Im Lou...

[KSH]

I totally believe you. Actually, I didn't mean doing it with little training. I meant training pretty long and hard...but for endurance, rather than any speed. I used to be a competitive swimmer, so I believe I could do that distance with proper training and OWS coaching. I know I can do the bike distance. I'm guessing I could walk the whole way (not happily, not without pain, probably not without injury). I don't mean this is a foregone conclusion...just that I think I could endurance train enough to somehow struggle through the distance, if everything went just right, someday.

But, all this to make my point: once you add in the time limit...Oh My Gosh...I am not at all sure I could EVER do it, despite the right training program. So, I definitely agree with you...the time limit MEANS SOMETHING!

Well, I'll all about the endurance and not speed. I have come to the realization that I'll never be fast on the bike and run. Fine. Then I need to be consistent and even and keep going. I can do that.

The time limit does mean something and it should mean becoming and Ironman or not... and the difference between getting a finishers medal or not. We aren't in Pre-K, everyone doesn't need a medal to feel good about themselves.

I realized this morning that some people race an IM to reach a certain time goal... I will be racing against the clock... counting down every minute to ensure that I make it in under 17 hours. Everytime I stop moving is more more minute I add to not finishing. So, even though I won't be placing in my AG, I have to keep moving no matter what.

[Running Mommy]

"I realized this morning that some people race an IM to reach a certain time goal... I will be racing against the clock... counting down every minute to ensure that I make it in under 17 hours. Everytime I stop moving is more more minute I add to not finishing. So, even though I won't be placing in my AG, I have to keep moving no matter what."

Yep! I do the SAME THING! Some people have planned "stops" on the bike, but I don't. I only stop if I absolutely need something- or to go potty. I figure coasting at 10 mph while I fish something out of my bento, or refill a bottle is still faster than stopping. And when I'm on the run if I must walk, then I tell myself to walk with purpose. This year I had someone come by me and say "MAN! You have a fast walk pace!"... Yeah, it's not suppose to be a stroll.
Yes, I'm slow and prolly always will be. I just don't think thick girls are mean't to be fast. At least not THIS thick girl. I've lost 13 lbs in the last five weeks, and while I'm looking better, I'm still thick. Just a smaller version of a stump...
But I do have time goals, and I do try to get faster. I'm starting to see time gains in my riding. Last year I was riding between 15-16 mph average, now I'm at 16-17 mph. Hopefully as the weight disappears the speed will re-appear. But I have no dillusions of pulling off a 5 hour bike split at IMAZ 08.
But dang it if I'm not gonna try.
You know, I think that's the difference between people who "do" an Ironman, and people who ARE (because it's in their dna) an Ironman. An Ironman goes out there and does their very best for that given day. They leave it out on the course.
They respect the race for what it is. And to them, it's not just a fad...

[alpinerabbit]

erm..... amen?

[KSH]

Yep! I do the SAME THING! Some people have planned "stops" on the bike, but I don't. I only stop if I absolutely need something- or to go potty. I figure coasting at 10 mph while I fish something out of my bento, or refill a bottle is still faster than stopping. And when I'm on the run if I must walk, then I tell myself to walk with purpose. This year I had someone come by me and say "MAN! You have a fast walk pace!"... Yeah, it's not suppose to be a stroll.

Yes, I'm slow and prolly always will be. I just don't think thick girls are mean't to be fast. At least not THIS thick girl. I've lost 13 lbs in the last five weeks, and while I'm looking better, I'm still thick. Just a smaller version of a stump...

But I do have time goals, and I do try to get faster. I'm starting to see time gains in my riding. Last year I was riding between 15-16 mph average, now I'm at 16-17 mph. Hopefully as the weight disappears the speed will re-appear. But I have no dillusions of pulling off a 5 hour bike split at IMAZ 08.
But dang it if I'm not gonna try.

You know, I think that's the difference between people who "do" an Ironman, and people who ARE (because it's in their dna) an Ironman. An Ironman goes out there and does their very best for that given day. They leave it out on the course.

They respect the race for what it is. And to them, it's not just a fad...

Well, I do see myself having to get off the bike 2 or 3 times on the course. Quickly, but I will need some rest stops. Honestly, I don't think my back/butt/neck could hold up 112 miles without getting off and stretching. But, I'll have to be quick because 10 minutes too long might mean me not finishing in 17 hours.

You have lost 13 pounds... AWESOME! Congrats!

A 16-17 average is good! And if you can ride 112 miles in training at that pace you can do it on the course too.

I hear ya about respecting the race. I found this post on my other forum to a thread about who signed up for IMKY 08:

I watched the race Sunday and stuck around Monday to register. It looked like an absolute blast. This will be my first IM attempt. To be honest, I've never swam and I start swim lessons next Tuesday. I'm going to signup for a 1/2 IM next July. I've never done a tri as I just started biking this year. There was just way too much energy down there though for me not to give it a shot! See you there!

