talk me down off the ledge, please

[GLC1968]

As many of you know, I have a full head of grey hair and I am 44 years old. I tried to go my natural grey at 40 but I only lasted about 5 months before I gave in to societal pressure and colored it again.

About 6 months ago, I cut my hair super short to go grey once more and I've been wearing it that way fairly happily since. I am trying to grow it out but I've been careful about keeping it trimmed so that I have a style and not just a crazy mop of greyness. Usually, I'm ok with it (though I have rethought a few things I wear as colors look decidedly different on me now) but every once in awhile something happens to make me question it. A few weeks ago, I had to travel to TX on business and I felt a distinct difference in how people there treated me vs how people here treat me. There, I was treated as an older lady. I can't quite explain it but it just felt different.

Anyway, I've been back in the Portland area for a week or so and I tend to forget that I'm grey. Well, last night at work I was helping a coworker with a new system. I was showing him something on my computer screen and directly behind my screen to the right are 4 photos. 3 are of me and my husband (one taken last Jan, one about 3 years ago and one from our wedding which was almost 10 years ago) and 1 is of my parents. This coworker (who is late 30's himself...so not a too young to know better), sees the photos and says 'oh, are these your children?'

WHAT?!?!

I laughed it off, said "no...those are photos of me and my husband" and that was the end of it....but holy cow! I know I don't look old enough to have 40 year old children if you look at my face but it's comments like this that make me want to color my hair. This guy has no 'filter' and I don't take offense at all, but if he is haphazardly saying what others are probably thinking, I can't help but question my decision to make myself appear older to the world. Ugh - I don't want to color my hair anymore but I'm already tired of people judging me so wrongly for something so easily fixed. I'm so torn. I LIKE being different, but I wish that my version of 'different' didn't come with preconceived notions. So, should I color again?

Maybe I should just get pissed that society has determined that women can't be grey until they are in their 60's.

[luvmyguys]

No advice, but I have a friend who was grey in her late 20's/early 30's, before her first child was even born. So you're not alone!

I vote for just getting ticked off about the assumptions of society.

[spokewench]

You should do what you feel comfortable doing. If it bothers you, color it. If it does not bother you, leave it alone. Only you can know whether other people's opinions affect you adversely or not

[OakLeaf]

Ugh. A law school classmate of mine was grey before she was 30. She didn't color then, and I haven't seen her in person since her wedding about five years after we graduated. I just googled out of curiosity. Yep, she colors now.

Maybe you could do a temporary color to try it back on again - see how you feel about it at this point in your life - then get a "real" salon color if you want to stay with it?

You can color and STILL get ticked off by society, you know.

[shootingstar]

I can't offer truest experience, GLC because I haven't gotten grey alot. Just a few grey strands among black hair.

You need to feel most comfortable. However for your job, it can't be a terrible thing to have some grey hair since personnel recruitment does require an experienced person ...and someone who looks fit/healthy helps enormously. If people already know that your former experience is engineering hands-on, an engineering degree PLUS other stuff, you would be a role model/mentor to others...particular for women in engineering positions. I worked in several organizations (public sector and large global firm), where licensed female engineers with demonstrated engineering experience, savvy plus defined LIFE experience do tend to be respected by their male engineering counterparts. Just a personal observation.

GLC, think of someone who is non-white, what they might have to do express themselves to counteract stereotyping of ie. not being born in North America, when they are. This is why if later I am judged by being older/ageism..... I can't worry about it much. Because I've judged negatively (based on comments to my face) in the past wrongly based on other visual cues.

But great that you have taken steps to "try out" greyness.

[Crankin]

Well, I will agree that in certain part of the country, you will be treated more on superficial looks.
That said, I've made it clear that I color my hair (although I don't have more than a few strands of gray) at almost 60 and I plan to continue doing it for the foreseeable future. I think I look good for my age the way I am now and I like the fact that my co-workers usually guess my age as anywhere between 45 and 50. This is important to me, as they are all about 30-35, with the exception of my boss, who is 40. I have enough other stuff that makes me look "mature," and I think gray would make me look old. My personal opinion is that unless someone my age has perfect skin, gray makes you look old.
Now, I've met you GLC, and you certainly don't look old! However, your hair was brown, and I am trying to picture you with gray. What about going lighter? I have a friend with hair about your color and she had considerable gray. She now gets lots of blonde highlights, it blends in well, and it looks great on her. She's my age and it doesn't look "fake."
I know people have strong feelings about this issue, and you can call me vain. I think looks *are* important in the business world. Of course, I would never comment on someone's pictures like that dumb azz guy, but I won't be one to talk you down.

[TrekDianna]

I think you should do what makes you happy and what makes you feel better about yourself. I've never cared what people thought about me I've always been too much of a renegade my entire life and if you look at the things I have run off to do and the adventures I've had...I've earned the gray I have. I actually like my gray. I have streaks in the front. I wouldn't change them at all.

[Possegal]

I feel for you. I've said here before how my mother was completely grey at 16, so when I started to go in my teens, she didn't have a lot of sympathy. People started describing my hair as salt and pepper in my mid 20s, and by my mid 30s I was pretty much all grey. I die it, and I make no apology for it. (and yes, on this board and others, there are some very strong opinions about hair coloring ) I've also got some serious 'smile lines' (at least that's what they were in my 20s now they look a lot like wrinkles.) And my excess weight always makes me look older.

So now I deal with people thinking I'm 10 yrs older than I am, when I used to have people thinking I was 10 yrs younger. And when the roots grow in, it is worse. Need to touch them up now in fact.

No easy answers. Coloring it can be a pain. I agree with the idea of looking into coloring it but a lighter color. My grey-haired-old mother (what my dad always called her, very affectionately!) always said that once you stop coloring it and let it be gray, it is hard to go back to a darker color and you should look to something light but not grey. She'd say that your coloring changes. Probably an old wives tale, but she was one, so there is that.

