Ironman Training- OY!

[Running Mommy]

I'm in the thick of IM AZ training and I need some helpful advice from any of you Iron vets out there. Or even any of you girls that ride loooonnggg....

First, when you ride over say 60 miles what do you use for nutrition. So far I've tried carbo pro mixed into cytomax. I also discovered pringles in the single serve pack. I put one in my camelback and one in my bento box on my frame. They seem to work well, but I'm also looking for some other ideas. Gel of any sort makes me gag- a texture thing- so I need something non gel that will keep me going. I'm also planning on adding some salt tabs into the mix as well because I tend to lose alot of salt when I sweat and then consequently cramp on the run.

Second, SHORTS! I have a nice pair of PI shorts (sugar I think?) w/ a purplish color chamois that seem to work well, but I need another pair of "long distance" shorts. I was wondering if anyone has tried the Castelli or Sheebeest?

and finally... How do you wrap your mind around the distance? It seems like I get to 50 miles and my mind starts sayin "ok, I'm bored w/ the bike now". I know it's mostly mental because my legs are fine- well not "fine"- but ok and still moving... Let's just say I know my legs have more in them, but my mind seems to shut down.

Training so far has gone pretty well, but I'm just now starting to get into the long distance stuff. I've got a 70-80 mile ride followed by 10-13 mile run brick scheduled for tomorrow. This is going to be my confidence building " I CAN do this, I AM Ironman material" workout- so wish me luck!
Happy training and thanks in advance for any helpful tips you can throw my way!
Denise

[VenusdeVelo]

Running Mommy,
I've not done tri's, only centuries so I have the advantage that I am not maxed out from all 3 sports.

I prefer to have less processed nutrition, bananas, maybe bars, apples/PB packed up in a ziploc (Skippy makes these little single packs!). But I find towards the last 30 miles I cannot eat, so gels are my only possibility eventhough they too make me gag. An alternative -- you can buy packs of Stinger honey for athletes -- honey is a little easier and goes well on a banana. Avoid too much fiber, not a pleasant result for long rides/races. The salt tabs or pringles probably serve you well but the Pringles would upset my stomach a bit. Consider adding some salt to your sports drink (I also like Cytomax) -- a little salty but workable. ClifShot also has those new "bloks" that are like gummy bears, I've not tried them but I love gummy bears (hey that might not be a bad idea, a bag of gummy bears in my back pocket...).

The mental piece took a long time to conquer as well, I had to learn how to really focus instead of letting the mind wander. And that's not what your instincts tell you to do. Try some yoga and such in your training...see if that helps you. I think it helped me learn to focus inward, ", after 40 or so, I take my next goal in 10-15 mi increments because you can do that amt in no time at all. Try and beat your next 15 mi increment then by shaving off some time. The games we play...;-)

Best of luck to you, I am cheering you on vicariously...I take off my hat/helmet to you for facing the IM! You go IronWOman!!

[Grog]

Cheers on trying out for the Ironwoman! I still can't understand how someone could want to run a marathon after 180 km on the bike, so I totally admire you. I am right now training for my first... sprint distance triathlon. But I do cycle a lot.

You definitely will need to eat more and often because when you're on the bike you're catching up on the fuel you couldn't intake from swimming (and it's a pretty comfortable position for eating, especially if you have a bento box!) and fueling up for the run at the same time.

I am currently chewing on leftover Sharkies, "organic energy fruit chews". Basically, it's gel in the shape of gummies, only not bears, sharks. They indeed are fun to eat and I think they taste pretty good (the Berry Blast flavor at least). If you're totally bored you can always have conversations with the sharks as you eat them.

Plain gummy bears are decent too, the difference in nutritional contents probably isn't that big.

Check out different gels. I know there are many I just can't stand (especially the so-called chocolate flavoured) but others that are great (Razz Sorbet) and feel like eating jam by the spoon. On a long ride, your mouth will eventually dry out a bit and it may be easier to eat than anything solid. Bars are probably easier at the beginning of the ride.

(Makes me think I'd like to try maple butter as an energy gel... that would keep me going!)