OK, so this person who has NEVER swam, NEVER done a tri... and who just started biking THIS year... signed up for an IM.

What the heck is this guy thinking? I think he just got caught up in the moment and went with it. But I don't think he respects the distance. It's not as easy as he may have thought it looked.

I guess I also get kind of irked when people don't respect doing tri's in general and show this through haphazard training. You know the ones... "OH! I'm going to do a tri"... but yet they don't train for it. There is a journey to race day. Being a triathlete isn't just racing... it's training too. People who don't think that they need to train... well it kind of disrespects the sport.

[Running Mommy]

Your preaching to the choir girl, preaching to the choir!!

I wrote an email to the guys at Ironmantalk to get their take on it. Hopefully they talk about it in a future podcast.

I guess it's like everything, once it gains popularity it gets watered down.
Thats another reason why the water noodle thing at the danskin races bugs me so much. I'm all for encouraging people to get into the sport. I tend to think of myself as an ambasador. BUT you need to go about it right and do the neccesary training before you even think about plunking down your $$ for a race. Be ready to race. It's a TRIATHLON- a SWIM, BIKE, and RUN.. Done back to back... You need to have those athletic skills to be able to do one.

When I decided I wanted to get into triathlon the first thing I did was sign up for swim lessons at the Y. It wasn't until I could swim 30 laps that I decided I was ready to sign on the dotted line. Am I saying that you need to be perfectly trained and ready to take your AG?? NO. I'm saying you should be able to complete the distances in training, with no real problems, before you toe the line.
And there is NO reason to start with an IM. I know plenty who do. Some actually do pretty good coming out of the gate like that. But I think it's a lot to ask of your body.
I must say that my husband is doing IM next year with very few races under his belt. I wasn't happy about that. But I also know his riding and running base is where it needs to be. So I'm working on the swim componet with him.
I do give him a hard time, and give him the crossways look all the time. I've told him over and over that I don't think he respects the distance. I think sometimes that he thinks "well if Denise can do it. I can".... But Denise has her butt out there training like a mad woman 6 days a week. They forget about that. Oh- and yeah I hear from the sidelines ALL THE TIME "look at her honey. If she can do it. So can you. She's not skinny."
I just want to clock the people that I hear say that. BUT yes, most people CAN do what I do. They just have to put the time and effort into it. I don't have any special talents that only *I* posses. No I have the drive. And that's all you need.

[HillSlugger]

Thats another reason why the water noodle thing at the danskin races bugs me so much.

???

When I decided I wanted to get into triathlon the first thing I did was sign up for swim lessons at the Y. It wasn't until I could swim 30 laps that I decided I was ready to sign on the dotted line.

I signed up first, and then started swimming lessons a few months later. For me, I needed to sign up first, to make it real and to set that stake in the ground: "You need to be ready for THIS event on THIS date" (I'm not so good with vague goals). The first tri I signed up for was Iron Girl; when I realized how poor a swimmer I was I began having second thoughts and signed up for the shorter tri. For me, I see needing to take small steps towards a longer triathlon: short sprint, longer sprint, olympic, etc. That's just me and my overly logical way of going about life. I'm sure some people need a big kick in the @ss to get started and an HIM or IM might be what's right for them. Hopefully the do respect the distance (or learn to respect the distance), otherwise they could get hurt and bring others down with them.

[KSH]

But I guess I want to say that I think that this was a little hitch in the process here, caused by trying to adapt to the water/current situation. I looked at the results and only 3 people are listed as having a time greater than 17:00. These people know the rules and they know that they are not ironmen. We know they are not. I don't think that it sets a precedent for watering down the Ironman overall.

Silver, the cut off at IMKY was 12:30 ish... so about 17:30 hours due to the TT swim start. Which is fine... although they needed to track WHO came in at or under 17 hours... but whatever.... so some people did indeed race longers than 17 hours and get a medal.

My story was in reference to a lady... I read her race report on another site... and she was on the run course and they said she wasn't going to make the 17:30 cut off... so they took her timing chip.

She still finished the course and came in at 18:00... and she still got a medal. Now, that's just not right.

The organizers of the race aren't there to make everyone who is out there feel all warm and fuzzy about themselves. If you didn't make it in under 17:30 (for IMKY) then you didn't deserve a medal.

[divingbiker]

There is a journey to race day. Being a triathlete isn't just racing... it's training too. People who don't think that they need to train... well it kind of disrespects the sport.

Though it doesn't even compare to what you ladies do, this is exactly why I didn't do the Irongirl sprint tri this year. I knew I could do the swim and the bike, and I could walk the run, and I would have finished with a slow time. But I hadn't trained and I thought that it was disrespectful to those who did to just show up and go through the motions.