Sorry that you're on the ledge. Just saying I feel your pain!

[smilingcat]

I'm sorry but I had a very good laugh. You forget my dear, you are working with bunch of ENGINEERS!! Bunch of social nit wits, a big social ZEROS. Take it with a grain of salt. Remember what HR people have to say about engineers, bunch of socially inept people social IQ is in the single digit.

FYI, I have a big streak of grey so much so that if Pepe Le Pew was around, he might fall madly in love with me or I could be a sister or cousin of Cruela DeVille. My silver grey is so strong and such sharp contrast that coloring was not an option. You could see a strong line across the hair where it grew out. Lot of it has to do with how you feel about yourself and how you project your self. Be the confident, happy self and that is what people will see. If you project a tired and worn out person, they will see that and see an old lady.

My partner is in her 60's but routinely, she is mistaken for someone 10 years younger.

Do what makes you and your husband happy.

[shootingstar]

This is just a side story of something that did happen coincidentally today:

For the first time, the manager decided to celebrate several employees' birthdays during this month. I was one of them (I turn 54 next wk.). But I didn't announce what my age was nor were others initially aware that my birthday fell in January.

However I did tell my supervisor when she was hired 6 months ago.....I dunno..why but I did mention I was over 50. She has my resume plus my graduating year of 2nd university degree. One could guess..sort of. 1-2 times in the past, she referred to me as "missy", which honest, I chose to ignore her. I think she realized her mistake.

Today, she was also another employee with birthday in same month along with 4 others. She made it clear...several times in fact within a span of 2 hrs., that she turned 50 this month. Not sure why she had to tell all of us. I don't think we cared in the end. She did choose to colour her hair 6 months ago to cover some blonde-white greyness. Contradictory, don't you think? Some people wanting to assert their seniority for certain social situations vs. whatever.

[Bike Writer]

GLC, well I'm not going to talk you on or off of it as others have so aptly stated it's your decision. Having said that, your story is compelling me to not even think about the ledge. I've been having a wild idea over the last couple of months wondering what it might be like to quit coloring and just go grey. You story and observations over how you feel others are and have treated you is enough for me to crawl back into the cave and forget about getting near a ledge. You said when you were out of town that others were treating you as being older, those people didn't know the colored hair you, so their perspective is different.

I began graying early, just like my mom. She was snow white at 40 and I was born, she began coloring her hair after that. I'm assuming that people mistook me for her grandchild and that is what prompted her, but I don't know for sure. At this point I'm just glad to have hair at all. I lost it all to chemo in my 20's, it grew back thick as ever but with the meds I've taken for my RA and my last surgery I've gone through a spell of thinning.

[lph]

Aww, GLC, that sucks. You know I've gone grey as well. It varies how I feel about it, on good days I feel awesome, on bad days I feel like a frump.

I've only skimmed the thread fast so I'm probably repeating someone. But anyway: for some strange, obscure reason we probably will be laughing at in a few decades, women are not expected to have grey hair unless they're "old". No matter if they naturally grey at 20, 30 or whatever. And "old" is something every woman is supposed to dread. (What happened to "grown-up" or "adult", anyway? Why do we all want to be "young"? We spend many more years being just adults than being "young" or "old".)
It's dumb, and has nothing to do with reality. We scarcely even dare to say the word old, it's elderly, or senior or something else wishy-washy. So going grey is a bit like not trying to hide or enhance small boobs, or not trying to cover up wrinkles, or in the case of my dh, working part-time "even though" you're a man - you're doing something that's not quite what society expects and there will ALWAYS be dumb people jumping to dumb conclusions.

But for every dumb guy who thinks you have 40 year old kids (I mean, REALLY?! |-D) there are 15 women who pass you daily thinking "dang! She looked pretty hot with grey hair, and she's not old. She's just like me, actually. Maybe I could do that too."

And for all you know that guy is the guy everybody thinks is hopeless because he's always jumping to stupid and wrong conclusions, or maybe he went home that day and confessed to his wife that he did something really stupid that day.

So, do we look older or not? People will not stop thinking that grey looks older than not-grey until many many more people go naturally grey. That's just automatic assumptions because of how we were all brought up and there's nothing we can do about it. But you know - I know some pretty awesome people who are in their 60's. I'm 42. I should be trying to be more like them, not less. And there's nothing wrong with a semipermanent hair colouring either.

We should have a "it's none of your business what colour hair I have-day", and colour it all purple

[goldfinch]

Very good post lph.

I am gray and I look old. I am 58. Part of the reason I look old is that I lost a lot of weight and my face is more wrinkled than it was before I lost weight. People probably think I am older than I am. I try to embrace being older and think of myself as a good example of what you can be like as a retired person.

I never even thought of coloring my hair until reading some of the similar threads on the forum. Now I kind of want to try it just to see what it would be like. I seriously doubt I would stick with it.

We can all do what we want with this. There are so many societal and business pressures that whatever choice a person makes is beyond criticism to me.

[lph]

btw, for a style icon you could do a lot worse than Norwegian writer Hanne Ørstavik:

http://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Hanne_%C3%98rstavik

I'm not sure how the first letter of her last name turns out, it's an O with a slash through it. But google her name for more photos if you can. She has been grey since her early twenties and looks absolutely smoking fantastic.

It helps having a great haircut and being thin and waiflike, of course ;-)

[Crankin]

I guess I'm Peter Pan....
I am happy with who I am inside, I just don't want to look/be thought of as old. I am not sure if this really is a woman thing. My DH feels even more strongly than I do about this. I appreciate having wisdom, but I just hate it when I get the condescending voice when someone thinks he or she is speaking to an older person who has no brains.