[Running Mommy]

Ohh Sharkies! I totally forgot about them. I loved training w/ those for my mary in 04. The funny thing is if your not training they taste salty, but when your moving- MAN do they taste good! I've also trained w/ little packs of haribo gummie bears from costco. You can get a box of little packages in the candy aisle. The packs are just the perfect portion. They work pretty good for long runs, but I've never tried them on the bike. I just have to watch the sugar though cause I have a finicky system. I tend to get the dreaded sugar gut. So I think I'd better go w/ some solid food on the bike. Maybe mini pretzels in the bento? because I'm going to be pushing the time cut off I won't have much time to stop, and I think pb&j may be too much to "handle" if ya know what I mean.

[Lise]

Denise! Great to hear from you! I've been wondering how you were doing.

I, of course, have never done such distances, so have nothing to add but my enthusiastic cheering.

This summer I did my first metric century (inexplicably 66 miles...?!), and the thought of running 13 miles as soon as I got off the bike was horrible! Nevertheless, my goal is a 1/2 IM next year.

I'm going to try those Sharkies on my long runs. When I did the marathon, I relied on chocolate gels...pukey to swallow, but digestible. I cannot handle solids during those big efforts. Please keep us posted--I learn from everything you share! Keep going! You CAN do it!!! Lise

[Pedal Wench]

I'm not a tri person either, but a bunch of centuries.

Fig newtons are great,and hold up well to abuse in a pocket or bag.

Some of the gels aren't really as gel-like as others - the Power Bar chocolate is more like chocolate frosting. I second the Stingers too - or just get some honey packets from a restaurant.

I have tried the Clif-shot blocks. Interesting texture. Not as solid as a gummy bear, and not as squishy as a gel. Try them before you buy a whole case. I didn't mind it, but my boyfriend hated them.

You don't have this luxury in an IM, but I need to get some real food and get off the bike for a minute at around 60-70 miles. I always seem to hit a little wall, where I just hate my bike. Hate it, hate it, hate it. I take a break, get some real food (here come the fig newtons) and then I'm fine and back in love with the bike.

[Running Mommy]

First, thanks so much for the helpful advice and all the positive vibes you have sent my way. I really felt them when I was on the road today. And maybe that's what helped me get through it! Yep- I DID IT!!
I did a 70/10 ride/run brick. I did the ride in 4:54:xx- about 10 min's slower than I'd hoped for, but I realized as I was stopped at a busy intersection that my hubby doesn't have his gps set to stop when you do. OY!
Other than that I only stopped once to take off my full finger gloves and munch down a clif bar. It was cold here today (well for me) so I kept my leg warmers and long sleeved jersey on for the entire ride. Other than that my legs felt good, my butt felt good (well relatively) and I only had a couple of really rough mental patches. But I rode through them... The only issue I did have was after about 3 hours my neck/shoulders started to hurt. I changed position alot to try to stretch out my neck, but I think it was just fatigue.
I'm going to have another bike fit done here in another month, so if thats still an issue hopefully we can nip it in the bud.
As for my run I did the 10 miles in 2:01:xx. I wanted to run 12 min miles and I pretty much did. I had about a 10 min transition where I got some good fuel in me, so when I started running I felt pretty good. I ran the first 5 miles straight and then started to take walk breaks at every mile as if I was going through an aid station.
The real bonus was that I felt like there was still fuel in the tank after I was done. So I guess that's a good sign.
Girls, with your help I may just be able to do this thing!!
Again, thanks for the thoughts and kind words- as well as the wisdom! Your THE BEST!
Denise

[Grog]

The only issue I did have was after about 3 hours my neck/shoulders started to hurt. I changed position alot to try to stretch out my neck, but I think it was just fatigue.
I'm going to have another bike fit done here in another month, so if thats still an issue hopefully we can nip it in the bud.

Frankly I don't think the bike fit is going to make a difference on that issue, if it truly came after 3 hours. The difference will come from your own fitness. We use our back and upper body muscles much more than we think when we are cycling and our back develops as we cycle more and more. So doing more long distance will help you develop your back muscles and in a while you will be stronger and will start to feel sore after a longer time on the bike.

I'm just back from my first 4-hour bike ride in a long time and my shoulders and upper back were hurting like hell during that last hour... A bit of stretching and a short nap pretty much wiped the pain away but I am still gently sore (good excuse to ask for a shoulder and back massage tonight ). I'm hoping to have my old back back within a month or two.

Kudos on the brick and keep going!!! I'm all with you (in thoughts!).