[crazycanuck]

Ummm Last time I checked it was quite a bit of $$$ to enter an IM..You'd think that if you paid that much, you'd train hard in order to finish in the time allotted.

DOn't people know the time limit...

c

[KSH]

Though it doesn't even compare to what you ladies do, this is exactly why I didn't do the Irongirl sprint tri this year. I knew I could do the swim and the bike, and I could walk the run, and I would have finished with a slow time. But I hadn't trained and I thought that it was disrespectful to those who did to just show up and go through the motions.

With that said, I find it perfectly respectable to walk the run if you are the type who just can't run.

But it sounds like you made a sound decision. If you aren't trained and ready it's best not to race.

[Starfish]

Though it doesn't even compare to what you ladies do, this is exactly why I didn't do the Irongirl sprint tri this year. I knew I could do the swim and the bike, and I could walk the run, and I would have finished with a slow time. But I hadn't trained and I thought that it was disrespectful to those who did to just show up and go through the motions.

OK...I am being brave and stepping in with a little different viewpoint, maybe. I DO really respect you marathoners, ironmen, and other athletes participating in this thread. I hope from my other discussions across TE you can tell that. So, I'm respectfully wondering:

I guess I have to ask exactly how, at this sprint distance, your showing up less than really well trained would have disrespected the other participants?

It doesn't sound like you would have had to use SAG-type support resources, or otherwise been a burden on race organizers or other participants.

Perhaps it depends on what you mean, really, by just going through the motions...and why you were drawn to doing it in the first place. Would it have been wrong to just go out and do it for fun, rather than to leave every ounce of yourself out on the course?

What does a person's motivation have to be in order to be considered respectful? For instance, earlier this year, I did a metric century. I did it as a training ride, to test out some things I wanted to use later in the season for my goal event. I didn't have any intention of leaving it all out on the course, or taking it particularly seriously. I knew I wouldn't need SAG or otherwise burden the official ride. I was doing it for my own purposes. I don't feel I was disrespectful to the folks out there who had made that metric or the whole century their big deal for the year.

Please don't misunderstand. I have enormous respect for motivated, trained, successful endurance athletes. I have extreme respect for an Ironman official finisher under 17 hours (as long as that person also has a respect-worthy character, etc.). I don't think people should do events expecting a medal if they don't finish in the time. I don't think people are wise to do difficult events untrained, and put the organization under the strain of dealing with their injuries or whatever.

But, I just kind of wonder what, for instance, would make it wrong or disrespectful for someone to train up to walking a marathon if that was their intended goal and they weren't trying to pretend they ran the whole thing, etc. I just read a book called Marathoning For Mortals by Mr. Bingham which includes a training plan specifically for walking a marathon.

What do a person's goals and motivations have to be in order to be viewed as good enough for you guys, is, I guess, my question?

[alpinerabbit]

Forgive me for chiming in late again - the cutoff for IMCH, by the way, is 23.00 (16 hours)...

[crazycanuck]

Starfish-it's about finishing before the cut off time..not after.

C

[divingbiker]

I guess I have to ask exactly how, at this sprint distance, your showing up less than really well trained would have disrespected the other participants?

Well, for me, I knew a couple of people who had worked very hard for over six months to train for it. I hadn't done a thing except "run" and swim once and do my normal biking. I know that a sprint doesn't compare to a HIM or IM, but it still didn't feel right to me to not train at all. Maybe it's because I've never participated in any group sports or competitions, so I'm not comfortable just showing up and doing poorly while others have taken it seriously.

[silver]

"You know, I think that's the difference between people who "do" an Ironman, and people who ARE (because it's in their dna) an Ironman. An Ironman goes out there and does their very best for that given day. They leave it out on the course.
They respect the race for what it is. And to them, it's not just a fad...

I completely agree with you gals. I do not think that any 17 hour finisher should receive a medal or be considered an Ironman.

I've completed 7 marathons and they were hard, so I have a HUGE respect for you ladies who are Ironmen. And I do not think that anything should water down the distinction.

But I guess I want to say that I think that this was a little hitch in the process here, caused by trying to adapt to the water/current situation. I looked at the results and only 3 people are listed as having a time greater than 17:00. These people know the rules and they know that they are not ironmen. We know they are not. I don't think that it sets a precedent for watering down the Ironman overall.

I've heard this debate to some degree on the marathon side. People taking 8:00 hours to complete a marathon. Did they run a marathon? Do you have to run every step to run a marathon? My fastest marathon was 4:44 and slowest was 5:18. Do I qualify as a marathoner? Would you run the Boston Marathon without qualifying? (just throwing out questions that are raised) There are people who cut marathon courses. But marathons do not have a governing body that was set forth a time limit like the Ironman.

I hope this comment doesnt' offend anyone.....I completely respect the distance and the accomplishment and the rules set forth for it (time limit).