Insulting compliments

[GLC1968]

I am sooo sensitive to this, myself. I try not to take things personally, and on the outside, that's how I behave...but inside I might be seething!

A big part of it comes from never truly LOOKING the part. Even when I was at my fitest, I was still bigger than most other athletes and people who didn't know me tended to treat me as a newbie. I always HATED joining a new gym (still do) and listening to all the drivel about needing 3 sessions with a personal trainer to set up a beginner program....for pete's sake - I've been lifting for the past decade (even if I don't look like it)...I don't need an introduction to the machines! And no, it's not just that they say this to everyone because my husband was right next to me and they had the balls to say to him "you look like you know your way around a gym, we can skip the sessions if you'd like". Seriously? I have more weight lifting knowledge than he does! (It happens with us all the time because he looks fit and I don't...even if I am)

Ok, sorry about the tangent. Clearly this hits a nerve with me.

What I came in here to say was that I tend to make comments to other runners or bikers that I pass that are more centered on shared misery or shared joy. Like - "wow, great view from up here, huh?" Or "ugh, is this hill over yet?". Even if I'm passing them (exceedingly rare on a run!), I'm probably struggling too! I just don't feel right saying "good job" when I've been in their shoes and that 'good job' made me feel the need to say back 'no really, I know I'm slow...it's not a good job...it's only a mediocre job at best!'.

[lauraelmore1033]

So many of you hit it right on the head with your comments and expressed exactly what I was feeling! Now I do feel better. I will always hear, "nice job, fat lady, but I'm still faster than you", and I should really just learn to take these comments as they were intended. and too, I should remember that when I offer words of encouragement to someone else, it is often something I need to hear myself.
Dh, who is a much faster climber than I am, also found himself exasperated by well meaning words of encouragement on the same ride. He would get way ahead on the climb, and as he was waiting paitiently for me, people descending would say, "you're almost there, don't give up yet!". He told me that he was going to throw a rock at the next person who told him not to give up!

Oh, that health club thing drives me crazy, GLC!

[ny biker]

I am frequently amazed by the clueslessness of people working in health clubs. It's best to ignore them as much as possible.

I'm also pretty sure that there are very few people in this world who intentionally insult strangers on bike rides, or anywhere else for that matter. If someone really does feel the need to point out that they are better than you, it means that deep down they are horribly insecure and probably full of self-loathing, so you should feel sorry for them.

But despite being a rather cynical person I believe in almost every case people are just trying to be friendly. And in general I think that's better than a world where people ignore each other.

[MM_QFC!]

Great job! I rode the Apple Century several times and always enjoyed it. It sounds like you and your DH had a great time - rode your own ride, did well, had fun, finished safely, so I'd agree with the advice to let the thoughtless and probably well-intentioned comment just slide off your back fender!

Ever get those?
Did the Apple Century over the weekend, and was so proud of the fact that DH and I were cookin' right along, passing people right and left (well, really only on the left, but you know what I mean...) and made quite an improvement on our previous performance. We kept leap-frogging back and forth with a certain pace line for most of the ride--mainly because they kept having flats and/or other mechanical issues. After the ride, as I was lying in a heap digesting a surprisingly delicious burger, the lone woman from the group came up to gush on about how impressed she was with me. I was totally eating it up until she asked if this was my first century! Why would you assume that? This happens to be my third season of doing not only centuries, but double centuries! I guess I'm just too sensitive, because it totally killed my buzz.

[MM_QFC!]

Years ago I was riding RAMROD - by far my biggest feat at that time! I trained alone & rode alone - and even though I'm a slow, solid, back-of-the-packer, I was so proud to be cruising along ("cruising" may be a generous term for me on those steep climbs). But the point is I felt invincible & full of joy... until.... two men rode past at a nice clip and one leaned in and said "Good job, lady."

In hindsight I am sure he meant to be supportive & encouraging - nothing else. But that day I heard "I can't believe you're still upright given how slow you're pedaling, you foolish old broad. Boy will I be shocked to see you at the finish line." I was hurt, insulted, embarrassed.

Even now my blood starts to curdle when I think of it. I get over it by enumerating in my mind the endless number of dumbass things I've surely muttered over the years when I meant to be kind, supportive & encouraging.

Frankly, I think you're a ROCK STAR for riding the Apple Century. I did it once and the headwinds nearly killed me!!!!!

Hey there - hmmmm, never knew of the comment or that you had a such a "hurt, insulted, embarrassed" reaction on most of a very tough ride - when you were already dealing with an ailing knee - whew!

Still proud of your ROCK STAR ride!

[bcipam]

I've changed what I say to others now after this happened.. several months ago a friend and I met for our usual weekly mtb ride. I am always slow and pokey but strong and know the trail well, having done it 1000's of times over 25 years. My friend invited two other ladies along for the ride - each had never ridden the Canyon before. The 4 of us take off... the new ladies are off like a shot and my friend had to struggle to keep up. Me? Did my usual pokey but consistant pace. I knew how far I was riding and wanted to warm up properly.

