Soy: good, or bad?

[Owlie]

And just FTR - though kind of drifty - most active people need at least as much salt as I do. What's specific to me is that I eat very little processed food AND I don't enjoy the way highly salted foods make me feel. My neighbor brought over some chicken soup the other day, that she must've made with canned stock. The first few bites tasted good, after that not so much. I need to get it in small amounts throughout the day.

FWIW: When my dad was in his 20s and in the British army reserves (and a lot more active otherwise than he is now), he had a similar issue of just not being able to hold on to enough salt. He started having to keep potato chips around. Good thing (or not so much, now) that he likes them.

[OakLeaf]

Mmmmmmmm, potato chips.

Pesticide-laden potato chips fried in GMO soybean oil.

[GLC1968]

I hate to point this out, but many food plants contain phytoestrogens.

That is true, but their concentration compared to what is in soy (and some nuts and seeds) is minor.

My point was to not eat these things in quantity (and I would say the same of nuts and seeds for more reasons than phytoestrogens) and I stand by it.

[Miranda]

Thank you, ladies! Great discussion thus far.

Well my mom is a breast cancer survivor and has osteoporsis. So those are two specific health things I need to be mindful of in changing my diet.

All this extra discussion about salt is ironically how I started the veggie eating journey. I was having dizzy spells from my BP being high. So I decided to cut out processed foods with sodium, and some other things like dairy (a lot of sodium)...and threw in the no meat thing to boot. My results within a month were a dramatically positive turn-around. Thus, my interest in this type of diet grew.

I have two diet athlete books I am reading currently. One is the Paleo way (gym cycling buddy following this, reading to compare and be able to discuss). The other is the Thrive Diet (vegan based, towards what I think I want to follow). Btw, nice article link comparing the two for anyone interested>>>http://experiencelife.com/article/paleo-vs-vegan/ (jic link doesn't work, google experience life paleo vs vegan article May 2012).

It sounds like soy might not be a good idea as a big thing in my life. I'm early on in my journey learning what to eat. I'm not sure if we have a qualified nutritionist/RD in our Mayberry area I could consult about my specific family health history. Gonna hafta research that some more. You ladies are always so amazing in your diverse backgrounds and knowledge.

[Owlie]

That is true, but their concentration compared to what is in soy (and some nuts and seeds) is minor.

My point was to not eat these things in quantity (and I would say the same of nuts and seeds for more reasons than phytoestrogens) and I stand by it.

In that sense, I agree with you. All things in moderation, including moderation.

[Owlie]

Mmmmmmmm, potato chips.

Pesticide-laden potato chips fried in GMO soybean oil.

I'm sure there are fancy ones out there.

[shootingstar]

I only eat tofu several times per month or less. It's just normal to eat like this. I've always been like this

As for genetically modified foods....probably more in our different fresh foods than we realize. Unless we become a farmer, gardener.

As for what people say about soy...if I can give the opposite: I hardly eat any butter in my food. Maybe several times on rolls per month. I go for months without butter..and bacon, etc. That's it. I don't think I'm missing much....a huge part of the world survived without butter for a looooong time. It doesn't exist in some of the traditional cuisines.

[emily_in_nc]

I never worry about sodium content of soy sauce or in anything else, for that matter. I have low blood pressure and always have. My 78-year old mother does as well. Seems to run in the family. That said, I don't care for really salty foods and don't eat a lot of salt, but occasional soy sauce on broccoli or whatever, I don't worry about. Should I? Is there a reason to worry about salt other than blood pressure? I should add that I sweat heavily when I work out (and where I've been living for 18+ months, it's usually hot, so I sweat hard every day).

[Owlie]

As far as I know, the only concern with a high-sodium diet is blood pressure. Since you have low blood pressure and sweat a lot, you're probably fine.


Now I want sushi. I suppose I'll make do with daikon radish sprinkled with soy sauce, though.

[Blueberry]

As far as I know, the only concern with a high-sodium diet is blood pressure. Since you have low blood pressure and sweat a lot, you're probably fine.


Now I want sushi. I suppose I'll make do with daikon radish sprinkled with soy sauce, though.

mmmmm......sushi.....

This is an interesting new study (has been reported many places). They are claiming a link between excess salt consumption and auto-immune disorders. Don't know how much credence to put in it - but it is interesting. DH forwarded it to me to try to stop my salt-eating ways I do like salt, but since I cook most of my food, I still expect I eat less than average.

