Possible?: More millenials want liveable neighbourhoods, more transit, etc.

[Crankin]

I agree, Blueberry. I've lived in the northeast, west, and south, and in the latter 2, there was no public transportation at all. Yea, there was a bus in Dade County when I lived there, but it was not convenient. Yet, the city I grew up in (a suburb next to Boston) had 5-6 trolley car stops and a bus system in the 50s and 60s. I know Miami and Phoenix have light rail now, but how long did that take?
I disagree with the idea that I'd rather sit in my car and pay for gas instead of taxes. Sometimes we forget what taxes pay for. Don't like your schools? Your roads? Not enough police or fire protection, or public transportation? In the US, we just don't get it. Taxes pay for the services that make for a better quality of life. And, this system only works if everyone participates. So, when people make choices that avoid paying taxes, it affects all of us.
Sorry to go on a rant; I'd much rather have the "quality of life," than other stuff. I know that I am lucky and can pretty much afford to live wherever, but I have always felt like this. When I was a young teacher, I lived in a studio apartment where I could walk to downtown Tempe, ride my bike to grad classes, and to my parents' house. All of my friends lived in much more modern 2 bedrooms apartments way out in the middle of nowhere.
Sometimes we really have to change how we think.

[shootingstar]

It's better for Koronin to join up with local citizens to express their needs for transit long term.

I sympathize with her because my parents did buy a home in the suburbs and lived their for 15 years in this same city (where I grew up) after all 5 (except for 6th one) left home to live in other cities. It was a nice area but a pain in the butt for getting around anywhere to services/shopping easily.

But still they did have a home out in the burbs within a 15 min. of bus stop..because several of us didn't have cars when we went to visit them. Then later moved into mid-town Toronto. I'm so glad: my father has prostate cancer....most definitely not good to have them out in the suburbs and isolated...away from children..grandchildren.


We have to change how to live at different stages in life. It is for our survival in quality life if we choose to be independent but safe to ourselves and others around us. (Driving by the elderly with increased frailities is not a good idea.)

[Koronin]

Crankin, I'm sure by your comment you have no idea that roads in NC are only paid for by the gas tax. Fire dept is only funded by personal property taxes and the schools, and police are also partially funded by personal property taxes. The property taxes basically fund the county and city on their operating expenses. For the most part state income and sales taxes fund the school systems NOT property taxes. Some of the larger counties are "donor" counties which means they send more money to the state in sales and income taxes than what they get back. The money they do not get back is sent to poorer areas of the state for those areas to fund their schools and other things they need. So truthfully it does NOT matter where you live because if you live in a large county like Mecklanberg you're funding schools for other parts of the state. If you live in a smaller county you may be getting help from the larger counties or you may be in a break even county. I actually lived in a "break even" county. Oh and for paying for public transportation the ONLY thing that funds it is the fees you pay for actually using it. Taxes do not pay for it at all. Due to costs going up, they are currently raising fees AND cutting routes. That is mostly due to the rise in gas prices.


shootstar, about 4-5 years ago Charlotte built their first light rail line. It only services the southern part of the city, but everything I've read and heard is that it has been very sucessful. They are in the process of just now starting the 2nd line which will run about 5 miles from Charlotte to the university area. I'm very happy to see that. They had originally wanted it to run another 3 miles, but they don't have the financing to do that right now, so are going to build what they can. The 3rd line they want to build (which would go to near where I used to live) may never get built. 3 of the 4 cities along that line don't want it unless they are guaranteed all kinds of business and revenue coming in along the line and for some unknown reason they want to use existing rail that is owned and operated by freight trains and NOT respect their schedules. So the freight trains have said either you run your routes around us or build your own. So I doubt that line will ever get built at this point. I was very supportive of it when I first heard about it as I still lived there at the time. Now where I currently live they are actually working on more bike routes and bike lanes vs doing anything at all with public transportation. Which actually I get here. The main employer is the Marine Base. Base housing will allow public transportation, but the base it's self will not due to security reasons. Truthfully without public transportation running routes that would go on base and go to several different areas of the base it just really isn't feasible here as there are no other large employers. Basically the city is around 80,000 (maybe closer to 100,000) now with the extra troops that have brought in. However, of that at least have are military or military families and another quarter to a third are civil service that work on base.

