Struggling with buying a house

[Crankin]

I'm going to give this another spin.
Always think of resale when you are buying. Most people don't; they get too personally attached to "their "house,whether it's beautiful or a piece of cr*p.
My advice is given being on my 5th house in 2 states. All sold in 3 months or less, 4 of them during recessions.
OK. As another poster said, you cannot underestimate how much time home remodeling/repairs take. The house I am in now had to be totally rehabbed: roof, doors, windows, outdoor landscaping, 3.5 baths, kitchen, paint inside. Then, there's the upkeep. This is time away from riding.
Are you willing to live in a house that is not what you want inside? We thought we could, for awhile, but our house was totally remodeled inside within 9 months. If this isn't important to you, then it's a different story. For a lot of people I know, those plans to remodel never happen.
So, while house #2 has the acreage,it's not really what you want. And, when thinking of resale, how important are those trails you are going to build, to other people? I've seen several examples of things that were personally important to homeowners (the most obvious being elaborate pools/spas/backyards) that are actually liabilities when selling. Again, you might not be thinking of resale now, but sometimes this stuff hits you in the face, later.
Last point. DS just bought his first house. He was lucky to get a state subsidized first time buyer loan, but with home prices the way they are around here, he was outbid on every decent house he and DIL liked in the more "prestigious" areas. So, this is what he bought: a totally rebuilt/rehabbed 3 bedroom 2 full bath Cape. Stainless appliances, hardwood floors, woodwork from 1905 saved and prominent in the living room/dining room. A sun porch, a finished full basement, with a work area/studio for DS to do his music and DIL to paint. Boiler room big enough for the washer and dryer plus tools and 4 bikes. Downsides: on a very busy street in a close in suburban city that's traditionally more blue collar, plus home to a well known university. Schools not so great, but not the worst, either. No driveway, garage, have to park on adjacent street. House is high up on a steep hill, with 50 steps up to the front. Has a large amount of side land and a back yard. Front yard is a steep slope that is terrible to cut the grass on. Bus stop to almost anywhere one block away, close bike ride into Somerville, Cambridge, Boston. Oh, and very near (but not next to) a major highway. You can hear it and probably see it in the winter.
DS and DIL overbid the asking price by about 6K. They were about 500.00 over the closest bidder and got the house. There were tons of young couples wanting to buy this house, despite the obvious negatives. Why? Because of what my son says... the other houses were just pieces of sh*t inside. This house was walk in ready. The came to us with hesitation about putting a bid in on the house and we said "do it." They are used to living in the city and dealing with parking. And they can slowly look at how to fix the slope, parking, etc.
They are very happy and their friends are very jealous.

[Becky]

I think that I forgot to mention that the perfect house, smaller lot, busy street option is the house that we have been renting for the last 1.5 yrs. So we really know the ins and outs of this place.

In those 1.5 years, have you said, "OMG, I can't stand living here/can't wait to move/hate this place?". If not, and it's almost the perfect house as it is, I'd give serious thought to staying there. I see two major positives: the resale value of a cute house centrally located, and the fact that you don't have to move. Moving in and of itself can get expensive, both time- and money-wise.

[indysteel]

I think Crankin has made some very good points. Given what you and your partner like to do with your time, give serious thought to how much time you want to be eaten up by a remodel. But I'd also urge to you to consider how much either home will require--time and moneywise--in upkeep. I've lived in two homes, one of which was virtually maitenance free and another that requires a lot more. I miss the former and bemoan the latter. I love my current house, but it's a PITA. That weight of that becomes hard to bear at times. Plus, we will never see a dime of what we're putting into it unless we stay in the house for a long, long time.

How long do you expect to live in this house? I think you need to weigh that with the expense of building a workspace for your partner. You may not see a huge return on that investment.

Are you being forced into a decision right now for some reason? If neither home is perfect, why not just wait to see if anything else comes on the market that you like more? I don't know what the housing market is like in Hood River and its environs, so maybe that's not an attractive option either.....

[shootingstar]

Hope you make the best decision Wahine...for a place that you both plan to stay for the next..10-30 yrs.?

Location (close to services, accessible roads) plus a decent inside of the home is always a big draw.

