Saddle Fit

[Gypsy]

So, this is probably more of a newbie question, but it keeps bothering me and neither my LBS nor my more experienced cycling friends have been able to help me.

It's about the fit of my saddle. Since I purchased my bike, I've been gripping the handlebars like my life depended on it and for the first few rides, I accepted that as part of the transition from a hybrid to a road bike position. But even after a few rides under my belt, I still struggled to get my water bottle of the cage while riding and I could barely stretch up to straighten my back up because any of that movement would cause me to lean forward and feel like I was going head first.

I took it to the LBS and told them about this and that I wanted my saddle nose titled up a bit. On my hybrid, I had to do that too and I figured that when the LBS fitted me, they didn't know how my hip/pelvic area was and I didn't know any better to remember that I had done that to my hybrid.

So, they tilted it a little higher. It got a lot better. I could now let go of the handlebars and drink out of my bottle, but I still felt like I needed to tilt it higher. I was still gripping the handlebars too hard and it really was no longer because of fear or being uncomfortable on this type of bike.

I brought my bike to get maintained and I asked them to tilt up the saddle.

The LBS fitter asked "Where do you sit?"

I didn't know how to answer that question. I said, "Uh... on my sitz bones? What do you mean?"

He then pulled out a level and placed on my saddle. It's a Riva saddle that came with my Dolce Comp Sport. It curves up in the back and has a canal in the middle with a hole in the center and the nose is closed off. (It kind of looks like this one, but in white: http://roysbikes.com/images/library/...k_155_12_m.jpg)

Anyway, he placed the level on the higher end of the saddle and then rested the other side on the nose. Obviously, at that angle, the seat wasn't level. He then took the level and placed it in the canal in the middle of the seat, mumbled some things and wrote down that I wanted my seat titled and told me to come back to pick up the bike in a few days after they did general maintenance on it.

I picked it up, the seat looked like it hadn't moved and I didn't ride it in the parking lot because I had to head home. I've ridden it now a few more times with the saddle, but I still feel like I'm slipping forward on the saddle and the longer I ride, the more annoying this becomes. I just did over 50 miles on Sunday and my hands were getting numb after mile 20 because I had to keep pushing myself off the handlebars.

The question now is...

Is it the saddle in general?

Is it my pelvic region/sitz bones?

Is it my fit?

Is it the bike, rather than the saddle?

I also do Pilates on days I don't spin/ride and I know about the c-curve and using that on the bike to hold myself up, but I can't hold a c-curve on this saddle without slipping forward. I don't know if this is weak abs (which I doubt, since I've been doing pilates for YEARS) or it's the saddle.

I just adjusted the nose up (using a similar level to the one the bike shop used) and this time, I kept the level in the canal and tilted the nose up until it was level. If I had used the saddle back where the sitzbones should rest, the nose would have been even higher and I didn't want to go that high.

I'll ride the bike around the block to test it, but I also wanted to ask here because I just don't know if this is MY issue (i.e. weak abs or something) or if this is a question of the nose being higher and my LBS was just scared to tilt it up too high (and if so, why wouldn't they tilt it higher?).

Any advice/help is appreciated and sorry for the book!

[ny biker]

I'm thinking the fitter is not very good, if he didn't actually see you on the bike before or after you requested the adjustment.

The only reason not to tilt the nose too high is that it would cause discomfort.

Did you have a fitting when you bought the bike?

[Wahine]

There are a couple of reasons you may be struggling with this and what ny biker said about it not sounding like a good fit since he didn't actually watch you on the bike is true.

1) It may just be the saddle and the back portion of the saddle may be angled too much downward for you, so you feel the need to compensate by tipping the nose up. If the nose goes up too much, you will start having issues around your pubic bone so it's not the best solution. What you might like to do is try a flatter profile saddle. Or, you could even take the saddle off of your hybrid and put it on your road bike just to see what kind of difference it makes. It is really unusual for people to be happy (especially women) with the stock saddle that comes with the bike.

2) There may be a problem with your reach to the handle bars. You might be reaching too far. So you may want to try to move the saddle forward slightly. Having said that, if reach is the problem, you need a proper fit because the right answer for you may be to move the handlebars closer to you as opposed to moving the saddle.

When your saddle position and fit is right, you should be able to ride while "piano playing" on your handlebars, what I mean by this is that your finger tips are on the handle bars and your taping them like your playing a piano. If you can't do that, something is wrong.

