Seeking Peer Support & Motivation!

[missliz]

Well, I've never been to spin class, but it's an obvious thing to try- The only group that can't drop me in the first hundred yards right now. 99.9% of people at this very cool gym are super nice and freindly, the first gym I've ever used that's so relaxed. Love it. Lots of well used bike racks on the cars in the lot. Not worried about this one insecure non-rider, just motivated. I was wearing a t shirt from a century at the time, so she just knows nothing whatsoever about cycling. And really, it's just a fancy exercise bike with a cheapo seat.
I got really fat while I was laid up, and I think it was more about the size of my butt than my human potential. I think Goddess has already covered this attitude in a diffent thread.
I fenced for 16 years- a super competitive sport where you try to just rip peoples throats out in a certain arena, then all go out for a beer together afterwards. Wish more women understood freindly competitiveness and sportsmanship. I don't get these women who are so super fit from aerobics but never take it outside and play- they miss so much. I show up with occasional black eyes, bruises, or road rash, and they're just horrified by it. They don't get me. I think a skinned knee or two is totally worth the day I rode with a ten point buck on the Racourci Island jeep road. Now a deer, it can really humiliate you. Damn they're fast.
But this woman doesn't bother me. I just need to show this lost soul how it's done, that'd be fun...

missliz

Hey Meg- matte black? How elegant! Welcome, Susan.

[ayermail2]

missliz -

I am confused - what do you mean exactly by a flat seat versus a curvy one? can you get me a brand/model /weblink of an example? I only know 1) cutout, 2)soft padding instead of cutout, 3) no cutout (I have only been riding about a year and 1/4...so much to learn....

my thinking is to ward off injury....

thanks!

[Veronica]

I spin 3 - 4 times a week at the gym. The best thing about is it's your ride. You decide how much tension goes on that knob and your cadence. I encourage all the new women at my gym to try it because you don't have to be super coordinated like for Step or kick boxing.

I also work out at home with my mountain bike in a trainer to Spinerval tapes. I really like those too. For me it's a different focus with the tapes - I spend more time thinking about technique. Spin class is all about heart rate for me anyway.

Good luck and go spin!

[missliz]

So, suppose you were looking at a horse from the rear, across the tail. The back of the saddle is curved like the horse. If you look at the Iron Pony (bike ) the same way, the saddle is basicly the same sort of curve. Walk behind the bike and squat down so it's at eye level, look across the back tire.
Now go to terrybicycles.com and look at the Butterfly, or criuse your local bike shop. Different saddles have different shapes, including the curve of the back of the saddle. Some are deep crescents, some are totally flat across the part where your sit bones go. And many variations in between. The shape can be very subtle.
I have a long history of lower back pain on the bike, which I now know to be sacro iliac trouble. When I started riding again after a three year break I had to take the hard racing saddle off the bike and get something a little more easy going, by luck it's totaly flat as a board across the back, my SI joint hasn't flared yet. A light bulb went off. ( This is a big cushy sprung saddle, the kind we laugh at. Laugh no more, it's comfy!)
Hope this explains it. The nice ladies at Terry tell me the flat across the back saddle is popular with other people with lower back troubles, and my physical therapist thinks it makes perfect sense. Some people just hate the Butterfly/Damselfly flat thing, but we're all built differently.
The saddle thing is just such a *****, so expensive to keep buying them and find out what you need or hate. I can't beleive nobody's ever researched what body types like what saddle types. It could never be totally precise but I'd think they could throw us better clues.

Miss Liz

Trivia- the ladies saddle with the cutout is actually a late nineteenth century invention. The Safety Bicycle, what we basicly all ride variations of today was a major factor in the womens suffrage movement. Zooming around the parks in bloomers was called "scorching", absolutely scandalous behavior and totally the rage.
So we get it from our great great grandmothers! Raise that beer to the old girls after your next bike adventure.

[missliz]

So where do Spinerval tapes come from, and are they the same kind of thing as the classes? Tell me more. Sounds like a good resource.

[Veronica]

We got ours at Performance. I think they have them on their website. The company has their own website too spinervals.com. Most of them are 45 minute workouts, one is 90 minutes. There are 9 videos in the competition series, two in the fitness series. I only have the competition ones (no we don't compete) The coach on them is Troy Jacobson. Each tape has a different workout focus, hills, muscle breakdown, intervals, sprints, recovery & technique. The 90 minute one is steady state intervals.