Speaking of which, we were vacationing 15 yrs. ago in a small town-resort area along the British Columbian coast. We wondered about the low pricing of large homes sitting on top of long hills in an area that tends to get grey days and enough rain in fall and winter. A long hill is ok in areas where there isn't much snow.

But not in the region where I live with much colder winters and if there is a sidewalk to shovel, etc. What looks great in one region, is not easily coped with in another region of a country.

More and more locals in our city are SLOWLY finally now getting it: living close to services, transit and parks, etc. and designing communities accordingly.

[MichelleOH]

If you've been happy in the cute house for almost two years...well, I think that says a lot. Buying it may give you time to look for an even better property that doesn't need as much work as the current "second".

[Wahine]

Thanks for all the great points ladies!! This is really helping me think things through.

In those 1.5 years, have you said, "OMG, I can't stand living here/can't wait to move/hate this place?". If not, and it's almost the perfect house as it is, I'd give serious thought to staying there. I see two major positives: the resale value of a cute house centrally located, and the fact that you don't have to move. Moving in and of itself can get expensive, both time- and money-wise.

To answer your question, until about 3 months ago I would have jumped on buying this non-fixer/busy street house I live in at an appropriate price. But two things have happened since then. We live in a resort town that gets very busy during summer so the general traffic levels went up. They also started logging up our road, so now we have logging trucks going up and down the road. The logging has also destroyed trails that we used to access about 1 mile from the house. So now we drive to get to trailheads. Also, the part of the road we are on is on a hill and the logging trucks often run their really noisy brakes while coming down the hill. Both myself and my BF have had cars come way to close to us on the road while we're riding or walking the dog.

Right now I sleep with a fan on to create white noise and that generally works.

The house that I live in is definitely a much better investment from a resale/rent POV. We could easily turn it into a vacation rental for mountain bikers and wind warriors (kiters and surfers).

The only rush on buying right now is that prices and interest are low. So I still have time to look around some more.

I'm getting some clarity on this thanks to you all. Keep it coming.

[Wahine]

I should add that the logging is heavy right now because we had a bad winter storm so the county is harvesting in heavily damaged areas of the county forest. So the logging traffic will be significantly less once that's done. That'll be later fall I suspect. There will still be a lot of cars but the trucks would be much less.

[Becky]

To answer your question, until about 3 months ago I would have jumped on buying this non-fixer/busy street house I live in at an appropriate price. But two things have happened since then. We live in a resort town that gets very busy during summer so the general traffic levels went up. They also started logging up our road, so now we have logging trucks going up and down the road. The logging has also destroyed trails that we used to access about 1 mile from the house. So now we drive to get to trailheads. Also, the part of the road we are on is on a hill and the logging trucks often run their really noisy brakes while coming down the hill. Both myself and my BF have had cars come way to close to us on the road while we're riding or walking the dog.

This clarifies things. With this new information, it sounds like it's not really the right place for you, and I completely understand why you're hesitating about buying it.

If you can continue renting your current place and aren't under the gun to move, I say keep looking.

[Tri Girl]

We live in a resort town that gets very busy during summer so the general traffic levels went up.

I think that's an important point to consider- the touristy side of things. If you can live with the influx of people and traffic every year, then it might be a good long-term investment. OTOH, if the influx of tourists and traffic drives you batty during the summer, you might find the relaxation of the open acreage more enticing.
For some people it wouldn't bother them, but some might dread the summers every year when the town fills up with out-of-towners. It wouldn't be fun to dread the summers every year. Then again, it could be a potential rental unit some day.

So many things to consider... I'm glad I'm not the one having to make the decision!



As fas as resale, I agree that's very important. However, we are considering doing something drastic to our home that will potentially hurt our resale value, and we don't really care. We're about to knock a wall out between two bedrooms to make a master suite- which will bring our home from a 3 bedroom to a 2 bedroom. We are planning to live here for another 20 years, tho, and by the time we sell the house it will be nearly 90 years old. Someone will buy the house for the 1 acre lot in the middle of the city and tear the house down, so it doesn't worry us.
I say that to point out that even though you might make some big changes to the house, if you are really planning to stay there long-term and ae certain the value of the land will increase with time, it may make sense to buy the acreage and customize the home the way you want.