[Nanci]

Hi Running Mommy,

Some food I like to eat on really long rides:

Sushi-mmm- has carbs, protein and fat. Settles my stomach and lasts a long time. I only eat the more solid foods at the halfway point and beyond. I like the itty bitty ones with the seaweed wrap, or whatever it is, for biking. Not messy. I put six pieces in a little Ziplock, and carry a couple sets. (This is also one of my favorite pre-ride/race breakfasts and recovery meals!)

Chocolate milk. Same reasoning as sushi- has carbs, protein, and caffeine! Goes down easily, quenches my thirst, and I get about 540 calories in one shot. Also an excellent recovery food.

Pasta. I've carried snack-sized Ziplocks of leftover penne- it's wonderful!

Sharkies, Jelly Belly Sport Beans- I put those in a coin purse in my Bento and munch about 100 calories an hour, then eat something bigger every hour- say a Power Bar, Clif Bar, Luna Bar, Mojo Bar. All those bars are very different, so I take one or more of each, because you never know what will sound good at the time.

Fruit Trekker Bars. They are 100% fruit, come in mango, pineapple and bananna. 120 calories each. I carry a couple in my Bento and eat while I'm riding.

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Staying entertained. That's easy for me, since I ride on paved trails- I listen to Podcasts about triathlon training, endurance sports, interviews of people like Peter Reid and Andrea Fischer, etc. I only use one headphone so I can hear what's going on around me and have a conversation with anyone who passes.

The ride isn't the race. I stay "fresher" if I get off every couple hours and walk or sit on a bench to eat my snack- take off my gloves and helmet, and relax for 5-10 minutes. I even plan in a lunch stop at about halfway where I can stop for 10-20 minutes if I feel like it and even take off my shoes!

I am happy when I can ride "negative splits"- the second half of the ride takes less time than the first. I try not to go all-out on the first half, and then push it more in the second. I've found that the more comfortable I am with a distance, say 70 or 80 miles, I know how fast I can ride it and not use up everything. I like to feel, at the end, like I just had a nice ride, not like I will be laying in bed the whole next day. Because a good way to build up your total mileage is to do a long ride Saturday, and then half that distance Sunday. Then tack on 10 more miles the next weekend. Then on the third weekend, cut back to 20 miles less. Then the fourth weekend, go further. (50,25--60,30--40,20--60,30--70,35--50,25--70,35--80,40--60,30) At this point, 60 miles feels like a little jaunt!

In the last third, and especially the last hour, you might get really mentally fatigued, or feel like you're going to bonk. This is probably your brain running out of fuel- it's the first thing to go. Good time for a _substantial_ snack. It's easy to let the fueling slide when you feel like you're almost done- but you've long ago used up any stored reserves and need to keep a steady supply coming in, even though you might feel so tired you don't want to bother. It only takes 5-10 minutes after a nice snack to feel the results. It also really helps to just take a short break, even a couple minutes, say to stop at a water fountain even though you don't need to, or whatever.

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My absolute favorite shorts are the Trashy Cat Satin Shorts. I love the fit, love the chamois, love everything. And I am not built like the models on the site, but the shorts still fit me. :-)

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Another thought on training. I was listening to Peter Reid yesterday. He's won Kona three times. He lives in a pro triathlete community. When they all train, he is training at an aerobic level, whereas they are all going all-out, doing a lot of anaerobic training, etc. So in training events, he's always coming in last, but on race day, he wins. They say, "Peter, how do you do it?" and he says he just learned to train right. He talks about how he worked with Mark Allen to determine the heart rate levels, and he closely monitors that. (You can listen to the podcast here:

http://www.enduranceradio.com/archives012006.htm

Oh, and I also listened to Andrea Fischer, pro female triathlete whose interview you can find here

http://zentri.blogspot.com/

who spoke about how easy the bike is, so the other two disciplines get neglected in training.

One of the two, I want to say Peter Reid, said that it really all comes down to the run.

Good luck with your training!

Nanci

[triflor]

Shorts are a strange thing from what I've heard. My mother swears by tri shorts because the thinner chamios causes less friction difficulties. My brother goes by "the thicker the better" theory.
Myself, I prefer something with a decent chamios thickness, but with a smooth fabric. I find I have more difficulty with friction than with sore butt.
Anyone with suggestions to reduce friction on some of those particularly sensitive female areas?