Tolerence for high traffic volumes

[Catrin]

Procedural question:

on a multi-lane highway, there's likely to be a considerable distance between the traffic lane and the crosswalk. When you do choose to walk the intersection, how do you get from one to the other - and how do you re-join traffic once you've reached the other side? It just seems dangerous, to me - particularly (presumably) re-joining traffic from a wheelchair cut facing perpendicular to traffic.

Where I ride there are no sidewalks or cross-walks...

[PamNY]

Where I ride there are no sidewalks or cross-walks...

Catrin, so isn't it fairly easy to pull over, cross as a pedestrian, and then rejoin traffic? In case I ride in the country...

[Catrin]

Catrin, so isn't it fairly easy to pull over, cross as a pedestrian, and then rejoin traffic? In case I ride in the country...

There actually isn't any place to pull over, not really. The one intersection that intimidates me the most actually does have a bike lane - and the only thing to the right of THAT is a turning lane, so I just stay where I am. For the other few lights I deal with I can see them far enough away that I can finesse it - slow down enough so that it is green when I get there, that sort of thing.

I think much of this is simply due to not really having to deal with lights, or really stopping at all. Even on my 50-70 mile routes from last summer, the vast majority of them have no more than 2 stop lights (if that many), and not many more stop-signs. You know, I just realized that...

[indysteel]

There actually isn't any place to pull over, not really. The one intersection that intimidates me the most actually does have a bike lane - and the only thing to the right of THAT is a turning lane, so I just stay where I am. For the other few lights I deal with I can see them far enough away that I can finesse it - slow down enough so that it is green when I get there, that sort of thing.

I think much of this is simply due to not really having to deal with lights, or really stopping at all. Even on my 50-70 mile routes from last summer, the vast majority of them have no more than 2 stop lights (if that many), and not many more stop-signs. You know, I just realized that...

I'm assuming the light bulb moment you just had is that the vast majority of your rides don't provide much of an opportunity for you to practice stopping and starting and that works, in some respects, to your detriment in terms of improving your handling skills.

I'm going to stick with my previous advice. Stopping and starting is a skill you should work on and feel confident about. If your current routes don't require much stopping, then go to a parking lot and practice. Ideally, though, put yourself in some real-world situations. In my experience, there are areas of Boone County and western Hamilton County that provide a good mix of true country roads and "city-lite" streets that aren't not terribly busy that do you require you to stop for lights and stop signs. And challenge yourself not to "finesse" your approach to red lights.

[Catrin]

I'm assuming the light bulb moment you just had is that the vast majority of your rides don't provide much of an opportunity for you to practice stopping and starting and that works, in some respects, to your detriment in terms of improving your handling skills.

I'm going to stick with my previous advice. Stopping and starting is a skill you should work on and feel confident about. If your current routes don't require much stopping, then go to a parking lot and practice. Ideally, though, put yourself in some real-world situations. In my experience, there are areas of Boone County and western Hamilton County that provide a good mix of true country roads and "city-lite" streets that aren't not terribly busy that do you require you to stop for lights and stop signs. And challenge yourself not to "finesse" your approach to red lights.

I just took Indy's advice on my 30 mile ride today. I have no problem starting/stopping my bike, it isn't a mechanical problem. I think that it is a fear of getting run over as I start up when the light turns green...

Anyway, I deliberately edited my route today to incorporate parts of Zionsville after enjoying my no-traffic country roads I did NOT allow myself to walk my bike through any intersections, though I suspect that would have been faster. I wait until there is no doubt that I've enough time and then some

Of course I did fine at the red lights, though I did speed furiously through a yellow light but I made it

Obviously this unease is from not enough experience DOING it, there aren't any red lights on my country roads... I feel better after my experience today, and I will keep forcing myself to do this until it no longer troubles me. THEN I will consider more urban riding before deciding to try commuting.

[Catrin]

Had a "duh" moment when I woke up this morning. Of course I feel slow starting up at red lights and stop signs. I don't stand on the bike yet - at all. So of course I get across somewhat more slowly than a more experienced cyclist who is standing on the pedals to get across more quickly.

Am not about to even try this until I return to clipping in...

[OakLeaf]

Am not about to even try this until I return to clipping in...

Seriously, there's no reason to wait, and you'll likely feel much more secure learning to stand when you're NOT clipped in. Just make sure that you're not wearing slippery shoes and that you don't try it for the first time when it's wet and your pedals will be slippery.

