How to get more women into cycling

[Biciclista]

last I heard, average height for a woman was 64". That's a 1/2 inch taller than me. Now, I ride a custom 50cm bike because most bike manufacturers do not go down that far and i got tired of trying to make bikes work. So here i am within an inch of average height, and they don't stock bikes my size??

That means a HUGE proportion of women that want to ride can't easily find a bike!!


http://www.disabled-world.com/artman...ht-chart.shtml Height charts for all over the world here.

[Biciclista]

haha, just read the article. "hang out in bike shops" LOL sure, we've all got plenty of time to do that.

[indysteel]

I haven't had time to fully digest the article, but it pains me that she used the word "girl" as much as she did. It's a pet peeve of mine, but I find it an especially bad word choice given the subject matter of the article.

[Biciclista]

I haven't had time to fully digest the article, but it pains me that she used the word "girl" as much as she did. It's a pet peeve of mine, but I find it an especially bad word choice given the subject matter of the article.

even as she castigates men for using the same terminology...!

[indysteel]

even as she castigates men for using the same terminology...!

Exactly!

[lph]

I haven't had time to fully digest the article, but it pains me that she used the word "girl" as much as she did. It's a pet peeve of mine, but I find it an especially bad word choice given the subject matter of the article.

I didn't think of it there, desensitized I guess, but it tends to bug me otherwise. "Woman" is a perfectly good word for describing an adult female, and there's no need to pretty us up by calling us "ladies" or cutesify us by calling us "girls". (I don't mean in a casual or informal setting, for friends I'd use ladies, girls, gals, whatever as the mood takes me.) But when speaking of women in a general sense where you would conversely speak of "men", just say women for heavens sake!

I'm only a lady sometimes, and I haven't been a girl for 20 years...

[shootingstar]

last I heard, average height for a woman was 64". That's a 1/2 inch taller than me. Now, I ride a custom 50cm bike because most bike manufacturers do not go down that far and i got tired of trying to make bikes work. So here i am within an inch of average height, and they don't stock bikes my size??

That means a HUGE proportion of women that want to ride can't easily find a bike!!


http://www.disabled-world.com/artman...ht-chart.shtml Height charts for all over the world here.

This chart should be shown to large bike retailers in big cities across North America....especially when local population has a huge base of people whose family origins are from outside of Europe. However, I should add that differences in diet have a strong influence on height for those born and raised in North America.

[Biciclista]

i can't figure out how come bike manufacturers DON'T pay attention.... they want more women? build more bikes for us.

shooting star, that may be true, but what I say still goes.

I was at bike expo the other day and there was a booth where this young company was selling bike pants and shorts. I was wearing my amazing wool knickers and asked, did they have wool? (NO) and did they have anything for women (NO!)

too bad, i liked their stuff.

[Seajay]

last I heard, average height for a woman was 64". That's a 1/2 inch taller than me. and they don't stock bikes my size??

That means a HUGE proportion of women that want to ride can't easily find a bike!!

This may be more a stocking issue or maybe you didn't get good service optimizing the stock setups than a real lack of market issue.

64" = 5'3" So you are 5'2.5" I'd have to guess that 5'3" is a fair bit below average height for American women under the age of 60.
Even so, I just walked around our shop I'd say you have 22 choices here of various styles from Hybrids, Road and full suspension mt.

[Koronin]

I'm 5'0" with short legs so I do have a hard time finding bikes to test and typically WSD bikes just don't fit me right to start with. No one ever stocks the small men's bikes ever, those are what seem to typically work best for me. Then there's the issue of you're a woman you have to have women's bikes and women's clothing. UGH! Stop telling me that and let me figure out what fits and works best for me. Also I happen to be one who HATES (truly HATES) the color pink and hates having anything "girly" on anything I own. I like dark purples ok (think royal purple type color) but have no use for lighter purples or lavender. UGH! Personally I'm fine a black, gray or blue bike. As far as tops go, why is that if I find something that will fit my shoulders it's way too big everywhere else (of course I have this issue with women's clothing in general). Why do bike stores insist that I need women's jerseys, when they DON'T fit. If I walk into a store wearing men's jeans and men's T-shirts why exactly do they think I even want to look at women's jerseys or clothing in the first place? Heck the first thing we did when we bought our current house was to repaint the kitchen before we moved in. It was pink, it's is now sand color.

[Seajay]

I'm 5'0" with short legs so I do have a hard time finding bikes to test and typically WSD bikes just don't fit me right to start with. No one ever stocks the small men's bikes ever, those are what seem to typically work best for me.

I generally stay away from these conversations...but my button has been pushed.
I hate to see someone avoid the best bike for them simply because they are angry that the bike industry dares create some difference between bikes that are MARKETED for women. It's MARKETING.

All I know is the bike shop and bike riding used to be a very lonely place for women. Now, there are TONS of women riding. I fail to see the huge problem.
Maybe the industry needs to change the name of the bikes designed for 5'6" and under people.


Many of today's women's bikes are coming stock with REALLY short stems. This is a marketing move so they can show off a very short cockpit. It has NOTHING to do with the way a bike SHOULD be set up.

My customers frequently ask for a larger size to get a more appropriate cockpit length. Often the better fit solution is to take the silly 60mm stem off and replace it with an 80 or 90.
What we try to do is ride both sizes then take the cockpit length off the larger bike and "build it into" the smaller bike.

[indysteel]

I generally stay away from these conversations...but my button has been pushed.
I hate to see someone avoid the best bike for them simply because they are angry that the bike industry dares create some difference between bikes that are MARKETED for women. It's MARKETING.