[shootingstar]

Hey Emily, my mother has high blood pressure..that's why she had to cut down on her salt intake.

A traditional Chinese meal uses soy sauce....nearly every meal. That's why the amount has to be VERY small for each meal. Otherwise it's like the salt shaker habit for dishes already salted. As I have said before elsewhere, her dishes still taste "Chinese" to me because of type of other ingredients and cooking techniques.

And no, I never add more soy sauce when I am ready to eat the dish after it's served to me at the table,... when a particular Asian dish has already been cooked with abit of soy sauce. I can tell..by various cooking techniques or by taste/visual look.

Frankly I never fully understood the whole craze over tofu. But I shrugged off as something that maybe I was too blind ...because I had it as a kid and never thought much about it. And I never really thought about eating a lot of tofu as a replacement for something else. I already have skim milk in my daily diet. Remember, I grew up in Canada and had milk daily as part of my diet also.

My parents have made the diet adjustments for their children when they immigrated, for very calculated reasons: they did want their children to have the benefit of drinking milk.

The reason why I don't have much tofu now, is that I find the tofu abit expensive in Calgary ....and less brand choices compared to Vancouver...

I don't drink soy milk because a lot brands seem to have cane sugar. So I go to skim cow's milk..

But I do enjoy a lovely tofu cooked dish with veggies..

[Owlie]

mmmmm......sushi.....

This is an interesting new study (has been reported many places). They are claiming a link between excess salt consumption and auto-immune disorders. Don't know how much credence to put in it - but it is interesting. DH forwarded it to me to try to stop my salt-eating ways I do like salt, but since I cook most of my food, I still expect I eat less than average.

Hm, it is Nature, so I'm inclined to give it a little more weight. I'm too lazy to log on to my school's VPN or library thingy so I can read it right now, though.

I'm in the same boat. I don't eat a whole ton of processed foods (my main high-Na vices are olives, salt-and-vinegar kettle chips, the occasional Chipotle burrito and whatever I end up getting at the student union if I forget my lunch (it's not salad, since I have no desire to get food poisoning)). In addition, my mom doesn't put a whole lot of salt in anything (sometimes to the detriment of the dish), so my "why is this so salty?!" threshold for things that are not olives or kettle chips is lower than average. Unless I'm baking (when things need to be more precise), I don't look at the amount that the recipe says to add. I just season with everything else, then taste, sprinkle with salt, stir, taste again... until it tastes right.

[Eden]

Well..... Okinawans have, I think, about the highest life expectancy in the world and eat a diet high in soy...

[KerryCrow]

Just thought I would add to the conversation about soy...I agree with the "moderation" comments. Soy got a bad rap some years back, kind of like eggs. And yes I would make sure to go organic with it, but it's not the devil.

I enjoy the info and videos on this site. The good doctor presents everything with a vegan perspective (which I am not) so the paleo folks will disagree with what he has to say about meat...but his clips are usually well researched and documented. Here's what he has to say about soy: (coconut oil is covered extensively as well)

http://nutritionfacts.org/video/how-...y-is-too-much/

[OakLeaf]

Well..... Okinawans have, I think, about the highest life expectancy in the world and eat a diet high in soy...

And that's the trouble with reductionist approaches. If there's even a true correlation between those two observations, it's also influenced by Okinawans' air, water, genetics, and the rest of their diet - all things that aren't shared by everyone who consumes large amounts of one particular component of Okinawans' diet.

Until quite recently, maybe even currently, doctors used to trot out cancer rates in Ramsar, Iran - where background radiation is extremely high - to "prove" that exposing other populations to radiation is perfectly safe. That's all being debunked now, but not before a lot of people developed cancer and other health problems from unnecessary CT scans, among other things. (Notice how they're taking the backscatter radiation machines out of airports too and claiming it's because of privacy concerns, right.)

We live in a synergistic world. Part of the lesson of that is that reductionist approaches to anything, ultimately turn out to have limited value in the real world. There's no magic food, and there's no demon food either (absent anaphylactic-type allergies, and with the big caveat that most people WILL benefit from eating super clean for an extended period of time). There's no lobby for a Varied Diet, so we're perpetually getting messages about this or that magic food.

I'm not that great about it either, but there are many, many reasons NOT to eat the same thing more than once or twice a week, whatever that same thing might be. And many, many reasons to eat real food always and avoid food-like substances with packaging and labels.