Hogging the road

[XMcShiftersonX]

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

haha... this made me laugh... because really, this poor woman has no idea that so many people have been debating what she should or should not be doing on the internet for days! So silly!

[Cataboo]

What a great description -- mind if I borrow it?

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

That's what I want to know.

I think we need video of this woman coming down the hill and pictures of the road. And maybe her gps tracks so we can see how slowly she comes down the hill.

What exactly do they mean by riding the brakes? I've ridden with someone from TE who literally does not gain any momentum going down a hill because her brakes are squeaking all the way down (on a road bike no less). I'd hate to be in a car behind her. I hate being on a bike behind her.

I doubt op would want her to go into the turnouts if they're unpaved.

I just picture it sort of like a driveway or a cross street - if I have a car driving behind me and there is a driveway or a cross street, I just swing into the driveway or other street about 2 feet or so - just enough that they can safely pass, and then I pop back out. This of course depends on the situation.

Everyone keeps talking about unknown dangers that lurk in the turnouts for this woman (ruts? potholes? branches?) - which yes, those exist on hills you don't know well... But this woman is lapping the hill. I'm pretty sure she's had time to investigate whether or not the turnouts have unsafe obstacles and prepare an escape policy.... Obviously, a bunny or squirrel can still run across the road and those can't be predicted - but I wouldn't want a car riding its brakes behind me if that occurred.

[Biciclista]

all you have to do now is "map my ride" and find the hill!

[JennK13]

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

This was kind of my point previously - there are just some places we shouldn't ride. She can't stop or slow down, she can't pull to the side, sure, she has the "right" to take the lane, but it's only 1 1/2 cars wide; when there's a car coming up the road, what is she going to do if the road is so treacherous that she can't do anything but ride down the middle of it? Just doesn't sound like a safe place to ride, much less repeatedly. Yeah, I've been out riding around with no plan of where to go, just to ride, and get "lost" or turned around and maybe you end up some place like this on accident, but to do it over and over and over again?

[carinapir]

You got that from the OP's public profile? Not that you did anything wrong, but the availability of that type of information is exactly why our wonderful hosts at TE posted the thread listed below with respect to "best practices" for Internet safety.

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=31284

Yes, the OP's public TE profile. Now I feel uber-creepy but the info lead me straight there.

[indysteel]

Yes, the OP's public TE profile. Now I feel uber-creepy but the info lead me straight there.

I didn't mean to make you feel creepy. I just wanted to remind the OP--per TE's posted best practices--that having that information on her profile is perhaps not the smartest thing.

[oz rider]

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

She can see the oncoming car. She can't see the car behind (and most cycling fatalities, here at least, result from being hit from behind).

She can choose her own line past the oncoming car. She can't control the overtaking clearance the following car leaves her.

The road is 1.5 lanes wide so there is half a lane which the car won't be hogging. The oncoming driver will not be texting, talking on the phone or drunk and will be sharing the road, so its driver might even politely drop a wheel off the edge. After all it has an alphabet soup of safety devices to protect its occupants, while the other road user has nothing.

[XMcShiftersonX]

Whoa! That is super creepy... not that you were able to search a little bit and get that information... but that you guys actually care so much about this particular woman, and this particular hill. Just let people be. It really doesn't matter. I think this thread went too far two pages ago.

[featuretile]

This whole thing got way out of hand. I feel really attacked and like I should give up on this forum. Yes, all these comments made me feel very defensive and I would not put something up like this again.

Two people understood what I was saying - PamNY and JenK13.

I was surprised that I felt upset with a cyclist since I am one and I am super conscious and respectful of cyclists when I drive a car. I did not expect her to move over into a shoulder (full of debris or not) - there is no shoulder. On most of the road she needs to be in the middle. The pull outs are for cars and they are paved. She was riding a bike that had straight handlebars. The speedometer on my car read 15mph going down the hill behind her, so given the steepness, I assumed she was riding her brakes. I was not close enough to see her hands.

I certainly don't mind driving down a road after a fast cyclist. I don't need to be in front of a bike and I'm not worried about being 30 seconds late. I was worried about her safety. And yes, I was annoyed (my bad). There are blind corners and cars who will be ascending that won't see her. There have been times when a car going up and a car going down meet on a blind corner, and it's pretty close (there have been a few car to car accidents), so no one is driving that road faster than 25mph. I would not want to be in the middle on a bike in that situation. Why is it so incorrect for me to say what I would do?

