A unified theory of New York biking

[skhill]

Thanks for the link, ny biker. It's an interesting read. And I think he's hit on something important, that a lot of problems come when so many folks-- drivers, pedestrians, and cyclists alike-- tend to put bikes in the mental category of "pedestrian."

[lph]

Interesting! The last few commutes I've been pondering writing an article titled something like "Why cyclists behave so strangely", to explain a little of the cyclist point of view. The mental "we're just human-powered almost pedestrian"-thing explains a whole lot.

[PamNY]

Cyclists do break traffic laws more often than auto drivers in Manhattan and Brooklyn (the two boroughs where I bike). That's just the way it is.

No one is saying that auto drivers are perfect, but if you calculated a percentage of violations such as going the wrong way on a one way street and running red lights, you would find a much higher percentage of cyclists violating the law. Nothing is gained by pretending this isn't the case.

In some cases, if you are careful, breaking the law on a bike is safer. Jaywalking is also safer -- most pedestrians killed by cars are crossing legally.

[Eden]

Cyclists do break traffic laws more often than auto drivers in Manhattan and Brooklyn (the two boroughs where I bike). That's just the way it is.

No one is saying that auto drivers are perfect, but if you calculated a percentage of violations such as going the wrong way on a one way street and running red lights, you would find a much higher percentage of cyclists violating the law. Nothing is gained by pretending this isn't the case.

In some cases, if you are careful, breaking the law on a bike is safer. Jaywalking is also safer -- most pedestrians killed by cars are crossing legally.

If you want to cherry pick laws, you might be right, certain traffic laws probably are broken more often by cyclists, but if you look at traffic laws as a whole, I doubt you'd find one driver out of 100 who doesn't violate some sort of traffic law every time they drive..... 99.9% of drivers around here don't stop legally at stop signs. If they actually do fully stop, its usually in the middle of the crosswalk.... 99.9% of drivers go over the speed limit, even if it's just a little, that's still breaking the law. Lots and lots of people pass on the right on the interstate, tons don't use turn signals - and right o' people - you need to use the *all the time*, even in a parking lot. Don't get me started about right on red.....

Lets not fool ourselves either that drivers are somehow any better. If anything it behooves drivers to be better than everyone else and to be the most careful of anyone because they have the greatest destructive potential.

[PamNY]

Eden, I'm talking specifically about cycling in Manhattan and Brooklyn. Right on red is illegal, interstates are rare, and both cyclists and vehicles pull into crosswalks because it's the only way to see around double-parked trucks.

I was merely trying to shed light on the discussion (which was specifically about New York City).

It was not my intention to provoke one of those "drivers are bad too" discussions which are common here and in which I have no desire to participate.

[Eden]

Eden, I'm talking specifically about cycling in Manhattan and Brooklyn. Right on red is illegal, interstates are rare, and both cyclists and vehicles pull into crosswalks because it's the only way to see around double-parked trucks.

I was merely trying to shed light on the discussion (which was specifically about New York City).

It was not my intention to provoke one of those "drivers are bad too" discussions which are common here and in which I have no desire to participate.

From my reading of the article that's what this is all about... It's about the respect that drivers don't afford cyclists on the road. It's easy to say oh its because they are all lousy rule breakers, but that's totally hypocritical. Cyclists and motorists may break different rules in different proportions, but I call *total BS* to the idea that cyclists break rules more often - and it really gets my dander up to see other cyclists buy into that type of thinking.

I'm not defending cyclists who ride the wrong way on one way streets. That's just plain stupid and yes I will tell a cyclist that they are going the wrong way (though few people do it here thankfully) and I'm not defending law breaking from any group. It just really bothers me, really, really bothers me that people have the idea that cyclists as a group somehow deserve what ever abuse or neglect we receive from motorists because some cyclists don't follow the rules. It bugs me that we as a society are willing to say cyclists should be held to a higher standard so that people won't want to kill us, rather than saying motorists should be held to a higher standard because they are more likely to kill.

[PamNY]

Cyclists and motorists may break different rules in different proportions, but I call *total BS* to the idea that cyclists break rules more often - and it really gets my dander up to see other cyclists buy into that type of thinking..

It's not even remotely close to BS in Manhattan, and I'm not sure why it matters anyway. Are there many commercial cyclists (e.g. restaurant delivery people and messengers) where you live? That is a big, big factor here. I'm terrified of them and sympathetic to them at the same time.

Remember that there simply isn't room for everybody in some cities. You can't cycle like a car in Manhattan in many cases. You can't stay out of the door zone unless you stay home. It's just different, that's all.

Sometimes ridiculous circumstances occur simply because things are crowded. Last night I had to navigate around preparations for the 9/11 ceremonies and a movie shoot. I ended up getting off my bike and walking because it wasn't far, but wrong-way biking would have solved the problem.

[lph]

I won't ever defend law-breaking, but I have become less absolute in condemning those who break the traffic laws. To put it this way, I would rather meet drivers who occasionally drove a bit too fast on the highway and didn't come to complete stops at every stop sign, but were unfailingly alert, observant and kind to cyclists.