Tired of the small sizing....arrrrrg!

[emily_in_nc]

Maybe then, like now, cheaper clothes were bigger than the more expensive stuff.

??? I have always thought just the opposite. I wear a size 2P at Ann Taylor or Talbot's, but 4P if I order from LL Bean, and take me to a Wal-Mart and I'd need at least two sizes larger! I thought it was vanity sizing so that wealthier women would feel better about themselves.

[GLC1968]

??? I have always thought just the opposite. I wear a size 2P at Ann Taylor or Talbot's, but 4P if I order from LL Bean, and take me to a Wal-Mart and I'd need at least two sizes larger! I thought it was vanity sizing so that wealthier women would feel better about themselves.

Wow, that's really weird! I have to order S or XS from LLBean because their clothes run so large on me.

It is true that much higher end clothing (not Ann Taylor but more like Ralph Lauren, Carolina Herrera, Chanel, Versace or the like) do run smaller than everyday labels you can buy at the mall. I don't think the sizing difference between Banana Republic and Target is quite as obvious even though there is definitely a price difference.

[emily_in_nc]

Wow, that's really weird! I have to order S or XS from LLBean because their clothes run so large on me.

It is true that much higher end clothing (not Ann Taylor but more like Ralph Lauren, Carolina Herrera, Chanel, Versace or the like) do run smaller than everyday labels you can buy at the mall. I don't think the sizing difference between Banana Republic and Target is quite as obvious even though there is definitely a price difference.

I wear XS at LL Bean too -- you are very small up top, GLC, as I recall, so I am not at all surprised that you would take an XS. I should have clarified -- the bottoms that I have from them that are 4P and fit are quite a bit older (2-5 years) and and they are sized more like a 2P at other places, so they have definitely done the size inflation thing too. Their smallest size used to be 4P. If they have a 2P now, I was not aware, but that's what I'd order from them if I were ordering today. Their petite pants have been too short in the inseam for me after washing (28.5" which would shrink to 27.5") so I stopped ordering pants from them. The only bottoms I've ordered from them in the past year are a skort and a pair of shorts. They were both XS regular (not petite) and were quite large on me, but I like things loose and comfy down here because it's so hot and humid. Form-fitting clothes just aren't very comfortable.

As for the higher-end clothing labels you mention, I don't buy those sorts of labels, so I will take your word for it that they run smaller! To me, "high-end" clothing is Ann Taylor and Talbot's!

[GLC1968]

I've been obsessed with body image since I was 10. (Sad, but true). I have some of my body measurements from back then (yes, I was a preteen who knew my waist size and my thigh size and my chest size!). When I am at my happy weight now, none of those measurements are different. Yes, there is a little more sagging and slightly less tightness to my skin, but the circumference is the same. Back then (this would be late 70's/early 80's), I wore a 12 or, if the pants were cut well for me, maybe a 10. Today...again, same body measurements, I wear a 4 or a 6. If that's not vanity sizing, I don't know what is.

Emily - you make a good point. I don't wear LLBean bottoms, so you could be totally right about that! My experience was with coats, tops, sweaters and jammies.


You know what I love shopping for even though I'm a tough fit? Shoes. I wear a 7 (or 6.5 wide). I've worn the same size since 6th grade. It's kind of refreshing if you think about it.

[OakLeaf]

You know what I love shopping for even though I'm a tough fit? Shoes. ... I've worn the same size since 6th grade. It's kind of refreshing if you think about it.

Can I hate you? I'm wearing shoes three sizes longer and two sizes wider than I was when I stopped growing in height. But I think it's mainly because first I stopped wearing shoes that constricted my feet, and then my feet responded to not being constricted. Who knew toes were supposed to stick straight out instead of curling under?!

[ny biker]

Can I hate you? I'm wearing shoes three sizes longer and two sizes wider than I was when I stopped growing in height. But I think it's mainly because first I stopped wearing shoes that constricted my feet, and then my feet responded to not being constricted. Who knew toes were supposed to stick straight out instead of curling under?!

Your toes curled under? I think the size you wore when you stopped growing was smaller than your correct size.

[GLC1968]

Can I hate you? I'm wearing shoes three sizes longer and two sizes wider than I was when I stopped growing in height. But I think it's mainly because first I stopped wearing shoes that constricted my feet, and then my feet responded to not being constricted. Who knew toes were supposed to stick straight out instead of curling under?!