[Desert Tortoise]

Wahine, both houses sound like they each have wonderful things to offer. A lot has been mentioned about rental and resale and I have nothing new to offer there.

You also mentioned your current house is set up for your partner's business. So buying this one would require less investment as far as the business goes. Your job and commute stays as is. You already know how everything runs, is set up as far as communications (internet/cell service) and customer access.

The new house (which sounds awesome!) would require remodeling and building of a shop for your partner's business. Would the business still have the same (or better) communications and customer access? What about your commute? How will that be effected?

It sounds a little more remote. If so, are the utilities ties similar? Are the power lines reliable? Where does the water come from? Sewage lines? If it is more remote, than some of this stuff can be a little different from a town/city connections and there will be additional considerations.

Oh yes, more house, more acreage, more maintenance. That said, living out away from busy streets and in the quietness is breathtaking. You will get used to the quietness and begin picking up on the smallest sounds. (In a good way) Its quite remarkable.

Ultimately it is what you and your partner value most and what your long term plans are. Sometimes talking it out and writing down future plans helps give perspective and direction.

Good luck!
dt

[smilingcat]

Crankin has very good advice.

You do need to consider ease of re-sale. Another thing to consider is intrinsic value e.g. does it have a view? a location to die for?

Have any idea when the logging truck will stop using the road by your current house? I'm sure it's a temporary thing 6 month, a year? Things do change especially with construction traffic and logging traffic. Once they finish the "clear cutting" up the canyon, they will move on.

Fixing the place up to what you want may not happen for many reason. Sometimes, its the cost of remodel, sometimes you realize the inconvenience such as complete remodel of kitchen or bathroom.

Yes interest rate is at an all time low and the house price is nearly bottomed out for now. No one has a crystal ball to say where it will be in six month. But I don't think I would rush into it.

I must have looked for about 6 month before I bought my current house. Searched on line and looked at hundreds of houses and the MLS listings. My previous house, which I still own, I also spent looking at hundreds of houses and visiting over 50 houses. Yes I'm that picky. Both houses have what I consider intrinsic value. Incredible view, close to shopping, easy access and my So Cal beach house has two car garage, somewhat of rarity in the area and increases the premium. I get mail from brokers and real estate agent asking me to sell the house.

So I would not rush yet. You really want to fall in love with the house and it has to have intrinsic value!! LOCATION LOCATION AND LOCATION is so very important.

Take a deep breath and start hitting the internet and search for houses.

[indigoiis]

The other question to consider: do you have to buy right now? Can you wait? The reason I ask: DH and I looked for houses together for about a year and seriously considered two, both with "plusses and minuses". We were ready to put in an offer on one, and then found out it got sold under our noses. Then, we put an offer on the other house. While our offer was under consideration, our RE agent said, "Oh, by the way, I heard about this other house, a farm, but there's one problem - they can't sell until they find a house in Florida." We went for a look and we fell madly, passionately in love with it. It was perfect for us. But it seemed a longshot.

Our offer on the other house was rejected, so we were freed up. So we pursued the farm. Well, it took about a year and a half for us to get this house, and it was worth every agonizing moment. When I walk into my house - wait, when I drive up the deadend road under the trees to my lovely, rural, remote 6 acre homestead (which is 6 miles from any store or "town" and a 28 mile bikeride in to work) I get this soft, easy feeling in the pit of my stomach. I KNOW this house is my home. I have never had one moment where I thought, "God I wish we had more room" or "I hate this kitchen." While these things could use updating/reno before we sell (if we sell) we will do it then. But for now, for us, it's perfect.

It's kind of one of those "you'll know it when you see it" things, I think. If you can wait, then I would wait.

[Koronin]

indigoiis is right. When we were looking to buy we looked at several homes. We rented for about a year to get a feel for our new city. Picked a couple of neighborhoods we liked, but really liked the one we ended up buying in. Actually had looked at 8 houses in this neighborhood, but just knew the one was right for us. As soon as we walked in it felt right. We ended up coming back to look at it a 2nd time because the first time was in the evening and it was raining. 2nd time was during the day light and sunny. We bought it and love the house. Sure there are a few things we want to do to change a few things. We built a raised garden this spring. Next is to get rid of 6 Sweet Gum trees and replace them with 2 Maple Trees. (That will get done this fall). After that save some money to replace the shed. The kitchen floor will need redone at some point, but anything that needs done doesn't have to be done right away and is very liveable. We really like the home and it feels like home.