All I know is the bike shop and bike riding used to be a very lonely place for women. Now, there are TONS of women riding. I fail to see the huge problem.
Maybe the industry needs to change the name of the bikes designed for 5'6" and under people.


Many of today's women's bikes are coming stock with REALLY short stems. This is a marketing move so they can show off a very short cockpit. It has NOTHING to do with the way a bike SHOULD be set up.

My customers frequently ask for a larger size to get a more appropriate cockpit length. Often the better fit solution is to take the silly 60mm stem off and replace it with an 80 or 90.
What we try to do is ride both sizes then take the cockpit length off the larger bike and "build it into" the smaller bike.

I understand why your buttons are getting pushed, but I also sense that you fully understand how WSD bikes are getting marketed and know how to look past the marketing hype to help your female customers get the best fit. That's awesome and I truly applaud you for it.

But not every bike shop owner/LBS saleperson gets this. Instead, they buy all the marketing hook, line and sinker. They're either not adequately trained or lack the incentive to help their customers look past the marketing so that they get the right bike. Instead, they just repeat whatever the bike rep told them as selling points for the bike. And the customer, in turn, who walks into the store trusting that they're going to get helpful advice from the owner/salesperson, often doesn't know enough to challenge what they're hearing. I've heard some variation of that theme too many times--either here on TE or in person at my own local shops.

I agree with you that a lot more women are riding and happily riding, so there has been progress and I'm not implying that the whole industry sucks, but there is room for improvement. I'm okay with the WSD label, so long as shops appreciate that it's just a starting place in a dialogue with a female rider. In other words, we need more shop owners like you!

[Owlie]

I generally stay away from these conversations...but my button has been pushed.
I hate to see someone avoid the best bike for them simply because they are angry that the bike industry dares create some difference between bikes that are MARKETED for women. It's MARKETING.

All I know is the bike shop and bike riding used to be a very lonely place for women. Now, there are TONS of women riding. I fail to see the huge problem.
Maybe the industry needs to change the name of the bikes designed for 5'6" and under people.


Many of today's women's bikes are coming stock with REALLY short stems. This is a marketing move so they can show off a very short cockpit. It has NOTHING to do with the way a bike SHOULD be set up.

My customers frequently ask for a larger size to get a more appropriate cockpit length. Often the better fit solution is to take the silly 60mm stem off and replace it with an 80 or 90.
What we try to do is ride both sizes then take the cockpit length off the larger bike and "build it into" the smaller bike.

I've noticed that certain bike manufacturers have been doing that. Super-short stem so it looks shorter, but with really long top tubes that I suspect are no different from the men's frames.

Certain bike shops have told me that the differences between unisex and "women's" road bikes tend to be more marked in the smaller sizes. Don't know how true that is.

[Koronin]

I generally stay away from these conversations...but my button has been pushed.
I hate to see someone avoid the best bike for them simply because they are angry that the bike industry dares create some difference between bikes that are MARKETED for women. It's MARKETING.

All I know is the bike shop and bike riding used to be a very lonely place for women. Now, there are TONS of women riding. I fail to see the huge problem.
Maybe the industry needs to change the name of the bikes designed for 5'6" and under people.


Many of today's women's bikes are coming stock with REALLY short stems. This is a marketing move so they can show off a very short cockpit. It has NOTHING to do with the way a bike SHOULD be set up.

My customers frequently ask for a larger size to get a more appropriate cockpit length. Often the better fit solution is to take the silly 60mm stem off and replace it with an 80 or 90.
What we try to do is ride both sizes then take the cockpit length off the larger bike and "build it into" the smaller bike.

You do realize that maybe the best bike is NOT a WSD. I bought a Felt F-5 (They do NOT make the F series is WSD to begin with). This bike fits me perfectly. I've tested both the Lexa and the Dolce and they do NOT work. They are way to cramped of a feeling and NOT comfortable. Do NOT assume that someone must have a WSD because they are a women. Geometry is what should determine what someone needs. Granted most unisex/men's bikes do NOT come in a small enough size for me to even look at. WSD bikes assume that women have long legs, short torso/arm reach and narrow shoulders. I am exactly the opposite in all three, I have short legs, longer torso/arm reach AND have broader shoulders. I don't have an issue with the WSD lable, just don't expect all women to be able to ride one. Also don't expect all women to even want the colors that are in the WSD bikes. On the other hand my crusier and mountain bike are WSD frames and they fit fine, but for road bikes the WSD frames do NOT work at all. Just like women's shirts typically do not work at all. My shoulders are too broad. If I can find a shirt to fit my shoulders, it WAY too big everywhere else, so I go for men's clothing as they actually fit.

Also need to add that not everyone can even ride all different brands of bikes. My husband made a big mistaken when he bought his first road bike. It never fit him correctly no matter what was done to it. We even dragged it halfway across the state to our old LBS (whom we trust) and they tried everything different stems, seats, seatposts, and some of things, and could not get him comfortable on that bike no matter what we did. He ended up selling it and got a Felt F-5 (larger size than mine) and it fits him great. Only a few minor fitting tweaks and he's very comfortable on it.

[Seajay]

You do realize that maybe the best bike is NOT a WSD. Do NOT assume that someone must have a WSD because they are a women. Geometry is what should determine what someone needs. Granted most unisex/men's bikes do NOT come in a small enough size for me to even look at. WSD bikes assume that women have long legs, short torso/arm reach and narrow shoulders. Also don't expect all women to even want the colors that are in the WSD bikes.
Also need to add that not everyone can even ride all different brands of bikes.

All good and correct points.
Lots of great points brought up in this thread. There are some really experienced riders on TE.