gear question to you mechanical geniuses!

[mimitabby]

Okay. there are these different kinds of gear groups. campy veloce, campy record, shimano ultegra..

If i bought a bike with Campy Veloce, does that mean I would get the same gears as another campy veloce bike? the same granny gear and the same speeding gear? or is that a separate entity? I'm not talking custom bikes.
I'm talking more of off the shelf types of bikes.

Thanks

[Bluetree]

Not sure about the questions you're asking, Mimi, but a LBS has this chart/description of the various levels of Campy and Shimano groups. You have to scroll down almost to the bottom to find it, but I hope it helps.

http://thebikepalace.com/page.cfm?PageID=52

[mimitabby]

Good chart, thanks but that doesn't answer the whole question.

actually, that website has a lot of good info on the gears too!

the gears, they have different numbers of teeth. so if you buy a bike with the veloce gear set, will it have the same teeth numbers as the next bike with Veloce gear set? or are some more set up for flats and some more setup for hills?

[xeney]

I think it depends on if it is the same Veloce components. There is a compact double Veloce now, and when I bought my bike there was a double Veloce option and a triple option. I'm not sure if there are different rear cassettes, but probably there have been changes year-to-year. So if you have a 2002 bike with a Veloce triple setup, it is probably not exactly the same as what you'd buy now, when most bike sold with Veloce components (which isn't many!) have the compact double.

And I know that goes for Shimano, too.

[DebW]

Okay. there are these different kinds of gear groups. campy veloce, campy record, shimano ultegra..

If i bought a bike with Campy Veloce, does that mean I would get the same gears as another campy veloce bike? the same granny gear and the same speeding gear? or is that a separate entity? I'm not talking custom bikes.
I'm talking more of off the shelf types of bikes.

Thanks

No. You can still pick your cassette range and chainring options within a group. Though you are limited to 39-53 double or a 34-50 compact double in chainrings. 10-speed cassette options are:

11-25, 12-23, 12-25, 13-26, 13-29, 14-23

And I don't see why you couldn't mix some Veloce components with another Campy group, or perhaps even some Shimano parts if you wanted to.

[mimitabby]

No. You can still pick your cassette range and chainring options within a group. Though you are limited to 39-53 double or a 34-50 compact double in chainrings. 10-speed cassette options are:

11-25, 12-23, 12-25, 13-26, 13-29, 14-23

And I don't see why you couldn't mix some Veloce components with another Campy group, or perhaps even some Shimano parts if you wanted to.

oh, no, Deb, you're going over to the dark side now!! lalalalalalala


but thank you kindly for answering the question. maybe next spring. hmmmmmmmmm

[DebW]

oh, no, Deb, you're going over to the dark side now!! lalalalalalala

Why, because I said the word Shimano?

That info is on the Campy web site. Just because something is available, though, doesn't tell you what some manufacturer will outfit their stock bikes with.

[mimitabby]

Why, because I said the word Shimano?

no, not at all~ ! because you said i could mix up different types with each other. !! That sounds so far beyond what I could conceive of or understand.
I also had heard that if you were mixing campy with shimano, you needed other special gadgets. If I buy a bike,they're probably not going to sell me half chorus and half veloce.. you just went beyond what i can handle in my brain (can you hear the synapses cracking?)

I just don't want to buy another bike and find out that it doesn't do hills because it has the wrong gears..

[DebW]

Mimi, you need to decide what gears you want before you buy the bike and then insist that the LBS swap parts until you get what you want. Using Shimano shifters on Campy freewheel, or vice versa, requires gadgets. But you could probably use any Campy freewheel with Veloce shifters. Or use Chorus shifters with a Veloce freewheel. But do any part swaps when you buy the bike because then you pay for the difference in price only and the LBS keeps a brand new part to sell.

Back in my day, bikes didn't come with "gruppos". You'd get a Suntour freewheel, a Regina chain, and Simplex shifters. Everything worked together.

[mimitabby]

Deb,
here's the crux of the matter: I havent a clue! what would I want a chorus part mixed in with the Daytona or the Veloce? Why would i want to mix and match?
I am so beginner in this respect. I just want a bike that works well. Someone with your knowledge and sophistication surely could mix and match and come up with something way better at the end. But for me it sounds like a rube goldberg contraption which would forever be seizing up. who am I to second guess
the experts? I am still working on learning the advice you gave me to keep me from knocking my chain off !

[SadieKate]

. . . But you could probably use any Campy freewheel with Veloce shifters. Or use Chorus shifters with a Veloce freewheel

Psst, Deb! I don't think Campy makes freewheels any longer!

[SadieKate]

Mimi, what kind of bike are you considering? What do you want it to do? What do you want it to do differently than your Bianchi?

Different gruppos have different things. Some have 10 speed now. Some are still, I think, 9 speed. Some have different cassette sizes available -- as in the largest cog is 29 speed. Triple or double? Are you gaga for all silver components or do you want carbon? Do you want this bike to have cantilevers?

When you have a bike frame custom built for you or if you have a production frame built up with handpicked components, you have the option of buying a gruppo or buying each part individually. But you really can't intelligently pick which parts until you decide what you want the bike to do (racing, centuries, loaded touring, etc., etc., etc.).

[mimitabby]

SadieKate
I have a 49cm veloce. I have recently discovered just how much nicer it felt to be on a 44cm Volpe. I'm not talking about the shifting here, just the fit of the bike.
I spent a lot to get that Veloce to fit me. all of you heard my pleas and laments, and guided me towards making it a bike that I can ride and enjoy.
So anyway, having discovered this amazing fact, that there IS a better fit for me, I started thinking about a next bike. I found that some other bikes have campy components like my veloce, but i was concerned, would my next bike go up hills as good as my veloce even with veloce components? I guess I was thinking if you bought a bike with the same component gruppo, that it would then have the same gears. Deb said no, this is a separate issue, I need to tell them what gears I want and that i could mix and match my componentry. I don't want to mix and match, I just don't want to end up spending a lot of money some day (next year maybe?) to get a bike which isn't right for our hilly rides.
So far, the only bike I have found that appeals to me is the Marinoni Turismo.
If Bianchi made a steel bike like the veloce (in my size) with the cyclocross stuff on it (so I could ride year round here), i would go with Bianchi. But the closest they come is that sweet little Volpe. (I didn't buy the bike, but i named it Pandora...)
So that's where I am today, while it is dark and rainy and when it wasn't i didn't have time to ride anyway.
Thank you Deb and Sadie for your patience while I muddle through trying to understand all this stuff.

[SadieKate]

Mimi, you need to discern why the 44 fits better. Top tube length? Headtube height? Seat angle? Not all bikes climb alike either. The Volpe and the Veloce are vastly different bikes in many ways. Isn't the Volpe the cross bike? Higher bottom bracket, etc.

Have you been on a Marinoni?

[mimitabby]

I have never been on a Marinoni.
A coworker has one, it is very interesting, sexy, etc.
The reach to the handlebars is why the volpe felt better. (the seat felt like a rock slab, which it was...)

the volpe is a cyclocross bike... lots of room for fenders. I like fenders