I find them to be a great workout - a good change of pace from Spin class. Because I'm on a real bike, it seems I can work on technique better than in Spin.


Good luck!

Veronica

[missliz]

Thank you Veronica, that's good to know about. They sound cool.

[missliz]

Thank you Veronica, that's good to know about. They sound cool.

[ayermail2]

I will go look at my saddle tonight - I think it's probably a flat one as it's a Terry butterfly.....good to know stuff like this!!

PS gonna ngo "scorching" again Saturday

[missliz]

As I understand it, the very flattest. But don't sweat it, unless you already have the problem, 'cause 1- zillions of people ride all their lives and never have an SI problem, and 2- the injury isn't caused by the saddle, but by unequal leg strength creating a lot of torque up in the hips and pulling things out of whack over a long period of time. Pedal mashing instead of good spin technique will bring on stuff like this eventually.
Most importantly though, not everyone is even susceptable to this particular irritant. I have hypermobile joints (double jointed) and my ligaments stretch like putty. I also have congenital knee misalignment problems that affected the adjoining joints. And I got hit by a truck. And I'm probably a lot older than you and have years of wear and tear from a really intense fencing career and a lot of nasty skating crashes. You probably have none of these factors.
If your back is killing you, the first thing to try is serious ab work, at least 100 to 200 good quality crunches a day. You work up to this, don't be intimidated. this also strengthens the pelvic floor muscles and stuff in your back. This will improve you in any sport real quick even if your back doesn't hurt. I drop and do them while the coffee drips in the morning.. And getting looked at by somebody like a really good physical therapist or orthopedist (A lot of them are idiots, really ask around) is sometimes warranted.
But this is trivia to you- didn't you just spend 12 hours on the bike doing your first century and having a ball? Don't worry about it unless some jerk (guy) tries to intimidate you with gear inch calculations and you need something esoteric to counter with. Just look up the sacro iliac joint so you'll know what you're talking about.
Actually, it'd be easier to bat your eyelashes in silly fashion and then go find somebody fun and nice to talk to instead.


Miss Liz

[ayermail2]

thanks for the post missliz! I just had to chuckle!!

as for the flat saddle, I was also thinking about my sister - she does have trouble with her lower back in general (been actually laid up a few times...but then she's been much more athletic than I - rock climbing, canoing, kayaking, hiking, etc!) After I got mine, she went saddle (re)shopping and I think she now has a butterfly saddle also....

I am assuming the flat saddle thing can also apply to men? Her DH sometimes has trouble, and was actually using her old bontrager saddle - definitely not the right one for him - about 60 miles in, he ended up turning the saddle around and using it backwards!!!!

[ayermail2]

I think I've seen the bike you've got, with the matte black finish...are the "stickers/words" in glossy black?

It's an ABSOLUTELY GORGEOUS bike! I am so happy for you!

Good luck with continuing to ride...although I am not coming back from an injury, I do remember how triumphant I felt last year finishing my first 18 mile ride! (In fact, I must have been downright jubilant - when I returned from my first century ride this past weekend, my DH was reminding me about the 18 mile mark!!!!)

[NW_Meg]

Yes, glossy stickers -- very elegant bike! Of course, like I said, I put a neon orange 'kill your television' type sticker over one of them. She actually stands in my living room where most people I imagine have televsions!

I have to pipe in on the SI stuff and concur with missliz: i have misaligned knees (trouble since I was a teen with every impact type exercise I ever tried) and my legs are slightly uneven. Of course, none of this is noticeable from casual observation. I too was hit, but by a minivan, from behind, so I was thrown and landed on my tailbone... pelvis actually 'lifted' and landed again. Ever since, I manage to sprain my SI joint at least once a year, and it was always after a few months of biking. The last time was so bad it triggered the whole cycle of si inflammation --> back spasm --> si locks up --> back spasm.... and I quit riding all together for over a year and a half. I absolutely believe the saddle isn't causing the injury but exascerbating it by pushing those bones apart and am switching to a flat saddle this weekend!! It makes perfect sense to me... I can't do crunches but I am doing pilates which is quickly (remarkably quickly) rebuilding muscle strength in and around my entire pelvic core (the pilates 'clock')... Anyway, I think women are more prone to chronic SI trouble, but I think it begins with a real impact injury. Of course, as missliz knows, it's tough to find health practitioners who really understand it well. At least I've had a hard time finding them.

