Lets talk Vitamins

[KnottedYet]

Surg - did your doc test your blood levels, or just quote you a standard line about supplements?

I've got ridiculously low levels of vit D and iron (and previously B12, but I got that up to normal after years of heavy supplementation). So far, every time I get blood checks for the vit D and iron the doc tells me to add MORE. Those three are my only problematic levels, so that's all I supplement.

I take huge doses of B12, vit D, and iron every day.

Thank goodness for Costco...

[Chile Pepper]

I've taken a multivitamin for years (it's similar to ONe-a-Day). A little over a year ago I added 1,000 IU of D and 1,000 mg of C. I have never believed in megadoses of anything, but my doctor insisted I try the C for immunological issues and I added the D based friends' experiences. I feel great! This combo really seems to work for me.

[OakLeaf]

Couple of examples that everyone is probably already familiar with but might not be relating, here - one from plant biology, one from human -

* Blossom end rot in tomatoes. Everyone knows how that works, right? The fruit doesn't form properly because of a calcium deficiency in the plant. But it's almost never because the plant isn't supplied with enough calcium. Rather, it's usually either because moisture management issues prevent the plant from taking up enough calcium from the soil, or because excess nitrogen makes the plant outgrow its calcium supply. Lesson: a laboratory deficiency of a nutrient in tissues doesn't mean that a supplement is the cure. Every home gardener knows this about their tomatoes - it's really not a jump at all to human biology.

* Excess calcium/magnesium in humans. You know when you take too much, you start getting those white spots in your nails, right? Which is a sign of zinc deficiency? Except that you aren't deficient in zinc in any "absolute" sense, it's that you aren't getting enough in balance with your calcium and magnesium. Same thing when you're taking calcium out of balance with magnesium and start getting eyelid tics. Or the well-known phenomenon that people who eat a lot of animal products need a lot more calcium because of their high phosphorus intake (the reason why dairy for calcium is a vicious cycle).

Sure, you could go the Adelle Davis route and add zinc, and then copper, and then iron, and keep going in an infinite spiral of just the nutrients you know how to manage, the ones that have even been identified and are available in supplement form, which are really a tiny minority of the literally millions of compounds in food that nourish our bodies. Or you could throttle it all back down to what your body actually needs. Get almost all of it from food and water and exercise and sunshine. I'm not above using supplements, as I said before, and I'm not criticizing anyone who does, but I just think you need to be really, really, really careful with them, and recognize that they are a crutch and a signpost pointing to where we should really improve our diet instead.

[tulip]

I always thought those white spots were copper deficiency. I had them when I was a child and teenager, but not since.

[PamNY]

White spots on nail are often from minor bumps. I wouldn't draw nutritional conclusions based on that alone.

http://www.aad.org/public/publicatio...mmon_nail.html

[OakLeaf]

Well, nobody could bump their fingernails that much and have zero other injury anywhere else on their fingers or hands, but whatever ... that wasn't the point, anyway.

And anyone with an identified physiological malabsorption issue obviously has special dietary issues, just as people with severe skeletal or neurological abnormalities sometimes need a literal crutch. I'm talking about general population and I hope everyone understands that... but I think "being careful" applies to everyone, whether they have an undisputed need or not. Just as I'm sure you would agree there's a correct ergonomic way for an individual to size and use a crutch, and a whole lot of ways they could wind up causing themselves other problems with it.


And I really do need to get with a sports nutritionist on protein, sodium, magnesium and sweat rate. This summer ...

[surgtech1956]

Thanks everyone. Knott, no I didn't have any blood test yet. Whats the difference between 'fish oil' and 'omega 3'? I'm going to ask my orthopod about the Osteo Bi-Flex, since I broke my ankle(tri-meollar) and have some arthritic changes in that ankle. I'm going to get a Vitamin B - probably like a B Complex and maybe a Vitamin D - my Calcuim has Vitamin D, don't know if I need more than that.

[KnottedYet]

And anyone with an identified physiological malabsorption issue obviously has special dietary issues, just as people with severe skeletal or neurological abnormalities sometimes need a literal crutch. I'm talking about general population and I hope everyone understands that... but I think "being careful" applies to everyone, whether they have an undisputed need or not. Just as I'm sure you would agree there's a correct ergonomic way for an individual to size and use a crutch, and a whole lot of ways they could wind up causing themselves other problems with it.

You and I are on the exact same page.

Seriously, folks, don't supplement without a doctor or nutritionist guiding you. Don't follow your best friends' cousin's neighbor's sister-in-law's vitamin regimen, it could very well be completely wrong for you!

I'm snarfing down 8-10,000 units of vit D a day, which barely gets me out of the danger zone... but would probably make someone else quite ill.

Work on what we eat, that is key. Ask the doc to screen for deficiencies before taking stuff willy-nilly. Fads come and go. Even the omega 3 and 6 thing is gonna blow up... it's not how much, it's proportions.

Surg, I would definitely ask the doctor what evidence he sees in your health that makes him think your diet is inadequate. From the things you've posted, it sounds like you've taken yourself well out of the average Michigan food culture and been eating a lot of good stuff. I'd want to know what he thinks is wrong.

[nscrbug]

Here is my daily vitamin/supplement regimen:

First thing in the AM, taken with breakfast - 1 women's multi, 1 Osteo Bi-Flex Triple Strength, 2400mg fish oil.

At lunch - 1 Osteo Bi-Flex, 1000mg Ester-C, Vitamin B Stress Complex, Calcium Citrate, 250mg Magnesium, 1000 Vit D3.

At dinner - Another dose of Calcium/Mag/Vit. D

This plan seems to work well for me.

[KnottedYet]

I'm not above using supplements, as I said before, and I'm not criticizing anyone who does, but I just think you need to be really, really, really careful with them, and recognize that they are a crutch and a signpost pointing to where we should really improve our diet instead.

Celiac disease messed up my guts big time, and I have some hefty malabsorption issues.

Just cuz I take handfuls of pills from Costco doesn't mean everyone should! If anyone has concerns about their diet and nutrition, I really recommend getting tested and working with your doctor and a nutritionist. Working with a nutritionist is a lot of fun, and you learn stuff you never knew!

Totally worth the co-pay, in my book.