Do you have a question for Specialized Women's Product Team?

[SadieKate]

Comments/questions...
• Spec's clothing line is not up to the quality of their bikes. Designs are uninspring and seem tailored towards casual riders. No BIB shorts for women? Come on...

Yeah, but their Enduro short rocks. It is the only mtb short with decent length inseam and back seat seam -- and fits me without resorting to a stupid and unflattering elastic waistband. I have found no other short that fits the bill.

Now, if Specialized would allow mail order so I could buy from TE and sell the shell and inner liner separately, I'd be a happy camper. I'm paying $120 for a shell and storing the liner on the shelf because, as usual, the liner and the shell aren't sized the same. How about 60 bucks for each?

[Becky]

Yeah, but their Enduro short rocks. It is the only mtb short with decent length inseam and back seat seam -- and fits me without resorting to a stupid and unflattering elastic waistband. I have found no other short that fits the bill.

Now, if Specialized would allow mail order so I could buy from TE and sell the shell and inner liner separately, I'd be a happy camper. I'm paying $120 for a shell and storing the liner on the shelf because, as usual, the liner and the shell aren't sized the same. How about 60 bucks for each?

It's not just Specialized. This seems to plague most women's mtb shorts. They're often silly short, or the inner liner is terrible. The only decent mtb short I've found is the Sugoi Gusta, but the liner is so-so (for me), and it's hard to justify $120 for the outer short alone.

You can buy lycra shorts in different lengths, why not mtb shorts?

[Susan Otcenas]

Ladies,

I'd like to chime in here to discuss the general theme of this thread.

Jeff & I have been talking about this thread in some detail and are quite conflicted about it. On the one hand, our mission is to advance women's cycling and part of the way to do that is to have great discussions like this one regarding what kinds of products do and don't work for us as cyclists, specifically as female cyclists. On the other hand, we do not permit commercial posts on this forum. While being helpful, Rachel is clearly "on company time" with a goal to actively promote Specialized products and services, talking about producing videos, etc. I think this potentially violates the "no advertising" rules. We have other industry folks on this list who are active participants sharing their knowledge without crossing the line into commercialism.

I don't think we want the forums to turn into a market research / marketing vehicle for every cycling company out there. If we permit threads such as this, where do we draw the line? We are receiving PMs from people who feel the line *has* been crossed here and we need to be sensitive to that.

This is a community, so we want to hear from YOU about how you feel on this subject. I'll ask that you keep it civil. :-) No final decisions have been made, so please let us know what you think. Thanks ladies!


Susan

[SadieKate]

I agree with you. If I could mailorder Specialized products from you, I'd would be sitting on the fence. But since Specialized has weird marketing rules, well, I'm on your side o' the fence.

[Thorn]

It has bothered me from the onset and I've read the thread with an odd fascination.

If Rachel was a participant, it wouldn't bother me. If she was here answering questions as well as participating, it wouldn't bother me.

But in response to questions people have taken the time to place, we learn the answers will be on a different site. That isn't in the spirit of the site. In fact, I'd go so far as to ask how it is different from gavin_m?

[ehirsch83]

It doesn't bother me one bit and oddly, I am surprised that this bothered so many people.

[salsabike]

I don't feel strongly about it in either direction.

[aicabsolut]

I was hoping that Specialized would use this as a way to do more market research than to push their products. So far, that's the vibe I'm getting, and I'm ok with that. I think that getting some answers to questions is a bonus. I like Specialized products, but I wouldn't mind if another company took this approach. For example, I think it'd be great if Trek people came here and said, I've searched this board and found that a lot of you can't stand our Bontrager saddles; we've been working hard on them, but we'd like some more feedback and questions from you on our women's line.

[Kiwi Stoker]

I used to work in the bike industry and I am respectful of what special website we have here.

Personally while I was working there all I did here was to read the discussions and occassionally pass on comments to other people in the company which I thought was helpful. It wasn't until after I left that I joined and started participating.

Unfortunately I do believe Rachel and Co has probably crossed the line in the sense they are using this site for free to gain market research etc and traffic from it to their site (and that is what you pay online ads to do). This site is unique and cool because TE hasn't used it as a way to generate extra funds by allowing advertising throughout this forum.

