Speeding Tickets...

[Mr. Bloom]

I don't know if it makes any difference to anyone, but the speed at which roads are travelled can be influenced by a couple of factors. The first of course, is the spped for which it was engineered to be travelled.

But scarily, in certain states (California for one), if the average speed on a road creeps up over time, the state (or county, I forget which), will adjust the speed upward when approximately 85% of the motorists are exceeding the speed limit.

So, if you started off with a road that was posted at 30 mph, but 85% of the motorists drive at 45 mph, the posted limit will be revised to reflect a higher posted limit (if the engineering of the road permits). I would imagine it can set off a vicious cycle, only stopping when the engineered conditions no longer allow for a higher limit.

That probably doesn't help get anyone over their fear of travelling on the road because drivers already go too fast, eh?

East Hill

East Hill, I see what you're saying...but what about Europe? I've driven the autobahn at 2-3X the speed as US roads and felt much safer than doing 55 on a US Interstate. I think this supports speeds approaching the engineering limits, not the arbitrary speed limits.

Of course, the standards to get a license in Europe are much stricter and the traffic laws are meticulously obeyed (at least in Germany where I've driven)

[East Hill]

East Hill, I see what you're saying...but what about Europe? I've driven the autobahn at 2-3X the speed as US roads and felt much safer than doing 55 on a US Interstate. I think this supports speeds approaching the engineering limits, not the arbitrary speed limits.

Of course, the standards to get a license in Europe are much stricter and the traffic laws are meticulously obeyed (at least in Germany where I've driven)

Yes, that actually accords with what I've said! The autobahn are engineered for those speeds. They also don't allow bikes!

Sometimes the arbitrary speeds aren't so arbitrary, if you know why they're there. I remember growing up where one of the speed limit signs was posted for 17? mph on a curve. It had something to do with the fact that drivers noticed it because it was an odd number, and would slow down. Apparently a lot of people had had bad accidents at that curve, and yes, it was an arbitrary speed, but for a reason. Same with your side streets--how fast can you go and then stop on a dime when a child runs out in front of you? You don't want to go so fast that you can't stop in time. Even though the streets could be engineered for much faster speeds, would you want to go faster?

Sometimes I think that the last question is purely rhetorical. Obviously a lot of people do want to go faster, even if it's possible to kill or injure a child by doing so.

East Hill

[Deanna]

I work for a company that made radar detectors. Thankfully we're getting out of the business --I could tell you some horror stories about drivers out there. I don't know if cops are more likely to ticket you if you have one--they generally have picked you out for speeding way before you are close enough for them to see if you have one and only use the radar/laser to get a speed reading without having to pace you.

Regarding 8-10 mph over posted speed limits, that may have been safe before the days of cell phones. Too many drivers are driving distracted to be speeding at the same time. We very recently had an accident on the freeway near my office where a driver was doing 70 mph (only 5mph over the 65 speed limit) who was "distracted" and didn't see the stopped traffic ahead in time to hit his breaks. He slammed into a car, killing 4 of the 5 passengers when their car went up in flames and sending a 4 year old boy to the hospital with severe burns. If that doesn't make you think twice about speeding, I don't know what will.

[Blueberry]

Regarding 8-10 mph over posted speed limits, that may have been safe before the days of cell phones. Too many drivers are driving distracted to be speeding at the same time. We very recently had an accident on the freeway near my office where a driver was doing 70 mph (only 5mph over the 65 speed limit) who was "distracted" and didn't see the stopped traffic ahead in time to hit his breaks. He slammed into a car, killing 4 of the 5 passengers when their car went up in flames and sending a 4 year old boy to the hospital with severe burns. If that doesn't make you think twice about speeding, I don't know what will.

Sad to say, but I wonder if the result would have been different had he not been speeding. I seriously doubt it. It's more a problem of distracted drivers and less a problem of speed, I think. We have some roads here where the speed limit is 70. So, he would not have been speeding. I agree it's a tragedy - I'm just not sure the 5mph speeding was to blame.

On some roads I drive, my choice is speed or be rear ended. I'll choose speeding. I choose not to drive with a cell without a hands free device (not regulated here). I don't drive if I'm extremely tired (again, my choice). And yes, I almost get run into by 10 bad drivers each day. Dunno how we fix the "bad driver" problem.

lph - the joke is hilarious!

