Hogging the road

[jobob]

Thank you so much Grog. (Oakleaf too! And everyone else who has chimed in.)

In particular, Grog's most recent post and her earlier posts are absolutely spot-on (imho, of course).

[jessmarimba]

I just wanted to throw this in here, too...

We are assuming (and likely correctly, but still assuming) that the OP is talking about a cyclist on a road bike. I've been known to do road hill repeats on my mtb, simply b/c that's what I ride on a regular basis. My mountain bike (and please don't judge me for the quality of my bike) would only go 25 mph on a descent if I threw it off a cliff. In that case, I would NOT be "sharing the road" by taking the lane and riding my brakes down in front of a car. Which is why, if it was me on my bike, it would be a better idea to pull off into a turnout. Besides which, I've already demonstrated my aptitude in flying over the bars and I'd rather do that behind a vehicle.

Not to argue with any of the valid points that have been made here. Simply to illustrate that situations may vary. I think the point everyone has made is that we all have to judge our situation and do whatever we feel is safest.

[Owlie]

I'm a little hesitant on commenting here, because I'd rather not be ripped to shreds, but here goes:

I can understand where the OP is coming from. I'm a newbie. I hate descents. I hate riding in traffic. I really hate having a car on my tail. I'll pull over at stop signs (easiest place to do it around here) and wave cars past me because I don't want them behind me. I wouldn't feel safe in the situation described--it's either possibly get hit by a car coming from either direction, or risk the shoulder, with all manner of road debris. I read the OP as projecting her own anxieties about riding on that particular road onto the cyclist--"are you crazy? I wouldn't do that!" I know I say this in my head as I read about many of you bombing down steep mountain roads or the like. And sometimes, I find that gets translated into "I wouldn't do that, so it must be stupid." I'm working on remembering that you all have different risk tolerances than I do.

And yes, I've found myself getting annoyed at cyclists while I'm driving. I take a deep breath, and remember what I'd like drivers to do when I'm out on my bike.

That said, if I were riding down a hill that steep, I'm not sure I could negotiate my way into a turnout. It would be easier on my nerves and on my current bike-handling skills to keep going in the lane, even if there were a car on my tail. I know there's a hill in my neighborhood where it's actually safer to ride in the middle of the road for a little way, because of the steepness of the hill and the way the road curves at the bottom. I'd hope that anyone driving behind me would understand and be a little patient with me.

Here. I brought a plate of cookies. Enjoy!

[PamNY]

IMy mountain bike (and please don't judge me for the quality of my bike) would only go 25 mph on a descent if I threw it off a cliff.

What a great description -- mind if I borrow it?

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

[OakLeaf]

... I've had my hybrid to 37 on a straight (and not very long) descent. I certainly wouldn't do that on that bike on something curvy, not with my skills and the tires that are on it, but I'm just saying... unless your wheel or freehub bearings are seized, it WILL go that fast.

[XMcShiftersonX]

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

haha... this made me laugh... because really, this poor woman has no idea that so many people have been debating what she should or should not be doing on the internet for days! So silly!

[Cataboo]

What a great description -- mind if I borrow it?

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

That's what I want to know.

I think we need video of this woman coming down the hill and pictures of the road. And maybe her gps tracks so we can see how slowly she comes down the hill.

What exactly do they mean by riding the brakes? I've ridden with someone from TE who literally does not gain any momentum going down a hill because her brakes are squeaking all the way down (on a road bike no less). I'd hate to be in a car behind her. I hate being on a bike behind her.

I doubt op would want her to go into the turnouts if they're unpaved.

I just picture it sort of like a driveway or a cross street - if I have a car driving behind me and there is a driveway or a cross street, I just swing into the driveway or other street about 2 feet or so - just enough that they can safely pass, and then I pop back out. This of course depends on the situation.