[GLC1968]

As someone who has moved greater than 20 times in my life, owned and resold 4 houses, and am in the process of doing it again, I have some experience in this stuff.

Let me preface this by saying that we DID buy the fixer with land out in the country. Guess what? Logging trucks, gravel/mining trucks, harley riders and even cyclists who clearly feel the need to YELL to each other to communicate while riding have turned our idyllic peaceful dreams into a non-reality. And NO ONE would guess that our road is that noisy or busy from just a few visits. We live on a prime cycling road (every time we mention where we live, cyclists and motorcyclists always know it) so we thought that this house was perfect for us. It was the perfect size, liveable but in need of some updates/renovations and the property was small but plenty of room for what we wanted with the mature fruit trees, wide open space for a huge garden, room for animals and work buildings...etc. And compared to what else was on the market at the time, it was a dream home.

In reality, all that stuff/land/visions just took away from cycling and other things we wanted to do. 1 acre of lawn, full of gardens and fruit trees takes 3+hours to mow...every weekend. My drive to work is ~40 min each way so I've lost a lot of time there. I can't really justify biking to work as that's 1.5 hours each way and who has that kind of time to spare on a regular basis. And our fixer house is 40+ years old and has cost us upwards of 75K in renovations/repairs (things we often didn't plan like dead tree removal, chimney/wood stove repair, roof replacement that was ridiculously expensive due to regulations (ie, not something an inspector could have known), plumbing issues, etc) in the past 4 years.

So even if you don't factor in the time and cost of caring for our livestock, this particular house is a massive time and money suck that we had not anticipated...at all.

Now we are looking for something in town with almost zero yard and no external maintenance to do. Having the idyllic place in the country is still our dream, but the plan is to do it when we retire and we have the TIME and motivation to do it right.

I agree with others that resale always matters. When we bought this place, we thought it was going to be our last house (unless we won a lottery that we never even play!). Even so, we still considered resale things like size, amenities and commute distance to where most of the jobs are around here. Those things should make it possible for us to sell it once we find the new place. I've seen other homes in our area (comps, for sure) sitting there because they have only one bathroom, no garage, crumbling roofs, or ugly kitchens and bathrooms...but I don't think we'll have the same issues because we paid attention when we were buying (and we fixed everything!).

So my advice? Don't be lured by the house in the country unless you are willing to accept the lifestyle change that it may require. As someone else pointed out, the devil you know is often a lot easier to deal with. That said, do you need to buy now? I can say that 'settling' can be really tough. The problem with picking a place that has a known downside is that there may be other downsides that you haven't even considered. Add those to the one you know about and you could be miserable (or regretful) a lot faster than you might think.

If you don't have to buy now, I'd say to keep looking. At least, that's what I'd do...

[Bethany1]

It sounds like the trucks are temporary from your posts. You like the house you are in. You don't have to do any remodeling (which is a nightmare that I wouldn't put on anyone unless they LOVED this kind of thing) and your business is there. Hang in there a while longer and see if more options show up.

Remodeling/fixer upper will cost you more than you think and eat at your time and sanity. It's messy and having workers tromp through your house every day eats into your privacy. I had to replace the water/sewer lines digging up my entire front lawn twice. I had to replace pipes inside my house requiring the workers to cut up part of my basement concrete. That left dust for months. I needed a new driveway that took a month to get done. We've done other work over the years that the house has needed and even the surprises you get a long the way like replacing the 1980's water heater, heater and air conditioner.

No one has brought this up. If you remodel the house, it's value goes up adding higher property taxes and other taxes. If the house ends up being worth more than the other properties around it, it will be hard to sell.

If you don't need to move, stay where you are and keep looking. You'll know when the right house calls to you, just like your bike did when you bought it.

This wasn't my first choice for a house but it was we could afford and needed the least amount of work. I knew it was mine when I opened the doors. Any work we've done has been upkeep related over the past 10 years as it was built in the 1960's.