anybody here feed their pets Evo or California Natural?

[Kalidurga]

Ok, I now have a problem related to this. My 5-month old male kitten just spent a week at the vet with a mystery fever-- he's doing better now, so that's not the issue. His eating regimen is.

For the first two weeks I had him, I fed him a combination of Wellness canned and kibble on a twice daily schedule. While he was at the vet, they apparently fed him Purina pouch food multiple times a day. Now when I give him the Wellness canned food, he licks off all the juices and leaves the meat behind. He'll eat the kibble, but I would prefer he get some canned food as well.

My female of the same age would eat at least an entire can of wet food a day if I let her (she eats like a horse), so I'm also concerned about what'll happen as I begin trying to feed them in the same room.

Oy. Any suggestions?

[Brandi]

I need to ponder this?

[jesvetmed]

Have to enter my two cents here...
Multiple studies have shown that a majority of dogs and cats fed raw diets shed salmonella and even ecoli in their stools. They are not sick, but they can spread the bacteria around their environment. Especially at risk in these situations are people with less than average immune-systems (ie children and elderly, or anyone with illness or on immune-suppressant drugs).

I know that many clients SWEAR by the health of their pets since starting to add raw diets, but the risks are definitely there.

[jesvetmed]

Have to enter my two cents here...
Multiple studies have shown that a majority of dogs and cats fed raw diets shed salmonella and even ecoli in their stools. They are not sick, but they can spread the bacteria around their environment. Especially at risk in these situations are people with less than average immune-systems (ie children and elderly, or anyone with illness or on immune-suppressant drugs).

I know that many clients SWEAR by the health of their pets since starting to add raw diets, but the risks are definitely there.

OK.. I'm off the soap box!

[Brandi]

I would not worry about him not eating the wet food at this point. As long as he is eating the kibble and getting food and clean water the other will work itself out.
I have a cat who will only eat the juice as well. And the other cats finish the rest of he's food for him.
There is a lot of pro's and con's to wet food and everyone has thier opinions. My cats go outside during the day, but the cat door gets closed at night. In order to get them all inside I give them wet food. It works well and even though it is the wet version of thier dry food they still think it is a treat.

[smilingcat]

To reduce the risk of cross contamination from salmonella and E. Coli, we take the whole chicken less the organ meat, dunk it in stock pot (a small one: 16 qts) full of boiling hot water for about a minute to kill any surface bacteria. Then we grind up the whole chicken with the bones. portion it out for each serving and freeze. The bone doesn't get cooked. Meat only gets cooked on the surface. Cats love it and they get all their micro-nutrient from the bone... Chicken at $1.00/lb. organ meat removed, "pasturized", ground, and frozen may cost $1.25/lb. versus canned premium food of $1.30 per 5.5oz.

We have one older cat who just had a full senior check up. Blood work, urine test etc. His urine pH was on the high side. We think its because of his preference for the dry food. The ash content in the dry food is much higher than the wet food. We are hoping to get him back onto the wet food and raw chicken. He avoided the wet food because of his teeth. Poor guy has lost half of his teeth over the years and just had three more pulled after his check up and dental cleaning.

Evo is good, California Natural is good. Wellness wet is good, the dry have about 5% ash content.

If you decide to grind your chicken please let me know. There are few guidelines. And why you don't want to feed preground meat.

smilingcat

[Eden]

Hey everyone - need some food advice here now. My poor boy kitty had a urinary obstruction last night (He'll be OK - I caught it very early, before he got backed up and very sick so that was good). I really do not want to have to start feeding him Hills..... (or any of the other brands from Menu foods - we don't care if we poison your pets....), but at least one vet tech I talked to is convinced that its the only cat food that work for crystal prone kitties.

Does anyone else know of a good cat food with good ingredients (NO glutens, fillers, junk... preferably no grains at all) formulated for cats prone to urinary crystals? I'd also prefer to keep him mainly on canned, since that is good for cat's UT health as well.

[mimitabby]

Eden, i'll talk to you tomorrow; i have some ideas.

and to jesvetmed, all manure/ feces has E Coli in it. all mammals need it to process their food through the intestines. Handling of manure/feces should be done carefully, whether you feed said pet friskies or raw liver.

The raw food that i feed my cats is human grade (i buy it at the supermarket) and my own processing of it is very meticulous. Say what you want, but it's already changed one of my cats dramatically; she lost weight (she's a food hound) her fur has gotten less coarse and she's become more playful. And she'll be seven this year.

