West & East divide-cycling issues, non-car issues

[NbyNW]

I wouldn't think much of East/West differences in discussing cycling in US -- living in NYC I would likely have more in common talking to cyclists in San Francisco than cyclists in Atlanta or Nashville.

Cities are so different -- as others have pointed out, age of city and population density are two things that would radically affect any transportation planning.

Do we know for a fact that people don't look to other cities for ideas? During the (admittedly minor) involvement I've had in transportation planning there was discussion of what has gone on in other cities.

OT but marginally related: I was always amused by my native-New-Yorker friend who was outraged that you couldn't just hail a cab in other cities like you can in Manhattan. He was intelligent and educated, too.

I think climate is a factor, too. Cycling season is just beginning here in Edmonton -- I did notice a few intrepid cyclists who stick with it through winter, but by and large this is a city for cars. The trail system is decent -- I'm just beginning to explore it, and I expect I will find routes that are more appropriate for the mtb than for the road bike.

As for your New York friend -- I can relate b/c I lived in NYC for a number of years -- I think New Yorkers view cabs as just another transit option, and another reason they don't need to own a car. If you are traveling at a weird time of day or need to take a route that requires some weird transfers, or you're simply going someplace that doesn't have convenient service, the cab becomes another option.

I was shocked when I moved to San Francisco, my firm hosted an event at SF City Hall, and at 10:30 pm there was not a cab to be hailed. Our boss suggested we "call a cab" as she made her way to her car. But this was in the late 90s when some of us didn't feel obliged to have a cell phone, and yet payphones were already extinct in that neighborhood. And the other option was walk through a sketchy neighborhood to a bus stop. Enough experiences like that, you eventually find yourself at a car dealer.

[OakLeaf]

What I was commenting on, and BSNYC too, was really the culture. Little things, like tinkling a little bell is apparently enough in the PNW to get pedestrians on a MUP to part like the Red Sea, whereas we Easterners were quite seriously discussing air horns and wondering whether even those would be enough to get the attention of families and people with iPods. Like, regularly getting buzzed, yelled at, and having things thrown at you by automobile drivers. Like, having cops yell at and even ticket you for safe, legal riding. Like the existence of non-limited-access roads that a sane vehicular cyclist would never consider riding on.

Like - probably most of all - the simple fact that automobile drivers who are trying to be courteous to bicyclists actually know how to do so - by driving consistently and predictably and giving you plenty of space - rather than doing scary dangerous stuff like stopping dead at random places to wave you through, tailgating you for miles because they're afraid to pass but too impatient to back off your rear wheel, or buzzing you so as not to cross the yellow line.

Those aren't rural/urban things. I've never ridden in a really large city - and I wouldn't count New York in any discussion, because all traffic in NYC is a thing unto itself - but across the East, I experience the same behavior in small cities, towns, and rural areas; and when I've traveled bikeless to California, I've observed the absence of said behavior in San Francisco as well as many towns and outlying areas.


ETA: and climate is most definitely not a factor (except maybe in reverse? ). Peninsular Florida is arguably the most cyclist-unfriendly place to ride in the USA. Minneapolis and the rain-soaked PNW are known to be two of the most cyclist-friendly.