Yeah - I thought the post that started the chaos was way out of line. If she's really that fast, why doesn't she race? I'd like to see some posted speeds/times. Regardless, nothing good can come of saying that everyone slower than her sucks. You're right - you could easily say similar things to many here about distance. But - you wouldn't even think it! I don't even know how fast I can really go. I've never tested myself. I just ride at the pace that feels right at the time. Sometimes I'll try to see what I can get up to, but by the time I run out gears with the middle ring, I have a stop sign coming up and I have to slow down anyway. It seems like killing yourself on every ride just to say that you are fast is pointless. I like your philosophy about group rides. I've never done one (no groups around here), but I would place myself the same as you. This is supposed to be fun. I really hope the discussion doesn't discourage people.