down hill scardy pants

[hipmama]

Oh yes, as a kid I flew down the hills, even in college when I lived in the mountains I was fearless. I think it's something about being a mom now... there's this whole different respect for my life needing to be preserved.

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

Personally, I would call the original poster "Down hill SMARTY pants" instead of "down hill scardy pants".
I was terrified of downhills when i started biking- very very cautious.
But glad I was! Now I have much more skill and confidence.
I can't believe some of the dinky hills I used to brake on and be terrified of. But HEY, I was SAFE and I slowly gained confidence without ever being reckless or taking chances. Lets not confuse common sense with being 'chicken'.

[Crankin]

Yeah, and I just don't get the "line" thing. How do you know what your "line" is? Is there some magical secret?
I can get up to 30+ or so if it's straight, but if I have to turn, forget it. I still feel like I have no control of the bike and I will find myself not where I want to be. Yes, I look ahead, lean in the direction of the turn, put the leg down, etc. It is not my bike, it's me... I will be over on the wrong side of the road if I start going over 25 on a right hand turn. I do better with lefts for some reason. Then there's the fear. Since I have been riding for almost ten years, I have given up. It's actually getting worse. On group rides I am the only one who loses time on the descents.

[OakLeaf]

Yeah, and I just don't get the "line" thing. How do you know what your "line" is? Is there some magical secret?

Your line is whatever line you take.

You can learn faster lines through familiarity with a corner. Some corners have only one fast line. Some have several ways that you can set yourself up for the next corner. Most corners have a single apex (the point where you get closest to the inside); some are double or even triple apex.

In general you can take a corner faster by "straightening" it as much as possible, by moving to the outside of your lane on corner entry and exit, and squaring it off by moving to the inside at the apex. But other factors affect the fast line, notably camber, obstacles such as gravel, grates and potholes.

Then, of course, if you're not riding on a closed course, you have to take visibility into account when choosing your line - the likelihood that oncoming traffic will be drifting into your lane, etc.

This article was written for motorcyclists, but keeping in mind that bicyclists usually want to choose tighter lines, it's helpful.

[Crankin]

I knew you would answer, Oak.
Since I have to go down a hill (that curves to the right) every time I leave my house, I know where every curve and pothole is. And every day I say "this time I am going to do it." Get in the drops and go. Instead, I start drifting to the left, squeeze the brakes, and go down the hill at about 15 or less. I just freeze up and freak out. Like I said, I've given up. Maybe I need a sports shrink??

[maillotpois]

Thanks, Oakleaf.

Reading Hough's book to improve my motorcycling last year dramatically improved my cycling descending. That whole delayed apex thing. Good stuff.

[wildeny]

I fell during a downhill turn at a speed about 40 km/hr because I didn't notice the side road was quite slippery (you know, the part out of sun shine). It's quite serious though I didn't know at that time and still had to continue the rest of the trip.

Of course, later I still remembered the feeling of falling but I tried to overcome my fear by practicing. Keep the speed low in the beginning and slowly increase the speed.

This article, Descending by Jobst Brandt, is also quite useful.

[Zen]

On group rides I am the only one who loses time on the descents.

Hello, are you me?
It's a p$$r too because I can climb like a demon

[Jiffer]

I LOVE to descend! It's my favorite and I'm really good at it. I do get a little freaked out sometimes at what could happen if I crashed, but I just try to ride as safely as possible and enjoy myself. I just set my Garmin to tell me my fastest speed. When I did Heartbreak Hundred, I got up to 47 at one point. Yikes! Pretty sure that was my fastest. Had no idea I had gotten that fast and never thought I'd feel comfortable doing that speed on anything other than the tandem with dh. Yet, I recall feeling fine and enjoying every moment of it (after the stupid climbing I had just done and knowing there was a lot more where that came from).

Stay in your own comfort zone, whatever's comfortable for you. If you feel uneasy, don't push yourself just to keep up with others or "get over your fear". Keep your speed down and eventually you may begin to feel more at ease. Read up on descending skills. That may give you some confidence.