After the first long hill everyone was waiting. The new ladies said respectively "Good Job, you are doing so well!" "Awesome, you made it up the hill!!!!". What? Of course I made it up the hill; I do this ride every week! And doing so well? Better than what? Clearly not the ladies who rode out ahead? What are they comparing me too???? We are off again and same thing happens on the next hill. The third time it happens "Good job!" "Awesome" I gave my friend one of those looks - you know "I am going to kill you later" looks. She got the hint and knew not to stop and wait any longer. I just fell off the back so I didn't have to heard the ladies chattering. After another long hill I heard one of the ladies coming down... she was done/too tired to go on and as she rode down I got one more "Good job! You are almost to the top!" I almost turned around to strangle her!!! Thankfully my friend and the other lady rode ahead and I was able to complete the ride to the turn around in peace.

At the turn around (12 miles out) I met up with the ladies. The new friend was exhausted and very tired. Of course she went out very quick and hard and didn't warm up. As we descended, we hit some technical spots and she took a bad fall. I rode past and had to stiffle the urge to say "Awesome - you were doing so well!" and instead stopped and helped her up. Thankfully, since this was my trail and mountain, I had the skill to ride ahead of her and not heard those words of "discouragement" again.

So now when I see someone ride by or up and I say something like "Great day to be riding!" or "Isn't that fun to ride!?!". There are times when "awesome" or "good job" are the right words but those times are truly special or reserved for 8 year olds!

[ny biker]

I've changed what I say to others now after this happened.. several months ago a friend and I met for our usual weekly mtb ride. I am always slow and pokey but strong and know the trail well, having done it 1000's of times over 25 years. My friend invited two other ladies along for the ride - each had never ridden the Canyon before. The 4 of us take off... the new ladies are off like a shot and my friend had to struggle to keep up. Me? Did my usual pokey but consistant pace. I knew how far I was riding and wanted to warm up properly.

After the first long hill everyone was waiting. The new ladies said respectively "Good Job, you are doing so well!" "Awesome, you made it up the hill!!!!". What? Of course I made it up the hill; I do this ride every week! And doing so well? Better than what? Clearly not the ladies who rode out ahead? What are they comparing me too???? We are off again and same thing happens on the next hill. The third time it happens "Good job!" "Awesome" I gave my friend one of those looks - you know "I am going to kill you later" looks. She got the hint and knew not to stop and wait any longer. I just fell off the back so I didn't have to heard the ladies chattering. After another long hill I heard one of the ladies coming down... she was done/too tired to go on and as she rode down I got one more "Good job! You are almost to the top!" I almost turned around to strangle her!!! Thankfully my friend and the other lady rode ahead and I was able to complete the ride to the turn around in peace.

At the turn around (12 miles out) I met up with the ladies. The new friend was exhausted and very tired. Of course she went out very quick and hard and didn't warm up. As we descended, we hit some technical spots and she took a bad fall. I rode past and had to stiffle the urge to say "Awesome - you were doing so well!" and instead stopped and helped her up. Thankfully, since this was my trail and mountain, I had the skill to ride ahead of her and not heard those words of "discouragement" again.

So now when I see someone ride by or up and I say something like "Great day to be riding!" or "Isn't that fun to ride!?!". There are times when "awesome" or "good job" are the right words but those times are truly special or reserved for 8 year olds!

See, after the first time I would have said something like, thanks, but I do this ride all the time and I knew I would make it up the hill. I'm just pacing myself because it's going to be a long day.

[BikeDutchess]

I must say when I first started doing longer rides (and really still), I loved hearing "awesome" or "good job" from the riders that were zooming by me. I considered it a nice little boost and it always gave me a little energy to keep going. It never occurred to me that some might consider such a comment insulting, and I'm sure none of those comments were meant as such. I know there will always be better riders than me out there, and I'd rather hear a well-intentioned comment than have them just ignore me as not worthy to communicate with. This has been an eye-opening thread, and it will at least make me think a little before I throw out my own encouraging comments to other riders out there (which I don't do very often because I'm usually the slug anyway!).

[Bike Chick]

I am like GLC here. I am sensitive to remarks because as badly as I would like to look like an athlete, I don't. I am much closer to the gray-headed ole grandma stereotype and I think people assume this is my first anything. I understand how it doesn't sit well. I know people mean well but after someone passes me on a hill and tells me I'm doing a good job I want to reply with a crude obscenity. The same goes for the people sitting in their lawn chairs watching me run past at mile 12. Really mean retorts run through my head. Maybe I'm just not a social sufferer and enjoy my privacy. It has also made me aware of what not to say to folks on a ride.

On the other hand, I am also known for making some stupid, dumbass remark in an attempt to start a conversation.......it sounds like something I would say.

