Insulting compliments

[lph]

Road riding for exercise is heavily male-dominated here, and being lighter than most of these guys I tend to do well on hills (though I suck majorly on the flats). But when passing someone on a hill I never know if they're on their first or 5th lap, or if they've ridden 80 miles just to get here, or if it's the day after a race or whatever. So if anything I settle for a brief, friendly smile, or maybe an exasperated "d*mn I hate this hill!", or sometimes "did you know I've been chasing you for miles!" if the guy is cute and I'm up to it

[ny biker]

I think you only have to think about how it feels to be told "You look like you've been doing this for a while!" - to know that it's an insult to assume someone is a complete newbie.

Still, it does seem that at all levels and all types of cycling, there's a fairly strong snob factor. On the road, at least - I don't know for mountain biking, maybe the off-road crowd is different. Bicycle racing is like most forms of racing, just plain cut-throat, someone from another team won't say anything at all unless it's a subtle insult meant to psych you out. And whether you're a commuter, tourist, or participant in an organized ride, it's not unusual for another cyclist to sneer at you for SOMETHING, whether it's an article of clothing, a technique, your hair, whatever.

The contrast with running is pretty stark, to me, and that's what's interesting. As a new runner I'm like Catrin as a new rider - I'm not insulted if someone assumes I'm a new runner, because I AM one - but one of the things that's so cool to me about foot races (mid-pack and slower, anyway) is how encouraging everyone is. If you saved too much at the start so that you zoom by somebody late in the race, they DO cheer you on. And etiquette seems to be if you hang around at the finish, you're supposed to cheer for those finishing behind you.

So I guess my take is kind of mixed. I do think it's an unequivocal insult to assume someone is doing something for the first time. Even if it IS their first time, they don't need to be reminded how woefully unprepared they appear to everyone else. But I don't think it's an insult to tell someone they're doing well in a NON-competitive setting, even if the person saying it happens to be faster. (If they were THAT much faster, they wouldn't even be in the same neighborhood to be able to say it, for one thing. )

Um, first of all, in my experience it IS unusual for a cyclist to sneer at other cyclists, for any reason. And the DC metro area is not exactly known for it's warm fuzzy polite people.

And it wasn't clear to me that the person in the OP was assuming anything. And being a first-timer doesn't mean you look woefully unprepared. Really, I think people are reading way too much into other people's attempts to be friendly.

[GLC1968]

(If they were THAT much faster, they wouldn't even be in the same neighborhood to be able to say it, for one thing. )

Unless it's durring a triathlon where there are wave starts based on age. By the time you get to the run portion, there are super fast people who have only been out there an hour with super slow people who have already been competiting for almost 2 hours when they get passed!

I agree with LPH who pointed out that (unless it's a race), you have no idea what that other person has already ridden. I remember once when we first started riding we were training for a century. We were purposely riding mid-day to get heat aclimitized (nuts, I know!) and it was probably 102F as we were just finishing up an 85 mile ride and heading home. Both my H and I were totally dragging and we were pased by a slightly older group of men who didn't say much except "nice heat, huh?" as they passed us. They stopped at the gas station up ahead and we did too to get more fluids. We chatted a bit and when they learned that we were finishing up 85 miles in that heat, their regard for us completely changed. It was very noticeable.

Anyway, I never assume that just because someone is moving slowly that they are new or inexperienced. Hell, for all I know, they may be a Cat1 racer who may have just had surgery or something!

Doing something stupid or dangerous? THEN I assume newbie. And only then.

[ny biker]

Doing something stupid or dangerous? THEN I assume newbie. And only then.

Not in DC. Plenty of experienced riders do stupid and dangerous things around here.

[GLC1968]

Not in DC. Plenty of experienced riders do stupid and dangerous things around here.

So what? I don't care what someone's experience is - if they intentionally do something stupid or dangerous, they get no respect from me.

I'd be happy to 'insult' those people by assuming that they are newbies and making comments to that effect.

[ny biker]

So what? I don't care what someone's experience is - if they intentionally do something stupid or dangerous, they get no respect from me.

I'd be happy to 'insult' those people by assuming that they are newbies and making comments to that effect.

So now it's okay to intentionally insult people?

[tulip]

Really, I think people are reading way too much into other people's attempts to be friendly.

+1! I feel like saying, "Lighten up, people!" but that will probably offend someone.

[PamNY]

Um, first of all, in my experience it IS unusual for a cyclist to sneer at other cyclists, for any reason. And the DC metro area is not exactly known for it's warm fuzzy polite people. .

I agree -- my interactions with cyclists are usually great. And I'm in Manhattan.
Racing I know nothing about, but plain old bikers are the best.

As far as the OP's experience, honestly, I would have noticed it. But it could just be an awkward attempt to be friendly.

[GLC1968]

So now it's okay to intentionally insult people?

I'm not talking about intending to insult anyone. This thread is about UNintentionally insulting people, right? My comment was that there are certain people whom I don't really care if I accidentally insult them if I have a point to make.

If someone does something as a cyclist that is dangerous or stupid, it reflects on all of us. I don't care how much experience they have, if I have opportunity to say something about it, I will. I frankly don't care if what I say insults them, they need to be told. Sorry if that offends people, that's how I feel.

(this is why I put insult in quotes in my previous post - my intention wouldn't be to insult, it would be to inform)

[Zen]

So now it's okay to intentionally insult people?

Yes.
My go to insult is "you're ugly and your mother dresses you funny".
Or 'I know I am but what are you?"

[TxDoc]

Really, I think people are reading way too much into other people's attempts to be friendly.

I agree with you.
Most people just want to be nice, help, and make new friends - so how about sometimes we lighten up, smile, and appreciate a kind gesture?

[BikeDutchess]

Really, I think people are reading way too much into other people's attempts to be friendly.

+3! And some have honestly admitted that it may be more a reflection of their own insecurities or sensitivities than other people's intentions.

[Crankin]

And I am glad to see there are others who are just as sensitive as me about this stuff.
On the other hand, there's a lot of stuff that doesn't bother me at all, compared to most people.

[ny biker]

I'm not talking about intending to insult anyone. This thread is about UNintentionally insulting people, right? My comment was that there are certain people whom I don't really care if I accidentally insult them if I have a point to make.

If someone does something as a cyclist that is dangerous or stupid, it reflects on all of us. I don't care how much experience they have, if I have opportunity to say something about it, I will. I frankly don't care if what I say insults them, they need to be told. Sorry if that offends people, that's how I feel.

(this is why I put insult in quotes in my previous post - my intention wouldn't be to insult, it would be to inform)

I'm sorry but just because you see someone do something stupid, you can't assume intent or lack of knowledge -- they might have done something thoughtlessly or made a split-second decision and then realized that they made a mistake. This happens to me from time to time and I do my best to learn from it. It's ironic that you don't want me to make assumptions based on what I see when I look at you, but you think it's okay for you to make assumptions based on what you see when you look at someone else.

And I think I will never ever talk to strangers on a bike ride again because no matter how friendly I genuinely am trying to be, I apparently need to assume that the person will think my intent was to insult them.

[tulip]

To the OP and others who find such comments as in the original post offensive, perhaps this will help. It has helped me--I used to get really insecure at people's comments or actions, thinking the world--and everyone's else's world--revolved around me for better AND for worse. I finally got over that and realized that mostly people just don't notice the things I notice about myself.

You CANNOT control what other people think, do, or say. You CAN control your reaction to them. You have the choice to let the comment get to you, or you can Let. It. Go.

The choice is yours.