[Crankin]

Zen, I ride with a group of very experienced riders who are mostly "older," like me. But, most of them live nearer to the city (flat) and are not used to climbing like I am. I always end up behind the leader, or at least in the front with the guys on the hilly rides. At least that makes me feel good, even though this group is a "smell the roses" group who never averages more than 15. But, quite a few of the guys in the group are really strong riders, who do incredible distances.
But, when some of those weak climbers pass me on the descents, I get pissed.

[Geonz]

I knew you would answer, Oak.
Since I have to go down a hill (that curves to the right) every time I leave my house, I know where every curve and pothole is. And every day I say "this time I am going to do it." Get in the drops and go. Instead, I start drifting to the left, squeeze the brakes, and go down the hill at about 15 or less. I just freeze up and freak out. Like I said, I've given up. Maybe I need a sports shrink??

Yo both make me feel better. I'm out here visiting in Virginia and ACK!!! The roads curve!!! ... oh, and I'm talking about driving ;P My brother says I drive like a novice 16-year-old afraid of wrecking Mom's car, which is precisely true since I'm in a rental (and we were going up a dirt road in the mountains). (He wasn't faulting me for it... simply observing after I brought up that having been without a car for two years....)
Im similar on the bike, which may be why I rode so much more when I moved to the plains. When I did TOMRV, with so many hills and curves, I had 'em put my name as "ICORNERSLOWLY" so people gave me room (and advice as if I were a novice, which I didn't mind either since it generally applied).
Gonna go check out hte motorcycle page...

[tantrumbean]

Yeah, and I just don't get the "line" thing. How do you know what your "line" is? Is there some magical secret?
I can get up to 30+ or so if it's straight, but if I have to turn, forget it. I still feel like I have no control of the bike and I will find myself not where I want to be. Yes, I look ahead, lean in the direction of the turn, put the leg down, etc. It is not my bike, it's me... I will be over on the wrong side of the road if I start going over 25 on a right hand turn. I do better with lefts for some reason. Then there's the fear. Since I have been riding for almost ten years, I have given up. It's actually getting worse. On group rides I am the only one who loses time on the descents.

I might be reading this wrong, but are you turning your handlebars in the same direction the turn goes? I found my cornering improved 100% after reading Zinn's stuff on counter-stearing, i.e. actually turning the handlebars slightly in the opposite direction of where you want to go in a corner - makes the bike lean over more and means I no longer end up on the wrong side of the road. Took some getting used to but works great!!!!

[Jiffer]

But, when some of those weak climbers pass me on the descents, I get pissed.

Then you'd be pissed at me!!! I'm guessing those weak climbers probably weigh more than you. I'm not a strong climber, but I make up for it on the descents and do pass a lot of people. I'm not overweight. I'm 5'9 and weigh about 145, while my shorter friends weigh 10 to 20 pounds less than me simply because of their height. I also have a higher gear than some people, so can pedal at higher speeds on a downhill ... and I take advantage of the downhills whenever I can to catch up and/or improve my over all time after the climb I just crawled up!

I'm trying to lose weight, mostly for the purpose of being able to climb better. I do wonder how much that might slow me down on the descents, but if it helps my climbing, it will be worth it to me.

Sorry people like me tick you off! Well ... not really.

[OakLeaf]

Losing weight won't hurt your descending.... remember Galileo and the Leaning Tower of Pisa? It's all about aerodynamics, and a few pounds aren't enough to really change the profile you present to the wind.

No matter how much weight you lose, all else being equal, your shorter friends will still descend quicker than you. Just because they're shorter.

And they're useless to draft behind, too. <cue Randy Newman's "Short People">

At 5'3", I can say it.

[Crankin]

Well, I don't know if my shortness helps with anything...
I don't turn my handlebars. I try to lean my body and look in the direction of the turn. But I think what mostly happens is I slow down, stiffen my body, squeeze the brakes, and just pray to get down the hill.

Jiffer, I am not really *pissed* at people like you, I am more pissed at myself. And I suspect you probably climb faster than me, too. I spin up everything, sometimes at extremely slow speeds, but I get up pretty steep grades.

You know, I can't remember how I went down hills as a kid. I lived in a hilly neighborhood and rode my 3 speed Raleigh everywhere. In fact, I don't know how I got up some of those hills on that bike!