[chickwhorips]

that is scary deanna. when i went back to phoenix to visit, i was terrified of driving anywhere, specially on the freeway. you have to keep up with the speed of traffic or get run off the road. sadly, i use to be one of those drivers weaving in and out of traffic going the speed of.... well whatever.

i've been pulled over twice for speeding.
once when i was 18 i was going out the beeline highway in mesa, az just going for a ride to get away from my parents because we were fighting. i had the cruise set and all of a sudden there was an officer behind me. he was very nice to me, specially since as soon as i rolled down my window i busted out crying because i was afraid my dad was going to kill me. i think the poor guy didn't know what to do.
next time i was 19. i was going 85 in a 55. oops. the officers pulled me over intent on charging me with criminal speeding. again terrified by the thought of my dad, i started to cry, and they let me go to driving school for it. which actually i highly recommend. i learned lots of legal things i could do that i never knew about!

since then, i've done better (or haven't had an officer around). now living up here there are no speed limits, fastest i go is 35 mph, and that's fast. when i get into the city its scary. there are speed limits, people, stop lights, traffic and your occational moose.

[GLC1968]

I wonder if there are any studies to suggest the difference in 'pull over' rates vs tickets by area of the country?

I've been driving for 20 years now. Admittedly, I've pretty much always considered the posted speed limit a 'suggestion'. I learned to drive in Boston, so I drive fast and fairly agressive. I also drive an extremely 'nimble' car. I haven't been pulled over for speeding in 8 years. (I did get pulled over for an expired plate, but only by a day and my renewal sticker was still in my glove box!) So, I drive fast, I drive a fast car (and have for the past 10 years) and I've lived in 5 states since I got my licence. In summary: I got pulled over in ME twice, in MA, too many times to count on two hands, in PA once (not for speeding and not my fault), in FL, once but it was entrapment, and in NC, zero times. Personally, I think that the northeast has the corner market on a$$hole cops and astronomical speeding fines. And for the record...I've NEVER been able to talk my way out of a single ticket.

A couple of examples...TWICE I was pulled over and asked immediately in a condescending tone "So, is this daddy's car?" (and for the record, it was mine and I was in my mid-20's). One was in MA and the other in NH. My father also got pulled over in MA for passing a cop on the highway (at 55 mph - the speed limit). We were all on the way to my first day at college (whole family, packed car) and we all heard the cop tell him he pulled him over for "blatent disrespect". Nice.

And lastly, about 5 years ago, I was in MA for an internship and my roommate and I were driving to a mall. She was driving (with IL plates) and was coming up on a cop on a 4 lane highway (2 lanes going either direction). I told her to pull behind him and not pass, but she said I'm only going 50, what can he do (speed limit was 55)? I warned her again, but she did it anyway. Sure enough, he pulled her over and gave her a ticket for 'driving to endanger'. He also flat out yelled at her because her dealer plate frame obscured the state name on the tag and he couldn't read it. She was stunned (and pissed) and when we got to work the next day and mentioned it, every single person said "you didn't pass him, did you?" before she'd finished the story!

[emily_in_nc]

GLC, you may be onto something. I've lived in NC most of my driving years and have never gotten pulled for any reason. And I do speed -- not terribly much, but I'll go 9-10 mph over the speed limit often. And I commute 30 miles each way to work, so I do have to drive quite a bit. Worst thing that's ever happen is an unmarked cop flashing his blue lights at me ever so briefly just as a warning. I had just gotten out of being stuck behind two cars (one in each lane), each going about 10 mph under the limit, and I sped out just to get around them. The cop flashed at me, I slowed down, and he didn't pull me. Lucky!

My DH speeds more than I do and has never gotten pulled in the nearly 23 years I've known him - in NC.

So, perhaps NC is a "low pull" state?

Emily

[Mr. Bloom]

I learned to drive in Boston, so I drive fast and fairly agressive.

My cousin in Boston advise that you should never turn your head to look...they say no one will ever let you merge if they know you see them and they can see the whites of your eyes!

That's how I learned to handle traffic circles...with my eyes closed!