[Crankin]

I know that different states fund things differently and what you describe is different from anywhere else I have lived. But, I guess my comment reflects a general philosophy rather than your specific case. I just don't like it when I hear anti-tax stuff, as many people I have met don't make the connection between services and taxes. When your state (city, town) loses revenue, they don't collect taxes, hence you lose services.
Public transportation is a state of mind that many parts of the US just doesn't want to accept. Not sure how to change this, except that people need to get together on this one. Everyone benefits.

[Koronin]

I agree that NC is odd (even to me) in the way some things are done, although from what I'm gathering many southern states are done this way vs most of the rest of the country. From what I remember, Ohio is done more how you are thinking. (I grew up in Ohio). Actually the town I picked to live in in the Charlotte area has, from my understanding, the best school system in that area and one of the best in the state. Even though I don't have kids that was important to me more for resale value of the home. The only thing Mecklanberg county has done with taxes to help with the public transportation system is that added a temporary small amount to the county's sales tax to help in getting the money to build the first light rail line. If remember right that tax was for maybe 3 years and not renewable. I do remember that it passed. They have not asked for a sales tax increase to help build the 2nd line that I am aware of. Actually found some of the road stuff due to the stimilus package and NC getting some of the money for a couple of specific projects. There were some major issues because Raleigh was not going to send it where it was supposed to go, they were going to use it for who knows what and the federal govt had to step in and by pass Raleigh and send the money to the locales where that money was supposed to go for specific projects. One of which is in Huntersville (just outside of Charlotte). They had put together a request for some of the money to redo a really bad intersection. It was approved as one of the projects to get the money and Raleigh didn't want to send it to them. They did get it and from what I read a few days ago that project is now just about finished and the intersection looks like it should now work much better. There were a couple other projects in Charlotte that the fed govt had to make sure they got the money instead of Raleigh sending it to other areas. Actually I think one of those projects that the fed govt had to make sure got it's money is actually the 2nd line of the light rail that looks like it's close to getting started with construction. One thing that I know property taxes are used for is parks and recreation areas. Over the past 10 years, Mooresville (where I lived) has upgraded and added new parks, including a skate board park, which looks really cool. When we moved one thing the town was seriously looking at for their next major project was adding bike lanes or paths to certain roads. They were supposed to be doing a feasibility study on it.
Just out of curiosity I found a property tax calculator and put in what my home is worth and checked different areas of NC (which are pretty similar for the most part, where I used to live is less than anywhere else and those are all virtually the same). I think used it for several areas of Ohio with the same price. The city my parents live in is less (it's also one of the most depressed areas in the state, think not recovered after the steel mills shut down) and every other city I put into it came up several hundred dollars more in property taxes per year no matter what part of the state I picked. Also Ohio uses city income taxes and not personal property taxes, where as NC uses personal property taxes instead of city income taxes. Actually due to the closeness to the ocean I'm actually surprised out property taxes aren't higher than they are.

I do think in larger cities public transportation is becoming more acceptable in more areas of the country. Not sure how to make more acceptable in small cities where there aren't the businesses and the vast number of jobs in fairly small areas to make it really even viable. Or in a case like where we are when the military and fed govt (civil service jobs and also contractor jobs all on base) accounts for at least three fourths of the jobs for the city how it would even really be viable when the base will not allow it on base due to security issues.

[Slowspoke]

I live in a suburb of the "motor city". Public transportation is a joke. When I was a teen and through my undergrad years, I lived near a Main line for busing. I was able to take the bus downtown to college classes and rode my bike to work. That was ideal. Now I live on the other side of town where there are no bus lines to get me to work. Bike lanes? Forget about it! There are a few suburbs with bike lanes, but they are more for a casual ride than to get anywhere significant. Just in the past two years, more buses have been showing up with bike racks. That is great, but I have also noticed that some bus lines have been shut down. Very frustrating.

My husband grew up very near where we live now. He has never been on a bus and the thought of riding a bike anywhere is akin to flying to the moon!!! He also thinks that reclycing is stupid and doesn't believe that that many people are into it! LOL I think it's his age (40) and where he grew up. Slowly, slowly I am trying to teach!

[Koronin]

I love that we have curbside recycling where we now live. I don't know if they have it in the city we live near, but in the county all three choices of garbage pick up companies have garbage pick up one day and recycling pick up another day.