[bcipam]

See, after the first time I would have said something like, thanks, but I do this ride all the time and I knew I would make it up the hill. I'm just pacing myself because it's going to be a long day.

Oh we had that conversation before the ride... both my friend and I said this is our weekly ride and we were happy to show them the ropes. I also explained don't worry about me, I warm up slowly. I think this is why it irritated me so. After the second hill, and I was getting alittle irritated, my friend asked "are you OK?" she meant with the comments, I knew that. I responded "I'm fine, you know me just trying to warm up!" So when the third time came around, sorry I was fuming. Of course afterwards my friend and I had a good laugh and I felt better!

Like I said, I am now very concious about saying "good job" "doing well", "looking good" "almost there" anything like that... BTW I never thought the statements were meant to be insulting and I acknowledge it was my own insecurity that caused the problem but I do find sometimes, women, bless them, can be condescending or not sincere with their encouragement. I told my friend if a guy said it, it wouldn't have bothered me as much - my friend thought that odd. I didn't - my theory is women should know more about how women ride and understand... men we know are clueless!

[Alex]

I've never been one to say "great job" or "looking good" or any such things as I am passing someone. It feels strange to me to say that if I am blowing by them. I'm more likely to say "beautiful day" or "how are ya?"

On the other hand, I always smile and say "thanks" or "you, too" if someone passes me and says something like that. I agree with the folks who said that most people are not out to say intentionally nasty things in such circumstances.

At least your insulting compliment was a compliment of sorts. At least week's tri, I was on the run, and a woman passed me and said, "We may be slow, but we'll finish." Now, I know I am not a fast runner, but I wasn't feeling like I was particularly dragging or anything. In fact, I felt pretty darn good. I kept her in my sights for a while and then passed her with authority saying, "You were an excellent rabbit in that bright pink shirt! Thanks!"

I do wonder if I would have had a negative split had she not made the "WE may be slow" comment!

[snowroo]

How we react is sometimes a reflection of our own self rather than the motivation of others.

The ladies were meaning to be encouraging. They were trying to be nice. How you interpret that is a reflection of your own personal "stuff".

I would chose to interpret their comments as a sign of respect that you are working hard and are achieving your goal. Why chose to interpret as negative and put a downer on your ride and your day.

[Crankin]

Well, it might be a reflection of myself, and myself gets pissed at those comments! Because someone slower than me does not make those comments! Only those passing me do.
I feel just like Bike Chick. I'd like to scream obscenities. While I *do* look like the inner athlete I would like to be, my body has other ideas. I never say "good job" to anyone, except when I am riding with my friend who is a newer rider and still trying to get faster. She appreciates it.

[Catrin]

Well, it might be a reflection of myself, and myself gets pissed at those comments! Because someone slower than me does not make those comments! Only those passing me do.
I feel just like Bike Chick. I'd like to scream obscenities. While I *do* look like the inner athlete I would like to be, my body has other ideas. I never say "good job" to anyone, except when I am riding with my friend who is a newer rider and still trying to get faster. She appreciates it.

As a new rider I do appreciate this as I am still focusing on basic skills - but don't know how I would take it from someone zooming past me at triple my speed. Then again, such people don't usually say anything because they are too busy focusing on what they are doing - and at that speed they need to be

In the end - especially depending on how we are feeling and the situation- those two words can hit us very differently. This is what I would expect my personal trainer or a coach to say - not strangers.

[OakLeaf]

I think you only have to think about how it feels to be told "You look like you've been doing this for a while!" - to know that it's an insult to assume someone is a complete newbie.

Still, it does seem that at all levels and all types of cycling, there's a fairly strong snob factor. On the road, at least - I don't know for mountain biking, maybe the off-road crowd is different. Bicycle racing is like most forms of racing, just plain cut-throat, someone from another team won't say anything at all unless it's a subtle insult meant to psych you out. And whether you're a commuter, tourist, or participant in an organized ride, it's not unusual for another cyclist to sneer at you for SOMETHING, whether it's an article of clothing, a technique, your hair, whatever.

The contrast with running is pretty stark, to me, and that's what's interesting. As a new runner I'm like Catrin as a new rider - I'm not insulted if someone assumes I'm a new runner, because I AM one - but one of the things that's so cool to me about foot races (mid-pack and slower, anyway) is how encouraging everyone is. If you saved too much at the start so that you zoom by somebody late in the race, they DO cheer you on. And etiquette seems to be if you hang around at the finish, you're supposed to cheer for those finishing behind you.

So I guess my take is kind of mixed. I do think it's an unequivocal insult to assume someone is doing something for the first time. Even if it IS their first time, they don't need to be reminded how woefully unprepared they appear to everyone else. But I don't think it's an insult to tell someone they're doing well in a NON-competitive setting, even if the person saying it happens to be faster. (If they were THAT much faster, they wouldn't even be in the same neighborhood to be able to say it, for one thing. )