Anxiety vs Insomnia

[shootingstar]

If at all possible, solobiker, seek some counselling first to talk things through. Drugs will simply may simply mask root causes which seem to be hanging around for you in last few years.

Like you, I resist taking oral drugs. (actually taking iron supplements was the first thing I took orally in decade except for taking Tyelonol twice for fever/headache.). I know for myself personally if I suppress major "truths" about a personal situtation/stresses and deny such problems, it manifests in major problems in: feeling sleepy during the day...and not sleeping well at night. Deep "truth-seeking" from within myself, helped me over time. But it exhausted me for a few months by living in denial...this has happened twice in life so far. lst time I sought counselling for a year when I was university student decades ago. Thank God...and it gave me insight to help myself much later in life. It is invaluble help....this is what an excellent counsellor can do for you.

[Onix]

No problem.

I know what a pain it can be to have sleep problems.

Also, remember that your body DOES know how to sleep solidly and through the night.

I think with something like insomnia that is often so pervasive in our lives, we can become very "problem saturated" in our view of it (and understandingly so). Insomnia is such a miserable thing, and feels so controlling of our lives that it is often very natural to jump to the "what is wrong with me, this is so awful, i feel like i am helpless" tract.

I think for most people, the inner strength, resources, and ability to solve all kinds of our problems lies within us. Thus, it just becomes a matter of finding that, pulling it out, and embracing it. (Therapy can be very helpful for this-for both problem identification, identification of contributing factors, and honing in on your skills to overcome).

With all of this, I think that reframing can often be helpful. (It won't fix things immediately...but it turns us from a "problem saturated" orientation to a "solution focused" orientation. Just remember that you do have "access" to the solution because you/your body DO know how to sleep through the night.

This would include thinking about things like:

-the fact that your body does know how to sleep through the night---thus you can harness this ability further. You already have the resource and capability--it just needs some finding! (often lighter than "oh god, i can't do this"

- What is it in you that keeps you from having 7 bad nights of sleep? How do you manage that?

-The fact that you are seeking help for yourself is significant. It suggests resourcefulness, strength, courage and persistence.

-do you sometimes successfully manage your stress? Awesome. Is there a way to introduce more of these techniques/skills into your life?

etc. etc.


In response to shooting star's quote: "Drugs will simply may simply mask root causes which seem to be hanging around for you in last few years."


--While I totally agree that drugs can serve as a crutch for some people in their therapeutic work (mostly for people who take drugs for a psychological issue, and then fail to receive accompanying psychological therapy work). But, for some people, brain chemistry imbalance is a very real thing. I think when used appropriately drugs MAY be a helpful aid. It really depends on the person/how they are being managed/used/for what etc. I totally relate to your resistance to putting altering chemicals in your body. This can raise all kinds of questions (but then is it really me? What does this mean about dependence? etc.) But, without knowing a lot more about the situation (and without being a doc to rule out medical issues).... it is hard for me to rule it out as an option entirely. But, for most people...it isn't a life-long option. So, yes...finding other underlying roots etc. will most likely be important.

[solobiker]

Thanks for the posts and support. As I said I really don't want to take medication for this as to me it is a "crutch" for the situation not really a cure. I typically sleep well on weekends when I don't have to go to work or when I am on vacation. I don't think my anxiety is a chemical imbalance, I just tend to worry and stress a lot. I am nervous my Dr may try to put me on meidcation which I most likely will decline. As for counseling...I tend to be a very shy person and will be very uncomfortable in a situation like that. I do not like any attention placed on me or "help" because to me then I failed in someway and have a weakness that nobody else has that I know of. It is hard to explain. When ever I am not completely occupied my mind goes to work and and my mind goes right to the negative aspects or the what ifs...kind of a pain. I am trying very hard for this not to happen but it just does.

[solobiker]

I have gotten to the point where it stresses me out come Sunday/Monday night the I most likley will not sleep. I am tired during the day so after work I will come home and try to take a nap. As soon as I lie down I wake right up. It is rather frustrating. Sorry for being the resident complainer...it is just getting real old and dissapointing.

