Calorie deprivation - how bad is it really?

[azfiddle]

I'm following this discussion with some interest.... trying to maintain a weight loss program (weightwatchers) as my cycling has increased from a few miles a week up to 80 -90 right now. I've increased how much I'm eating but possibly not enough, and I'm still losing but it's been averaging about 1/2 lb a week.

Sharon

[Veronica]

How long are you exercising per day?

Personally, I don't increase my calorie intake for a normal day's workout and I workout on average 2 hours per day 4 days a week on 1500 calories. I weigh 146 and have 20% body fat. I don't measure my food or count calories - I just tend to eat the same thing every day. I use to weigh 180 and had 30+% body fat so I'm only relating what has worked for me. Losing weight is hard. There is no easy formula and it takes discipline. I know the OP has been struggling with her weight for a while from her posts here and I really think talking to a doctor or a nutritionist would be a good thing.

Just because you've increased your output, you can't increase your intake if you want to lose weight.

The only time I increase my intake is if I have raced. Even if I do a seriously long ride the only increase in my intake is what I ate while riding.

I second the poster who said something about doing weights. Even just a routine of doing push ups and crunches on your own will build muscle mass and that will burn more calories.

Veronica

[limewave]

Personally, I don't increase my calorie intake for a normal day's workout and I workout on average 2 hours per day 4 days a week on 1500 calories. I weigh 146 and have 20% body fat. I don't measure my food or count calories - I just tend to eat the same thing every day. I use to weigh 180 and had 30+% body fat so I'm only relating what has worked for me. Losing weight is hard. There is no easy formula and it takes discipline. I know the OP has been struggling with her weight for a while from her posts here and I really think talking to a doctor or a nutritionist would be a good thing.

Just because you've increased your output, you can't increase your intake if you want to lose weight.

I too tend to eat the same thing everyday when I am sticking to my plan. It's so much easier than counting calories everyday.

It is my understanding, according to my nutritionist, that I should maintain a 1500-1600 calorie a day diet regardless of my activity. But that if I am to be working out for 90 minutes or more, that I should add some nutrition (like a gu packet) during that session--not another meal.

Now if I could only stick to her recommendation

[Jones]

I am not an expert on anything and have struggled with weight my entire life, that being said my heart rate monitor and my garmin both give me some wild estimate about how many calories burned during a work out. I don't believe either of them. My garmin would read I had burned more than 700 calories on a 10 mile 1 hour mountain bike ride. There was no way. "The Daily Plate" seems to give high estimates of calories burned too.
The Iphone tool sounds great but I think I would take Veronica's advice and go see a nutritionist or a doctor or both.

[channlluv]

Golly, you guys are just too brilliant for words.

Thank you for the encouragement and, Veronica, for the tough love. You're absolutely right. I did ask for their nutrition sheet before we ordered and I tried to get the sanest thing on the menu (a teriyaki grilled chicken sandwich with a side salad), but yeah, the frozen yogurt was not the smartest choice. It was just the most convenient.

Okay, so I'll start varying the level of workouts from day to day, which shouldn't be hard. I only have the chance to do really long rides on the weekends, but I try to get to the Y for other cardio at least four days during the week. I have an appointment tomorrow with one of their personal trainers to get set up on the weight machines, so I'll start doing that part, too, tomorrow. They have a nutritionist, too. I'll see about setting up an appointment with her.

I swear, this hundred pounds extra WILL come off.

I've gotten hooked on Universal Sports network, watching the cycling world championships and last night, the Kona Ironman from 2008. It's all just so inspiring. I want to get out and do that stuff, too, and I've never felt like that before in my life. I got a D in gym in 8th grade, for crying out loud.

What do your daily diets look like as far as nutrients go - percentages of carbs and protein, for instance. I remember somewhere reading 30-30-40 was good, but I'm not sure what that means.

Roxy

[jobob]

I got a D in gym in 8th grade, for crying out loud.

Hee hee, you're not alone, love.

Best of luck on your journey. We'll be rooting for you.

[Veronica]

If you can make it up to the Bay Area for a weekend, we have a tri for fun series that runs June, July and August. The swim is in an old quarry and you don't need a wetsuit.

A goal for next summer!

Veronica

[witeowl]

It is my understanding, according to my nutritionist, that I should maintain a 1500-1600 calorie a day diet regardless of my activity. But that if I am to be working out for 90 minutes or more, that I should add some nutrition (like a gu packet) during that session--not another meal.