[Owlie]

I'm with Wahine on the second point, because I had similar issues with a death grip. Are you getting back, shoulder or neck pain? Get a proper fitting. You might need a shorter stem. I will say that some of my death grip issues were solved with a new saddle--the one I got to replace the stock saddle was bad and I ended up doing some very strange things to compensate. But I still need a shorter stem.

[Gypsy]

I'm thinking the fitter is not very good, if he didn't actually see you on the bike before or after you requested the adjustment.

The only reason not to tilt the nose too high is that it would cause discomfort.

Did you have a fitting when you bought the bike?

Well, the person who fit me (someone else) walked by and the person that was helping me gave him A Look and said in code, "She is asking for her nose to be tilted."

But he never saw me on the bike after making that comment.

1) It may just be the saddle and the back portion of the saddle may be angled too much downward for you, so you feel the need to compensate by tipping the nose up. If the nose goes up too much, you will start having issues around your pubic bone so it's not the best solution. What you might like to do is try a flatter profile saddle. Or, you could even take the saddle off of your hybrid and put it on your road bike just to see what kind of difference it makes. It is really unusual for people to be happy (especially women) with the stock saddle that comes with the bike.

Ah, good to know. I don't like my hybrid saddle either, but if it's normal not to like the stock saddle, then I may invest in a new one, because I really don't like how I'm sitting on the bike.

2) There may be a problem with your reach to the handle bars. You might be reaching too far. So you may want to try to move the saddle forward slightly. Having said that, if reach is the problem, you need a proper fit because the right answer for you may be to move the handlebars closer to you as opposed to moving the saddle.

When your saddle position and fit is right, you should be able to ride while "piano playing" on your handlebars, what I mean by this is that your finger tips are on the handle bars and your taping them like your playing a piano. If you can't do that, something is wrong.

I can't play the piano on those handlebars. I had heard about being able to do that in a spinning bike (where I ride) and I can do that on the bikes there. I can't do that on my own bike.

*sigh* I'm going to have to take the bike back and ask to be fitted better.

Short stem and a real bike fitting at a different shop. The fitting should take some time...

Did they get all your body measurements?

Someone on TE might know a good fitter in your area.

Yes, the story behind this is that I went to a bike shop that's close to my house because I liked their people better than some of the other shops that I know around here. I figured I would go to the STORE/People rather than the brand of bike they are selling. This store only sells Specialized and Cannondales.

I was measured, using this contraption that theoretically measured my inseam, and they took measurements of my arms and outside legs. When I got my size, I tried a couple of bikes and settled on this one because it was so much better than the hybrid I have (lighter and smaller and I felt "safer" like I could actually handle the bike -- I do think my hybrid is too big).

When the bike came in, they put it on a trainer, I sat on it in my riding shorts, and the original fitter watched me and lifted the seat, taught me how to change the gears, and then once that was done and I was comfortable on the bike, I went to the parking lot and rode it there.

Like I said, at first, I thought my death grip was just because I was new on a road bike.

But, YES, my shoulders are killing me today after the ride yesterday and they usually hurt after these rides. But I didn't know if that was "normal" or if it's the fit of the bike.

Now that you are all saying it might be the fit --- whether it's the bad saddle, too far handlebars or just general poor fit -- I'm going to have to go back.... I bought this brand new rather than on Craiglists or similar because I wanted the fit part to be right!

I really hope that it's not intentional that I didn't get a good fit, but rather that it's normal that I have to go back, right? I would hate to think the person that helped me wasn't doing his job... grrrrrr....

[ny biker]

I really hope that it's not intentional that I didn't get a good fit, but rather that it's normal that I have to go back, right? I would hate to think the person that helped me wasn't doing his job... grrrrrr....

Well, some fitters are certainly better than others. But it's probably pretty common for people to have to go back for fit adjustments, especially for your first road bike. I think it's hard for you to give them all the necessary feedback about how you feel when you're not entirely sure how you're supposed to feel on a different type of bicycle. Also people are different in terms of their flexibility and how aggressive they want their position to be, which can have an effect.

When I got my first road bike, I went back numerous times over several years for fit adjustments, including a couple of stem changes and changes to the handlebar tilt. I reached the point where I was able to ride without much discomfort, except for very long rides and rides where I was really tense and gripping the bars tightly (usually when riding in heavy traffic).

One day I needed a check on my saddle position (I think I was buying a new one). By this time, I was working with a different fitter due to personnel changes at the LBS. He told me I'd be more comfortable on a bike with a shorter top tube, because I was hunching my shoulders and we were already using the shortest stem available. It turned out that he was right. But when I bought the current bike, he checked to make sure stock stem was a good length at the same time he made sure the saddle was positioned right.