Are you as appalled as I am?

[Zen]

I'm afraid to look at my 401k

[badgercat]

I'm not sure that I have anything super insightful to add to this conversation... i just wanted to add that ALL perspectives have been very interesting to read.

As an aside to the "savings" path this thread seems to be on now, though, put my name in the "twenty-something who understands the value of a dollar and hard work" column. Sadly, based on what I see in many people my age (and people not my age, for that matter), it's not a very long column.

Right now, I'm in debt for the first time in my life (unless you count when I borrowed money from my parents and grandpa to buy my first and only car), and it's one student loan taken out in my own name to help me pay for graduate school. I was able to take out a small loan thanks to the money I've been working for and SAVING since I started working in high school. Granted, I had a lot of financial help from my parents when I was in college, but that's what allowed me to put that money in the bank, which is allowing me to avoid the starving-grad-student stereotype now.

Too often, I see peers stiffing roommates on utility bill payments, not chipping in much for tip at a group dinner outing, or not offering gas money for a long drive because they're "broke," but thinking nothing of going out and spending $50 on a DVD box set the day it comes out or $100 on a new dress. I just can't relate to that. If I have the money to buy a new video game, I have AT LEAST that much money to donate to a charity or to shop at a local business instead of Wal-Mart or whatever.

Now, I'm no financial saint. I have my little spendy vices here and there... but the fact remains that I've been a credit-card holder for about 7 years now, and have NEVER ONCE charged more than I could pay off, in full, in that same month. It would never occur to me to spend money that I don't have on a... TV or something.

Now I'm just rambling. I guess where I'm going with this is yes, far too many Americans are gluttonous consumers. But liking to splurge a little on restaurant trips and bicycles and even, yes, fancy cars and being a responsible consumer don't have to be mutually exclusive.

[solobiker]

I too have always found those diamond ads offensive. That's probably why I made it very clear to my DH that he was to never buy me one. I think they're ugly and the labor that produces them is pretty brutal and offensive too.

On the other hand, we DID go to the foodbank last saturday for our joint birthday party and we each bagged over 1/2 ton of frozen carrots. THAT was fun.

I completly agree with the whole diamond issue. Diamonds don't do anything for me. At my last job all the women had these HUGE diamond rings. One women even bragged that she would not marry her husband unless he spent at least $10,000.00 on her engagement ring. Yes, I wrote $10,000.00. To me that is just crazy.

[Flur]

I completly agree with the whole diamond issue. Diamonds don't do anything for me. At my last job all the women had these HUGE diamond rings. One women even bragged that she would not marry her husband unless he spent at least $10,000.00 on her engagement ring. Yes, I wrote $10,000.00. To me that is just crazy.

+1 on the diamond ads. I like diamonds, but I hate the way that women are encouraged to obsess about them. Having a lot of diamonds or large diamonds does not mean that you're more loved or that your relationship "is forever". That's up to you and your SO, and no amount of $$ spent on a ring can guarantee that.

[Eden]

I have an opal on my wedding ring, and the ring isn't fancy either - it was made by a jewelry student at our college. My husband and I got engaged when we were in college. I don't think we could even conceive of having $10,000 to spend at that time... even now I wouldn't want to have something that valuable on my person.... egad, what if I lost it.

[Biciclista]

I completly agree with the whole diamond issue. Diamonds don't do anything for me. At my last job all the women had these HUGE diamond rings. One women even bragged that she would not marry her husband unless he spent at least $10,000.00 on her engagement ring. Yes, I wrote $10,000.00. To me that is just crazy.

wow, that's an indecent waste of money! And boy, wouldn't that guy be getting a bargain... She wouldn't marry him if he didn't come up with a 10K ring. um, a marriage made in heaven!

[Aggie_Ama]

I will not drop carats but my diamonds are mine and I like them. Bigger than what my mom had for 27 years but smaller than many people I know. There was no requirement on the size and this is actually my second ring but that is a long story. My first one was prettier overall and the diamonds were smaller, I still said yes. They were not even close to $10k though that is absurd for this little middle class baby. My now divorced friend had a $10k ring, it was hideous and huge but I just didn't agree with the styling. The man that came with it wasn't worth $10 let alone $10k. His excessive flaunting of money actually was one of the many reasons they are no longer together.

Any person who says they will not marry a man for less than $X has some really messed up priorities. My friend had a friend that said she would reject any guy who presented less than a flawless 2 carat diamond. She finally found someone to give her an insanely huge ring, I hope they are happy together. My diamonds have visible falws to me but you know it is kind of symbolic of me. I love them flaws and all, I tend to think that of my husband when he looks at me. But again those diamonds didn't make our marriage and they sure as heck don't strengthen it as a Debeers ad would like me to believe.

Off that soap box. By the way tongiht I saw 4 car company commercials: Hyundai, Acura, Lexus and BMW. All said a car is an excellent gift. MAybe I will buy DH a Matchbox car for his stocking as a joke. We can donate it to charity later.