This is what drives me crazy about so many "experts". If you ride hard for 90 minutes, you can easily burn well over 1,000 kcal. There's no reason that doesn't justify another reasonable-sized meal. And then we blame ourselves for straying because we "lack willpower". :

(Note for anyone following my blog: I know that's not what's going on for my current insanity; that's just a personal issue...)

[witeowl]

If you want to lose weight, you don't get a reward just because you knocked out a long ride. Eat a good breakfast, and bring a gel or two, and an apple or banana for afterwards.

Right, you don't "earn" a hot fudge sundae... but a decent, well-balanced 300-500 calorie meal (preferably with some protein, methinks) is certainly not out of the question.

[owlice]

Hmmm.... sometimes, the high-fat reward works; at least, it has for me. The day AFTER I have ice cream is the day I'll see a drop on the scale. Or did, anyway, when I had a scale. That doesn't mean I'll eat the whole container of Ben and Jerry's, mind you, but I'd have a half-cup and bam! Two or three pounds down the next day. (That's after a week of fairly clean and calorie-counted eating, mind you, not just after the ice cream.)

Roxy, aim for fats (good fats) about 20% of your calories, proteins 20-30% of your calories, and carbs the rest (50-60%), unless your doctor has specifically put you on a low-fat diet.

[Dogmama]

I'd second Veronica's suggestion about a nutritionist if you have 100 lbs to lose. You'll be at it for awhile so you need a sensible plan that you will stick with. She/he can give you a good macro nutrient breakdown depending on your activity level. Make sure your YMCA nutritionist has some type of certification.

Your personal trainer should set you up with a full body, compound exercise routine. That means squats, push ups, pull ups (assisted as needed) and not bicep & triceps curls. You want to engage as many muscle groups as possible during a movement. For example, push ups engage pectorals, deltoids, triceps and abs. Leave the single body part movements for the bodybuilders.

[ny biker]

If you want to lose weight, you don't get a reward just because you knocked out a long ride. Eat a good breakfast, and bring a gel or two, and an apple or banana for afterwards.

If I'm doing a 50-mile ride,a gel or two won't even get me through the ride itself. I would need at least 500 calories during that ride, probably more to avoid bonking. And a piece of fruit afterwards is not enough for recovery.

Roxy, you're probably overwhelmed with information here, but if you can stand one more recommendation, I highly recommend Nancy Clark's Sports Nutrition Guide Book. http://www.nancyclarkrd.com/books/sportsnutrition.asp

[Dogmama]

Depends. Overweight people who just begin exercising bonk easier because they are unable to access fat stores. Fat needs carbs to burn in the Krebs cycle. It's a balance, though, and that's where a nutritionist & a personal trainer can really help. You don't want to scarf down a dozen donuts & ride for ten minutes.

LSD rides (long slow duration) use more fat because the Krebs cycle (where fat is burned) takes awhile. Faster rides at a higher heart rate use more carbs, generally. So, should overweight people do only LSD rides? No. It's the calories in vs calories out equation, for the most part.

Until recently, we thought that intervals burned more fat due to the afterburn effect (the time it takes for your body to return to stasis.) Turns out, the afterburn effect is minimal and intervals often lead to injuries. Intervals do provide variety, though, so they aren't all bad.

There you are. More information than you wanted, probably. I love to talk about personal training.

[channlluv]

My brain is going to explode.

I'm going to order the sports nutrition book as soon as I get home. I hope it will explain this Krebs cycle.

Okay, so the "trainer" at the Y took in my appearance and read the info sheet I'd filled out and started talking about watching my diet, avoid potatoes and pasta...same old stuff I hear from well-meaning friends who don't know me well. She recommended Weight Watchers. She also recommended I change doctors, or at least try hers because my doctor is missing something if I'm not losing weight, probably a low-performing thyroid, even though I told her I always test normal. Basically, she made a lot of assumptions based on her personal experiences.

I already know how to work the cardio machines, so she skipped that and took me to the Strive machines and explained how they worked, but I didn't get to work out at all. What a wasted afternoon.

Later, I stopped by a special swim store and bought a swim cap and new goggles. I'll work out tomorrow.

Roxy

[Owlie]

LSD rides (long slow duration) use more fat because the Krebs cycle (where fat is burned) takes awhile. Faster rides at a higher heart rate use more carbs, generally. So, should overweight people do only LSD rides? No. It's the calories in vs calories out equation, for the most part.

Um...what Krebs cycle are we referring to here? The only one I'm familiar with is the one that burns everything (fats, carbs, amino acids) and is running all the time. Yes, going faster will preferentially burn sugars, because that's what is rapidly absorbed and doesn't need to go through extra enzymatic steps to be usable fuel.
[Biochemist slinks out of the room and goes back to her corner]