[ccnyc]

Eden,

What kind of crystals does your kitty have... struvite or oxalate? If they are struvite crystals (the urine pH is on the alkaline side) you can add l-methionine (on a short-term basis) to the canned food. That is what the Rx foods contain to prevent crystal formation. Oxalate crystals (acidic pH) are harder to get rid of. Also, chicken or turkey gizzards are very high in methionine so it's good to add these to the diet on a regular basis if crystals are struvite.
Here's some info on l-methionine:
http://www.wellvet.com/methiphan.html
HTH,
Carol

[ccnyc]

The raw food that i feed my cats is human grade (i buy it at the supermarket) and my own processing of it is very meticulous. Say what you want, but it's already changed one of my cats dramatically; she lost weight (she's a food hound) her fur has gotten less coarse and she's become more playful. And she'll be seven this year.

Just for the record, I've been feeding a balanced raw diet, that I prepare myself, to my two cats for the last eight years and I've never had any incidence of food poisoning, salmonella, etc. in either myself, my DH or my cats. I use safe food handling methods and never use pre-ground meat, I grind everything myself.

I don't want anyone to get scared away from feeding the most feline appropriate diet, short of letting the cats catch their own food.
Carol

[Eden]

Eden,

What kind of crystals does your kitty have... struvite or oxalate? If they are struvite crystals (the urine pH is on the alkaline side) you can add l-methionine (on a short-term basis) to the canned food. That is what the Rx foods contain to prevent crystal formation. Oxalate crystals (acidic pH) are harder to get rid of. Also, chicken or turkey gizzards are very high in methionine so it's good to add these to the diet on a regular basis if crystals are struvite.
Here's some info on l-methionine:
http://www.wellvet.com/methiphan.html
HTH,
Carol

Fortunately he has struvite crystals - which I understand are much easier to control with diet.

[ccnyc]

Fortunately he has struvite crystals - which I understand are much easier to control with diet.

Oxalate crystals are treated only with surgery, AFAIK. I suggest you talk with your vet about using l-methionine with you kitty's current canned food (or one w/o grains would be even better). L-methionine shouldn't be used without some supervision such as urine pH testing by you or your vet because it is possible to drive the pH too low (creating oxalate crystals) and you want to avoid that.
BTW, chicken breast meat has even more l-methionine than gizzards.

I don't know of any quality, grainless canned foods that are specific for crystals, but here are some good grainless canned/wet food brands (NOT all varieties are grainless, you need to read labels):

Nature Organics, Wellness, Nature’s Variety, Merrick, Natural Balance, EVO, Addiction, and Ziwipeak
Carol

[Eden]

Ziwi Peak is what I feed him now - though I have been supplementing with a little dry food (Natural Balance Duck and Green Pea)- that I think needs to be discontinued completely even though it is a grain free variety also. I'm not so sure that it is a coincidence that a month or two after I started using that particular dry food brand that he developed this problem! (I switched from Avoderm 2 bags ago)

I get the feeling my vet may not be too open to alternatives.... they are carriers of the Hills brand... We'll see when I speak to them. There is a newer vet there who seems more open minded.

[bmccasland]

I'll throw this question out...
Have 3 cats, aged 14, 13, and 1. Eldest, Bonnie has hyperthyroid and is on thyroid meds 2x/day. Next oldest, Herald, is diet controlled diabetic, and eats Science Diet W/D. Youngest and newest cat, Callie is a piglet, but no health problems. Currently Bonnie and Callie eat the same diet, I was switching from Science Diet indoor to Wellness dry and canned. I've noticed that they now poop more. Callie prefers the Science Diet, and tries her best to eat Herald's food, but waits until he walks away. Since he gets specific portions per day, I discourage this because it makes it too difficult to keep up with his daily intake.

I don't own a meat grinder (yet?). And don't have a lot of freezer space. So I highly doubt I'd pasturize and grind up a chicken on a regular basis.

So, Bonnie needs more calories, and Callie needs less even though she's younger and more active. I realize cats are obligate carnivores, and this thread has made me more aware of the contents of their food.

I haven't been back to Petsmart to check out the various options, besides what I've been feeding them. And I haven't needed to take someone to the vet to pick her brain. Soon I'll need to buy more cat food, but won't be going back to Wellness dry. May or may not continue the Wellness canned. If it were an ideal world, Bonnie would get off her meds, Herald's blood sugar would stabilize, and Callie will live a long healthy life. I've buried one kitty from chronic immune system problems (Erin), and would like to keep the rest happy and healthy.

So what does the crystal ball or the jeanie in the bottle recommend?

[wackyjacky1]

This is an amazingly useful website for info on feeding cats: http://catinfo.org/

Because of what I learned there, I switched my male cat with FLUTD from Prescription c/d to PetGuard canned. He has remained perfectly healthy and crystal-free. The kitten I rescued back in August is also eating PetGuard and is positively flourishing.