[lph]

I have bouts of ... not real insomnia, in that I rarely wake up and can't get back to sleep... more like long periods where I have trouble falling asleep, sleep lightly and restlessly, and wake up "too fast" feeling unrested, often with a hectic heartrate at the first "morning sound". This is stress-related, but funnily enough if I'm really overworked I'll usually sleep better because I get very tired, and a bit down and depressed. On vacation I can feel myself relaxing to a much deeper level, and suddenly sleeping 9 hours every night and waking up from a very sound sleep.

It almost feels like I have trouble getting my energy cycles to match the day, they're there but don't run on a daily schedule. I can either gear myself up, get lots done, bike a lot, but not sleep much, or I can slouch around, be slow and inefficient, but get lots of sleep. Puzzling. It's mostly a problem if it coincides with emotional stress, because then I get weepy/upset/angry very easily.

I have considered both drugs, yoga/meditation and therapy, but so far have handled this ok with regular meals, regular bedtime, and trying to be ahead of stuff at work and in sync with friends and family. Don't know if any of this sounds familiar. It sounds like you have it rough. But I think the point about really believing you have the resources to fix it yourself is a good one. I try to tell myself after a bad night - hey, it's just a bad night. Yes, you'll be a bit out of it. But that "despair" you're feeling isn't real, it's the lack of sleep inflating your emotions, and it will go away.

btw I was very against medication until I read up a bit. Apparently medication to help you fall asleep can be used just passingly to help retrain your sleep habits.

[Crankin]

I can't add much to what Onix said. I am also another counselor in training who has had bouts with insomnia. I have never been a good sleeper, didn't nap as a kid and generally never been someone who sleeps the recommended 8 hours. If I get 7, it's a lot. Waking up at 5 has been routine for me for years.
The waking up in the middle of the night as you describe is definitely related to anxiety. But, it becomes a vicious cycle because you start worrying about not sleeping, which increases whatever anxiety was there.
What helped me was acupuncture, yoga, and decreasing my coffee intake for awhile (I have since resumed my one vile habit). For a couple of months I took a medication that was not for sleep per se, but it had the added side effect of helping me sleep, as I took it at night so the "sleepiness" would not affect my daily activities. However, my normal sleep had pretty much returned at this point. One thing I found that during this time, if I did really hard endurance exercise, it made the problem worse. But, moderate exercise, like walking, slower cycling, and hiking helped.
I am not against medication, either. Sleep medications can be used for a short time as others have said. And +1 on finding a good counselor. It might take more than one try.

[Onix]

btw I was very against medication until I read up a bit. Apparently medication to help you fall asleep can be used just passingly to help retrain your sleep habits.

Interesting. Thanks for pointing this point out!

[shootingstar]

I just tend to worry and stress a lot. I am nervous my Dr may try to put me on meidcation which I most likely will decline. As for counseling...I tend to be a very shy person and will be very uncomfortable in a situation like that. I do not like any attention placed on me or "help" because to me then I failed in someway and have a weakness that nobody else has that I know of. It is hard to explain. When ever I am not completely occupied my mind goes to work and and my mind goes right to the negative aspects or the what ifs...kind of a pain. I am trying very hard for this not to happen but it just does.

It is really hard to name, to articulate in words and cohert sentences, one's greatest fears and weaknesses. Then once it's identified, that lump of negativity seems so huge. And it IS huge and can be energy-sucking just thinking about it..takes time to chip away at the problem(s), find solutions and talk it out with someone who is there beside you on the journey.

Meanwhile, hope you keep ridin' the bike.

[Onix]

I know I PMed you..but I didn't read this first

The doctor definitely can't *make* you take any medication. But, he/she may be able to give you some more information about options, which will most likely include medication. I am curious though---it sounds like it is really difficult for you to talk to a therapist about what is going on...I am wondering what makes going to a doctor to talk about it easier (especially since you don't seem to want what he/she probably has to give ((i.e. medicine)). Does it feel safer because doc may not want you to dive into the emotional aspect of this?