[jobob]

I have an opal on my wedding ring, and the ring isn't fancy either

Yikes, just be careful with it - opals can be very fragile.

I would have liked an opal engagement ring but I worked in a lab at the time and with all the crud I got my hands into I would have had to take it off a lot, a sure way for me to lose it. So I opted for a small sapphire (almost as strong as a diamond) with miniscule diamond chips on either side. As rings go it was pretty inexpensive, but I really like it to this day.

[Irulan]

+1 on the diamond ads. I like diamonds, but I hate the way that women are encouraged to obsess about them. Having a lot of diamonds or large diamonds does not mean that you're more loved or that your relationship "is forever". That's up to you and your SO, and no amount of $$ spent on a ring can guarantee that.

Read The Heartless Stone by Tom Zollner. He goes into the whole marketing mega mindset behind the diamond ad campaigns and lots of other socio-political diamond stuff.

[Eden]

DeBeers (they control almost all of the diamond trade) is really scary! You can get diamonds from Canada that are not associated with DeBeers or any of the horrid things that most diamonds are involved in. I would guess its not entirely environmentally friendly getting them out, but they are at least they are providing good jobs to the native communities and are not associated with civil war, slavery, terrorism etc.

[Aggie_Ama]

So I opted for a small sapphire (almost as strong as a diamond) with miniscule diamond chips on either side. As rings go it was pretty inexpensive, but I really like it to this day.

My husband never thought a sapphire could be an engagement ring. We saw someone with one and he was completely in love with the look. He said if he had only known he could do that I would have one instead. He doesn't get too excited about jewelry but he was completely taken by the sapphire engagement ring. He should have watched Friends I reckon.

[Mr. Bloom]

... many of those people buying what some consider to be appalling cars are also giving "appalling" amounts of money to various causes.

Funny thing is he has a relative that is a self made millionaire, literally she has that much in cash in the bank then real estate worth as much. The woman is extremely frugal her husband and her made that money through smart investments and living on a depression era mindset. She has two vehicles, both purchased with cash before her husband died in 1999. A suburban and a Z71 Farm Truck, neither with any more bells and whistles than power windows.

Case in Point:
As many of you know, I commute between two cities. One, Bloomington Indiana, has a self made local BILLionaire. He has personally given over $400,000,000.00 to the community for historic rehab and economic development (in addition to being the largest employer in the area).

He lives in an ordinary house on an ordinary street in Mellencamp's small town. Until recently, he and his wife still parked their '94 Cadillac and '96 Buick ON THE STREET because the city would not approve a variance for him to build a garage! Did I mention what he has given to the city??? In any event, his attitude is "give because it's right...expect nothing in return".

NOW, I hear that he has a very, very, very nice boat on the coast...(one that would be valued with a couple of commas and that some would think to be pretentious and ghastly in its cost)...and you know what, I have no problem with that.

Lively and enjoyable debate. Mr. Silver steps off the soapbox

[Tuckervill]

You can dig your own diamonds in Arkansas!

I may have mentioned this before, but I saw a giant Arkansas diamond at Tiffany's on 5th Avenue, once. I was impressed more with that than anything else in the store! A little bit of home, right there in New York City.

Karen

[bmccasland]

Beth- These are all local to Austin. They get a lot of community shout outs from radio/fun runs but still do a lot of good and everyone needs donations.

Aggie Ama - Thank you for the info, that helps a lot!

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Now back to our regularly scheduled soap box meyhem

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[Crankin]

I know I am lucky. I have very good benefits through my husband's work that we only pay $180.00 a month for. I was able to quit my well paying job to go back to school, without really changing my lifestyle. I did get a loan for the 18K tuition, but I will pay those back as soon as I graduate. This is the first time in my life that I don't have to work. Yes, I am depending on my husband's salary, but when I was younger and had the opportunity to switch careers, it would have meant a major sacrifice for the whole family. I couldn't do it.
I have never been in a Walmart. There is just something about that place that is creepy. Target, well, I used to go there in AZ, 20 years ago, and haven't been in one since.
Our 401ks have tanked, but they will recover. We are using the downturn to put our money into stocks that are really low but have potential. My husband plans to work for at least 10 more years, maybe longer and I plan to continue my new career at least on a part time basis until I am pretty old. Well, at least until I am 65, maybe longer. I think I would go crazy without working.
One thing to consider is that we are all at different stages of life. I worked for 30 years and for about 10 of those years I also worked a second job in a health club. I also taught religious school. I guess what I am trying to say is that I will keep spending my money, because I feel like I have paid my dues. I don't have any debt except my mortgage and a second mortgage. I am not going to change what I do based on the fact that others are having issues. I just wish that the media would stop talking about how bad it is, because whenever some "announcement" comes out, you can almost feel the panic. It feels planned to me...