" with me. The best way that I can describe it is that there are days where my self image is extremely distorted. I've taken both healthy and unhealthy approaches to deal with these problems. It's taken me a long time to come to some degree of peace about it, and to be honest, I think it's something that I'll never entirely put to bed.

If you asked me on a good day whether my self esteem is based on my looks, I'd give an emphatic "no." But when I'm having an ugly day--and thankfully they don't happen all that often now--I feel like poo. For instance, I currently wear braces. I didn't have them as a kid, but I decided to get them as an adult to fix some functional and cosmetic issues that had long bothered me. Most days, I don't give them or my appearance with them much thought. On the days that my orthodontist wants to go over my progress by showing me all manner of unflattering pictures of both the inside and outside of my mouth, I just want to crawl under a rock. It usually takes me a day or two to rebound.

I'm not proud of this, necessarily, and to be honest, I don't usually talk about this stuff with anyone. I'd been in therapy for five years before I brought it up--and there was nothing else that I kept from her. So, at least for me, there's a lot of shame associated with these feelings.

I have to be VERY careful with this stuff when it comes to my boyfriend. While he's very complimentary, I don't want to rely on what he says or think too much, or at all. While I appreciate his compliments, the "solution" to these issues doesn't lie with affirmation from other people. It is up to me--and only me--to change my own thinking about myself.

Wow; I must really trust you ladies (and Mr. Silver ) to have just shared all that.......