Everyone keeps talking about unknown dangers that lurk in the turnouts for this woman (ruts? potholes? branches?) - which yes, those exist on hills you don't know well... But this woman is lapping the hill. I'm pretty sure she's had time to investigate whether or not the turnouts have unsafe obstacles and prepare an escape policy.... Obviously, a bunny or squirrel can still run across the road and those can't be predicted - but I wouldn't want a car riding its brakes behind me if that occurred.

[Biciclista]

all you have to do now is "map my ride" and find the hill!

[carinapir]

You got that from the OP's public profile? Not that you did anything wrong, but the availability of that type of information is exactly why our wonderful hosts at TE posted the thread listed below with respect to "best practices" for Internet safety.

http://forums.teamestrogen.com/showthread.php?t=31284

Yes, the OP's public TE profile. Now I feel uber-creepy but the info lead me straight there.

[indysteel]

Yes, the OP's public TE profile. Now I feel uber-creepy but the info lead me straight there.

I didn't mean to make you feel creepy. I just wanted to remind the OP--per TE's posted best practices--that having that information on her profile is perhaps not the smartest thing.

[JennK13]

By now, I am consumed with curiosity about this woman.

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

This was kind of my point previously - there are just some places we shouldn't ride. She can't stop or slow down, she can't pull to the side, sure, she has the "right" to take the lane, but it's only 1 1/2 cars wide; when there's a car coming up the road, what is she going to do if the road is so treacherous that she can't do anything but ride down the middle of it? Just doesn't sound like a safe place to ride, much less repeatedly. Yeah, I've been out riding around with no plan of where to go, just to ride, and get "lost" or turned around and maybe you end up some place like this on accident, but to do it over and over and over again?

[oz rider]

If both the shoulder and the turnouts are dangerous, and she can't safely stop or slow down, what does she plan to do if a car is coming toward her?

She can see the oncoming car. She can't see the car behind (and most cycling fatalities, here at least, result from being hit from behind).

She can choose her own line past the oncoming car. She can't control the overtaking clearance the following car leaves her.

The road is 1.5 lanes wide so there is half a lane which the car won't be hogging. The oncoming driver will not be texting, talking on the phone or drunk and will be sharing the road, so its driver might even politely drop a wheel off the edge. After all it has an alphabet soup of safety devices to protect its occupants, while the other road user has nothing.

[XMcShiftersonX]

Whoa! That is super creepy... not that you were able to search a little bit and get that information... but that you guys actually care so much about this particular woman, and this particular hill. Just let people be. It really doesn't matter. I think this thread went too far two pages ago.

[featuretile]

This whole thing got way out of hand. I feel really attacked and like I should give up on this forum. Yes, all these comments made me feel very defensive and I would not put something up like this again.

Two people understood what I was saying - PamNY and JenK13.

I was surprised that I felt upset with a cyclist since I am one and I am super conscious and respectful of cyclists when I drive a car. I did not expect her to move over into a shoulder (full of debris or not) - there is no shoulder. On most of the road she needs to be in the middle. The pull outs are for cars and they are paved. She was riding a bike that had straight handlebars. The speedometer on my car read 15mph going down the hill behind her, so given the steepness, I assumed she was riding her brakes. I was not close enough to see her hands.

I certainly don't mind driving down a road after a fast cyclist. I don't need to be in front of a bike and I'm not worried about being 30 seconds late. I was worried about her safety. And yes, I was annoyed (my bad). There are blind corners and cars who will be ascending that won't see her. There have been times when a car going up and a car going down meet on a blind corner, and it's pretty close (there have been a few car to car accidents), so no one is driving that road faster than 25mph. I would not want to be in the middle on a bike in that situation. Why is it so incorrect for me to say what I would do?

As for people looking at my house, that's pretty weird.

[csr1210]

I understood where you were coming from. A lot of people had really great points about bike safety, and I'm a huge proponent of taking the lane, but in my opinion, the criticisms posted didn't really match what YOU described in your original post.

Anyway, I mostly lurk, but I wanted to say that I'm sorry you felt beat up and hope you don't give up on the forum!

-Christy