Took my bike out for a spin again yesterday and am feeling more and more confident with each pedal stroke... finally remembering good technique and gradually laying off the pedal-mashing!!! happy riding to all of you this weekend... even if it's just a little jaunt!!! how lucky are we to be riding? imagine all those people who haven't found this love (yet!)!

[goddess1222]

i had to chime in on the whole lower back thing. hey missliz, it never occurred to me that lower back problems could be due to uneven leg strength. i have had chronic lower back problems for a while. but lately it has been a different kind. i go to a chiropracter every 4 weeks to get an adjustment(he doesn't pop or crack my joints, just slow nerve and muscle stimulation). but still, lately, my left hip/lower back/I.T. band has been getting quite tight. also, when i turn quickly and bump into something, my back goes through a sort of spasm. it is short and acute. hurts like hell. my chiropractor says it is a defense mechanism. i am not so sure. i am trying to remember back, when i was in school, and there wasn't a lot of concentration on people with lower back problems. i too am taking pilates, helps a lot. what i have also found is my back muscles are just really weak too. my spin instructor gave me some really gentle back strengthening exercises to do. i am amazed at how weak i am back there. i sweat my brains out when i do them.
Hey NWMeg, with the way you were describing your symptoms, it makes me think i am having the same type of problem. a cycling guru i know told me to go get a deep tissue sports massage and have them at least get the knots released so it can be stretched out properly.

so Liz, what do you think? does this sound like an SI related problem?

[missliz]

OK, guys, I am not an expert. I just came up with a theory- after I lucked into a super excellent physical therapist with special training in SI joint rehab who loves to chat away about her work and by chance mentioned some of this stuff. The bike seat thing is working well for me so far, but I don't have too many miles on the theory yet. I just want you all to understand that I'm no expert. I went to art school not allied health.
That said, Yeah, goddess, it could well be SI joint OR a general alignment problem pulling muscles out of place and so pulling you out of whack. I had somthing very similar sounding a few years back and think SI was a factor, and that orthotics would have fixed up a lot. (Whole nother subject that.) This can get to be various kinds of joint problems over time. Go to Amazon or wherever and look at the books by Pete Egoscue, he's a functional anatomist who realigns people with stretching programs and simple exercises. I have the first book, (cheap! love Amazon) the one with a white cover with big green letters. His ideas are simple, but very interesting. Most people don't stretch enough, get all balled up and carry a loy of stress in their muscles, then the fascia gets stuck like glue and stuff doesn't move back where it should be. Good stretching work done regularly fixes a whole lot. I don't beleive in chiropracters, a good physical therapist will do you more good. Takes longer, but they educate you to look after yourself in the long term. But whatever works for you, OK?
SI joint injuries are easily determined- Know where it is? Look it up. The joint isn't actually mobile, it exists as a kind of shock absorber to protect the spine from the shock of your feet hitting the ground. It's held together by ligaments, and when those ligaments stretch they and the joint get all inflamed. The joint can go into subluxion(pop out of place) and throw you out of whack 'cause the ilia rotates a little bit. Your legs are suddenly different lengths. The ligament running over the joint will light up like a Christmas tree. Your whole butt and back can go into spasm, orthopods and runners literally call it "pain in the butt syndrome". (Runners get this a lot too.)
I bet more general lower back pain could be the beginnings of this. But again I'm no expert. See somebody about it if there's a big problem.
Warning- A lot of orthopedists don't really understand sacroiliac joint problems. Physical therapists usually do. You may just need to weasel a RX for lower back pain to get to a pt and get treatment- Which is essentially Pilates type stuff. Ole Joseph was on to a lot.Back exercises are good, but you need ab work too, make sure it gets the pelvic floor muscles. These pull the SI stuff back together, and really spices up sex, too ,weren't expecting that were you?

Miss Liz