You can hate me if you want, but it's not worth it! My toes have stuck straight out and spread like they are supposed to my whole life...hence the 'tough fit' comment. I have a ridiculously hard time finding shoes that are attractive and comfortable! I get super excited when I score a pair, so it's worth the effort for me.

[OakLeaf]

drift, drift away ... Have I mentioned Leming shoes before? I am loving mine so much. I have them in brown and frost grey (which is much more of a true grey than the picture on their website) and I'm thinking about a third pair in black! They're attractive enough for casual wear, I only have to buy one size too long to fit my EEEEs, and they come out of the washing machine all shiny and new.

[shootingstar]

Since I did sew alot of my wardrobe up until my mid 30's, I would agree that sewing pattern size fit jived with store clothing rack sizes for me.

I haven't sewn (much) in past 2 decades, so I don't know what sewing pattern sizing is like now.

[lph]

What's a fit model? Are they the people you see on the store's web pages modelling the clothing? Like that spooky looking woman for Icebreaker?

[Irulan]

??? I have always thought just the opposite. I wear a size 2P at Ann Taylor or Talbot's, but 4P if I order from LL Bean, and take me to a Wal-Mart and I'd need at least two sizes larger! I thought it was vanity sizing so that wealthier women would feel better about themselves.

from my favorite fashion industry blogger, Kathleen Fasanella of The Fashion Incubator

The Myth of Vanity Sizing

The Evolution of Sizing

These two articles have links to even more stuff: the history of women's clothing sizing, more on so called vanity sizing, why the fit of jeans sucks so much etc.

[OakLeaf]

I don't know, but I totally disagree with this line: "garments that managed to survive the era were not representative of the population then anymore than the too-small keepsake garments are representative of women today."

My '80s work clothes came from the same department stores I shop at now, were of the same general quality and (inflation-adjusted) price range. They're not "keepsakes," they're clothes that for the most part aren't very fashionable now but that I haven't yet gotten around to giving to Goodwill. One of my suits I was very flattered to see on a character on the show "Designing Women," if you remember that. Totally representative of what a middle-class woman might wear to an office job. That one too is a little tight around the waist now - that's a size 8. Most of what is hanging in my closet from that era, as I said, is 10s or 12s. And most of it still fits this body that now wears a 2 or a 4.

And then there are the T-shirts that I referenced in the other thread. Plain old event T-shirts. Keepsakes, it's true, but for what's printed on them, not for any other reason. They're the same T-shirts you'd buy in 3-packs at Wally World, just with the event information printed on them. Fifteen years ago I could squeeze into a youth XL, and sometimes preferred those for the shorter length and different designs. Other than that, I'd wear an adult Medium. Nowadays, a youth Medium T-shirt is baggy on me, and so is an adult Small.

I'm obviously not involved in the fashion industry at all, but I think the experience of people like me, Crankin and Muirenn IS representative.


ETA: And I dispute the concept that no one would buy a size 40. I wear a 42 in Italian sizes. I don't hesitate a minute to buy something nice in Italy because of the number on the label. (I also wear a 43 European shoe, but my feet actually *are* huge. )

[shootingstar]

But it's an eye-opener to remember that 1 generation younger than us or more, meaning born within the last 15 years or less, would have not experienced much the big /noticeable differences between previous sizes 30 years go and vanity sizing of today that we are discussing in this thread.

Or just bigger clothing in the same size now, in a range of manufacturers who have created the same garment for the past 30 years.

Unless they start buying or wearing alot of older secondhand clothing from consignment stores, family attic, etc.

It's like saying I remember what the world was like without the Internet.... For alot of people in certain generation, that's all they've known.

[OakLeaf]

Huh? No one notices until they become an adult and have bought several rounds of clothes over the years. I wasn't personally aware of how sizing changed in the 1950s through 1970s. No one who was born in 90s or later has personally experienced what us 50-something has. We can all still read about it happening in the past, and experience it when it does happen to us, can't we?

[SadieKate]

I have a huge pile of business clothes from the last 20 years ready for donation but that still fit me. Almost everything is marked one to two sizes larger than what I wear today.