And its not like Rachel is from a start up company that needs help, Specialized can afford market research and does so by their women's travelling roadshows etc.

I like how this is a neutral space where we can discuss everything. As others mentioned I think it would be OK for Rachel to paricipate on this forum as a woman rider and not with her Specialized marketing hat on.

[BellaMTB]

This thread seems to have gone in several different directions, but I just wanted to add my comments about the color choices on WSD bikes - I agree with several of the previous posts about not liking the obviously "girly" color schemes (esp. pink) - probably a visceral reaction from childhood experiences. Aside from that, I think the practical consideration of resale value is also important (probably harder to sell a pink bike). I realize you can't please everyone, but my main complaint is that many of the bikes (especially higher-end) only come in one color. If I don't like that color, I won't buy it. I am very particular about the colors I will buy. I'd like to add that I do like the subtle monochromatic patterns (e.g. "Tribal") on some of the new Specialized 2010 WSD bikes.

Now for my last LBS bike color experience: I was shopping for a higher-end Specialized MTB a few years back and politely asked the sales manager if the model I was looking at came in any other color. He stared at me and replied: "Guys don't care." !!!?? Needless to say I bought my bike elsewhere.

(re. rlambert's participation - OK by me, though I am new here.)

[teigyr]

After looking at this all, I have to agree with Susan. While the powers that be here are very patient, I think we all forget what this website and forum are. I didn't realize that TE doesn't sell Specialized products (at least I don't think so?) and using this forum doesn't appear to be 100% ethical.

I have nothing against Rachel or Specialized and I understand why the TE message boards would be a prime group of people to contact. I also think it was pushing boundaries, a bit.

[spazzdog]

While I understand Susan's point, I think its a bit late to get the horses back in the barn. We all already know Rachel is with Specialized so she will be forever peppered with "why can't Specialized do..." type questions.

I don't believe she should be banned or anything - she's female and a cyclist for pete's sake.

Perhaps Rachel (sorry - didn't mean to speak as though you weren't in the room), you should simply come as a participant and leave the corporate out of it. You can still take things you observe back to your development team, but avoid those pesky lines of demarcation.

As for the rest of us, lets try to not get Rachel in any more hot water. If you have a Specialized specific question, PM it to her.

Remember - she like each of us, has something to share AS a cyclist - that's if she still wants to play with us.

my 2 cents - spazzdog

[Susan Otcenas]

I don't believe she should be banned or anything - she's female and a cyclist for pete's sake.

Just to be clear - I'm not suggesting this.

What we're trying to gain is some clarity on where to draw the line on the type of participation permitted by forum members who have a clear commercial interest at stake.

We are very grateful to all of you who are willing to share your thoughts here. Jeff & I have also been receiving PMs on the subject, and are carefully considering all of your comments. Thank you so much for letting us know what you think!

Susan

[gnat23]

PS, everyone who is poo-pooing the pink stuff, I will gladly take it off your hands.

-- gnat!

[rlambert]

In response to the growing concern that the administrator and others have for my participation on this forum, I will discontinue this thread and use of the forum. While it is true that I am participating in the forum as a Specialized employee, I believe that as an avid cyclist who works for a bicycle company I am always representing my company whether out on the trails or on a forum and thought that full disclosure of the company I represent would be more truthful.

I have read and gleaned a lot from these forums over the past year and have noticed a lot of questions about cycling/products/riding , but I was hesitant to jump in and participate as I am not normally an active forum user. However, I thought the opportunity to open a discussion with full disclosure about who I was would encourage a dialogue about what women want from a cycling company and what they aren’t getting. It is true that I have used this for research and to encourage people to participate in our Facebook page but mostly the research has been to benefit women’s products and development by learning what you truly want and need from cycling products and also for you to learn a little bit about the women behind the product.

In no posting on this thread have I pushed a product or our brand but wanted to participate in this dialogue with everybody knowing who I was and what I was trying to do. I apologize to any who have been offended by this or made uncomfortable, it was never my goal. On a side note, I have received many personal messages asking questions, looking for information and giving fantastic feedback. Thank you to all of you who sent those messages.

Thank you,
Rachael