How about trying this:

First, just practice standing up while you coast. Get the feel of how your weight is distributed between your handlebars and your pedals.

Then when you're ready to try pedaling while standing, find a larger lawn or a sports field that's not in use (wait for a day when it hasn't rained in a while, so you don't tear up the grass). Get going your usual way on the pavement, then ride onto the grass (use the wheelchair ramp if there's a curb). If you tip over on soft grass, it's much less likely that you or your bike will get hurt - plus the less even surface will help develop your skills. Lots of people do skills drills on grass.

HTH...

[PamNY]

I think much of this is simply due to not really having to deal with lights, or really stopping at all. Even on my 50-70 mile routes from last summer, the vast majority of them have no more than 2 stop lights (if that many), and not many more stop-signs. You know, I just realized that...

I practiced stopping and starting in a park so much that another biker asked me if I was okay. I guess he thought I couldn't make the bike go very far...

[OakLeaf]

The whole idea of dismounting and walking just terrifies me, frankly, if it's the kind of intersection I think you're talking about, the kind that's typical in our neck of the woods.

You've transformed yourself from a vehicle in traffic - albeit a slow-moving vehicle - into a pedestrian, in a spot where there are no pedestrian facilities. Since there are no pedestrian facilities, you've got to be either walking in the travel lane with your back to traffic (on the wrong side, for a pedestrian - unless what you're talking about is crossing the intersection three times, facing the proper direction for a pedestrian, to get across once?), or you're back from the intersection in a place where turning and perpendicular traffic won't expect you to be and can't see you well in time to react. You've suddenly changed your mode of transport for no reason someone in a car could see. It's the exact opposite of predictable.

Never mind the stoplights probably aren't even long enough to safely cross an intersection on foot while pushing a bike - they're usually barely long enough to run across, in good walking/running shoes, without pushing anything. (I've done *plenty* of running across similar intersections in the mid-eastern states from hotel to restaurant because I refused to drive/motorcycle half a mile. It's crazy dangerous.)

Catrin, you've learned so much so fast, I think you're much safer to postpone your commute for a few months until you're confident stopping and starting in traffic. Trust that you will get there and value your safety enough to wait.

I picked an intersection at random that can't be too far from you - so these city slickers can see what I'm talking about. Correct me if this isn't the kind of thing you mean.

[Catrin]

I'm assuming the light bulb moment you just had is that the vast majority of your rides don't provide much of an opportunity for you to practice stopping and starting and that works, in some respects, to your detriment in terms of improving your handling skills......In my experience, there are areas of Boone County and western Hamilton County that provide a good mix of true country roads and "city-lite" streets that aren't not terribly busy that do you require you to stop for lights and stop signs. And challenge yourself not to "finesse" your approach to red lights.

Yes, that is exactly the light-bulb moment I had while typing that post. NO WONDER I am uncomfortable starting/stopping in traffic because I rarely need to do that. You have the perfect solution, and I will also practice in Eagle Creek Park, though more realistic situations would indeed be better for me in the long run.

I practiced stopping and starting in a park so much that another biker asked me if I was okay. I guess he thought I couldn't make the bike go very far...

There is a "hidden" loop in my favorite park where I traditionally go to practice assorted things. This is a good idea!

The whole idea of dismounting and walking just terrifies me, frankly, if it's the kind of intersection I think you're talking about, the kind that's typical in our neck of the woods.

You've transformed yourself from a vehicle in traffic - albeit a slow-moving vehicle - into a pedestrian, in a spot where there are no pedestrian facilities....Catrin, you've learned so much so fast, I think you're much safer to postpone your commute for a few months until you're confident stopping and starting in traffic. Trust that you will get there and value your safety enough to wait.

I picked an intersection at random that can't be too far from you - so these city slickers can see what I'm talking about. Correct me if this isn't the kind of thing you mean.

It is the same kind of intersection, but in a less populated area. There is also a bike lane in the direction I am going - traffic can be quite heavy but I try to avoid those times.. This is the light I try to finesse, and will stop doing that as it isn't helping me. Good point about what this does to my predictability...

Thanks for the advice! I will practice starting/stopping in my favorite park; will tweak my usual routes to include a more diverse range of streets and stop trying to finesse the stop lights... I actually don't have any problems starting/stopping my bike, I just need to actually DO it more often

I think that I will wait until I have this sorted out before my return to clipless.

[malkin]

Parking lots are good for stopping practice, because you can pick a paint line and plan to stop there--and it's ok if you miss the target by several feet either way.