As for people looking at my house, that's pretty weird.

[csr1210]

I understood where you were coming from. A lot of people had really great points about bike safety, and I'm a huge proponent of taking the lane, but in my opinion, the criticisms posted didn't really match what YOU described in your original post.

Anyway, I mostly lurk, but I wanted to say that I'm sorry you felt beat up and hope you don't give up on the forum!

-Christy

[Crankin]

Owlie, I pretty much hate descents, too, and I have been riding for 10 years.
Oak, I am the one you would hate to be behind on a ride. This is why I do very few group rides. The one group I ride with knows how I ride and gives me space. Since I pretty much drop all of them on the climbs, I lose no respect. Because as soon as I feel the momentum get going, I have the automatic urge to squeeze the brakes so I feel in control. Otherwise, I feel like my head is spinning off and who knows where the bike will end up. I won't belabor the point, as I have discussed this before. Yea, I have a problem with this. It doesn't matter if I am on a road bike or a hybrid, although the wider tires help a little (not much).
I would not ride on that road.

[OakLeaf]

Oak, I am the one you would hate to be behind on a ride.

Naw, on a ride I'd just pass you. I'd go into the left half of the road to do it, too, when it was clear. And I wouldn't try to hold you up on the climbs, promise.

I ride with several people who aren't confident descenders. All women, which is a little bit distressing. Honestly, as I've said before many times, it was riding a moto that taught me how to see when I'm on a bici at speed, and that made all the difference in the world.

I might hate to be behind your bike if I were in a car, but I'd deal with it, I promise.

Featuretile, I'm sorry if I said anything that made you feel attacked. I think it was the thread title more than anything that got people's dander up. In spite of the digs - which I do wish hadn't happened - I think we've had a good discussion about safety here.

[tulip]

Wow, what a discussion!

Here's what I got out of the original post that I haven't seen mentioned yet: Featuretile took the rider to be a snoot because she wasn't friendly at the mailbox. This may or may not be the case. Maybe she's shy. I often get considered a snoot, when really I'm just shy. Maybe she was a biatch, so what? Move on.

Because Featurelite took here to be a snoot, she wasn't too pleased to be stuck behind her on the road. If the rider was more outgoing and fun, would Featurelite be more patient with her on the road? I have no idea, but it would seem reasonable.

Two lessons:
1. be friendly; people will give you more of a break later on. Us shy people just have to deal with it. Biatchy people shouldn't be so biatchy.

2. Try not to get miffed at someone you don't know because they do not meet your expectations.

(all other discussion points are valid, on both sides, although I tend to think that being stuck behind a descending cyclist for a couple of miles is no big deal and the driver should give the cyclist plenty of room and take a deep breath)

Come back, Featuretile! I like you, even though I might not agree with you on this post. But you were there and we weren't so we got off on tangents. Many of us have been in terrible accidents and so feel the need to defend our right to ride unscathed. As jobob has attested, and some others too (myself included), helicopters and trauma centers are not really fun places to end up.

(pass the pound cake, please)

[Mr. Bloom]

Featuretile: I hope you didn't feel that I put you on the defensive and apologize if I did;don't give up on the forum you'll make good friends here, learn a lot...but with every 10 good experiences, there's an occasional challenging experience

[smilingcat]

I was surprised that I felt upset with a cyclist since I am one and I am super conscious and respectful of cyclists when I drive a car. I did not expect her to move over into a shoulder (full of debris or not) - there is no shoulder. On most of the road she needs to be in the middle. The pull outs are for cars and they are paved. She was riding a bike that had straight handlebars. The speedometer on my car read 15mph going down the hill behind her, so given the steepness, I assumed she was riding her brakes. I was not close enough to see her hands.

I certainly don't mind driving down a road after a fast cyclist. I don't need to be in front of a bike and I'm not worried about being 30 seconds late. I was worried about her safety. And yes, I was annoyed (my bad). There are blind corners and cars who will be ascending that won't see her. There have been times when a car going up and a car going down meet on a blind corner, and it's pretty close (there have been a few car to car accidents), so no one is driving that road faster than 25mph. I would not want to be in the middle on a bike in that situation. Why is it so incorrect for me to say what I would do?

As for people looking at my house, that's pretty weird.

I assumed too much when I posted my vitrolic remark. And my sincere apology to featuretile for my remarks against her. Also please read Eden's thread on what it means to share the road. It's great post.

peace to all,