Women in Sci-Fi and Fantasy/Game of Thrones

[Irulan]

...medieval times... there is that argument ( and that it's fiction, fantasy etc) but does medieval have to mean that all women are chattel, or victims, young girls being abused, with threats of rape and violence as the only means of "controlling" them? Why not present at least one example of a loving respectful relationship? There were inklings of that but Martin likes to kill his characters off. Medieval - Elanor of Aquitane comes to mind as a real person who may have technically been chattel but had power in her own right without being evil or a warrior.

Ah well, author's perogotive. But a society that's been around for 4000 years to have not progressed beyond a wheel and a trebuchet?
One friend of mine likened GOT to LOTR without the magic. At least in LOTR the few women characters didn't get smacked around

I love everything that CJ Cherryh has done. Anyone ever read Joan Vinge? The Snow Queen etc? Thanks for the other author suggestions.

[lph]

Yes, I don't remember the Snow Queen, but I remember liking it.

[Veronica]

It's all about power, not about love or respect.

I have enjoyed "watching" some of the characters change and deal with their moral dilemmas - Jamie and the Imp in particular. Dany also has issues with trying to change the society which she now controls.

I was thinking about that "rape" scene you referenced. I always figured that particular clan was kind of modeled on the Vikings and being "conquered" was part of their mating ritual - prove you're strong enough to have me, sort of thing. Of course that character was married off, but wasn't even present at her wedding.

Veronica

[Irulan]

V- I agree that some of the character development is interesting. After 4 1/2 books the "power imbalances"'are really wearing on me.

[lph]

Anyone else enjoy Neil Gaiman? I'm a big fan, started with the Sandman graphic novels, but I like his regular novels a lot more. Especially the short stories. And "American Gods" - funnily enough didn't like it at the first reading, slogged through one more time and now it's really grown on me.

Speaking of books I picked up Victoria Hislops "The Island", because we're going to Crete next week. It's set there, and the cover was full of praise and prizes. Gawd, what an awful book. Kept reading for a while out of a vague feeling of curiosity, but the writing is just so puffed-up and and ...trite. Reminds me of Adrian Moles "lo, the majestic vales of Scotland". You're told exactly what every character feels at every point.

My apologies to anyone who may love it...

eta:
found the following review, which was priceless:

"You must pay the rent!" the evil villain roared, twirling his diabolical mustache. He was her landlord, and he was an impatient man.

"But I can't pay the rent!" swooned the beautiful, hapless heroine. She was his tenant. Her breathtaking beauty was matched only by her saintliness. (...)

If this is your idea of a well-written story then you may very well like this book, which read more or less this way for 474 pages."

[OakLeaf]

Another Gaiman fan here, though I've only read a few of his. I really liked American Gods and the sequel Anansi Boys, and I don't know if I've ever laughed out loud at any book more than his collaboration with Pratchett, Good Omens.

Re being mediaeval, I call BS. It's fantasy. That means he can write gender roles and power relationships however he wants. I haven't read any Martin, but I've read way too much fantasy with drawn-out rape scenes obviously intended to titillate, even when the female characters eventually get their revenge.

On Paradise Lost ... Yeah. But I feel like Pullman's work deserves to be fully appreciated, and that means being familiar with his inspiration. All I remember from reading Milton in college is dreaming in iambic pentameter.

[Crankin]

Anyone else here not like sci-fi or fantasy?
I really hate it, and I am an avid reader. It was difficult for me when I was teaching, because so many of the popular YA books were in these genres. I just can't get into all of the "pretend." If I 'm not reading realistic fiction, then it's historical fiction or non-fiction.

[tulip]

Crankin, this thread is all about a topic that doesn't pertain to me, either. But what the heck, I'm glad y'all are having a good time. Carry on, I say!