And, I know you don't know me...but...oh lord.... I have all kinds of life-difficulties

I really truly believe that although a lot of people don't talk about them, everyone is struggling with certain things and suffering in some areas. I just think that is humanity. We are imperfect, raw human beings. Our imperfection is beautiful...and often painful. Isolation can be especially compounding in this area when people aren't talking about the reality of our lives that includes our stresses and struggles. ((This makes me think of postsecret.com you ladies should check it out if you haven't! ---people coming together in their rawness and humanity)).

Really, I just want to validate your feelings, but also try to normalize the fact that a lot of people struggle with sleep problems and all kinds of other problems. It is so easy to believe that everyone else has everything together and is super happy (especially based on the happy-ever-after story lines all over the media). But, I think everyone is a little messy. And, its in that messyness that ultimately I think we find each other in the most intimate ways.

I once heard a parable....that if you imagine all of the people on earth as wells (like the water kind)....the deepness in the well represents the deepness of the person's innermost thoughts (i.e. all of our most secret feelings are the deepest in the well, while the top by the grass is our "surface selves". And, interestingly...the place where wells come together...and share their water (the deep feelings water) is deep deep deep deep down . Just like people

I gotta run...but smiles all around

[beccaB]

Could you have an undiagnosed sleep disorder? Maybe your doctor should have you participate in a sleep study. When my husband did that he had to spend a night in the hospital and they studied the way he slept. He had to be woken up periodically and electrodes were stuck to him to measure certain patterns. They couldn't find anything at that time though.

[shootingstar]

Could you have an undiagnosed sleep disorder? Maybe your doctor should have you participate in a sleep study. When my husband did that he had to spend a night in the hospital and they studied the way he slept. He had to be woken up periodically and electrodes were stuck to him to measure certain patterns. They couldn't find anything at that time though.

My partner had this testing at a specialized sleep disorder testing lab at hospital. He has had sleep disorder since his 20's. He has never really felt truly rested from sleep. He is mildly narcopleptic and has tried prescribed daily drugs...which he no longer takes. It didn't make him feel well for rest of day and since it would have been a drug for the rest of his life, he didn't want his body to become addicted to it. This drug was to keep him awake during the day. It still didn't help him sleep better at night, though it was to help stabilize sleeping patterns.

His disorder causes him to fall asleep at theatres, driving, etc.
there is a real reason why he no longer owns a car..this is 1 of the major reasons. Driving after 1 hr., he needs to stop and nap. I don't mind.

And yes, cycling is very helpful to him to "stay awake" during day, as well as a transportation mode. His sleep disorder is compounded by tinnitus (ringing of ears) and high sensitivity to air pressure/weather changes leading to headaches. He seldom takes Tyelonol for headaches. He doesn't see the point when barometric changes is the cause. There is no drug to solve this. Sometimes I don't even know he's experiencing all of this...he's used to it that he isn't always signalling/complaining to me.

Solo's problem sounds as if she can at least isolate when insomnia occurs.

[Aggie_Ama]

I have had insomnia for the first time in my life since early August. It started right when my Nanny got sick and has not lessened. Like you I can go to sleep but I wake up many times. At first my doctor and I really believed it was just the overwhelming grief and stress of Nanny, so I went on Ambien. It keeps me asleep but I feel like crud the next day. I am still fighting mine and going back to my doctor this week. I feel like my grief has lessened but my insomnia hasn't. I miss Nanny but I think my insomnia is my inability to relax my mind. Friday I went out for a margarita and slept like a baby which has been the case the other two times I have gone out for drinks in two months. So obviously taking the edge off works but I don't think it is a very health solution. My doctor has suggested therapy in the past but I am stubborn and not open to it - yet. My doctor also suggested working out right after work until you are exhausted. I haven't had enough energy to do it which is kind of his point.

[solobiker]

Could you have an undiagnosed sleep disorder? Maybe your doctor should have you participate in a sleep study. When my husband did that he had to spend a night in the hospital and they studied the way he slept. He had to be woken up periodically and electrodes were stuck to him to measure certain patterns. They couldn't find anything at that time though.

My Dr wants me to do one of these. We will have to see how it works.

[shootingstar]

My Dr wants me to do one of these. We will have to see how it works.

Hey solo, just enjoy being pampered when you're at the sleep clinic session. Might be awkward with all the wiring, but you will be in good hands. An experience to talk of, years from now.