Morton's Foot?

[OakLeaf]

Do you have some web reading you can refer me to?

This is an excerpt from the book we're talking about.

Google brings you other results.


Wow Zia, that's great! I'm adjusting gradually and unfortunately I don't think it's a good idea to run my half marathon this Sunday in the new pads. There's definitely a big muscle adjustment going on in the shorter runs. I'm not 100% sure I've got the thickness and placement spot-on yet, either.

[KnottedYet]

I wouldn't think you'd need to pad the 1st met head in a pair of VFFs.

Don't forget, "Morton's Foot" is a perfectly functional foot. Entire civilizations had "Morton's Feet" (Greeks, Celts) and they were vibrant powerful cultures. They weren't hobbling around on crippled feet.

What they had were shoes made for THEIR kind of foot. (or sandals/soft shoes) Morton's foot only becomes an issue when you try to cram a long 2nd metatarsal foot into a shoe designed by and for folks with long 1st metatarsal feet.

(and, of course, they weren't constantly exposed to flat hard surfaces, which I still swear are the bane of ALL modern tootsies)

Morton's foot isn't just a longer 2nd metatarsal, it's also a differently shaped cuboid bone so the foot really does move a little differently. It's also a longer foot, so it's easy to develop hammer-toe because of shoes that are too short in the toe box.

VFF are enough like barefoot that I'd think they'd let your foot do its natural thing, unhampered by shoes designed for a different kind of foot. I'd just suggest you start your VFF running on dirt trails or grassy fields so your foot muscles have a chance to wake up and gain the strength to support your mets properly before you start running on hard flat surfaces.

Knot-doesn't-have-Morton's-foot (but does have dropped 2nd met head)

[Jolt]

I wouldn't think you'd need to pad the 1st met head in a pair of VFFs.

Don't forget, "Morton's Foot" is a perfectly functional foot. Entire civilizations had "Morton's Feet" (Greeks, Celts) and they were vibrant powerful cultures. They weren't hobbling around on crippled feet.

What they had were shoes made for THEIR kind of foot. (or sandals/soft shoes) Morton's foot only becomes an issue when you try to cram a long 2nd metatarsal foot into a shoe designed by and for folks with long 1st metatarsal feet.

(and, of course, they weren't constantly exposed to flat hard surfaces, which I still swear are the bane of ALL modern tootsies)

Morton's foot isn't just a longer 2nd metatarsal, it's also a differently shaped cuboid bone so the foot really does move a little differently. It's also a longer foot, so it's easy to develop hammer-toe because of shoes that are too short in the toe box.

VFF are enough like barefoot that I'd think they'd let your foot do its natural thing, unhampered by shoes designed for a different kind of foot. I'd just suggest you start your VFF running on dirt trails or grassy fields so your foot muscles have a chance to wake up and gain the strength to support your mets properly before you start running on hard flat surfaces.

Knot-doesn't-have-Morton's-foot (but does have dropped 2nd met head)

I agree with you that it's not really the foot that's the problem, it's the shoes and the fact that they just don't fit that foot shape well. Maybe some shoe company needs to design shoes around that foot configuration...or better yet there should be more flat, flexible, soft shoes that don't restrict the foot (and look acceptable for professional settings etc.) since that would be good for everyone, not just those who happen to have Morton's foot. The VFFs should be good, provided they fit you. Not sure what we can do about the hard flat surfaces--they're certainly not the healthiest thing for us but I don't think there's any getting around them.

[OakLeaf]

So is there a stretch I can do to get my first met on the ground? I can't even really do it passively. I quit going barefoot because it was so painful - not the other way around.

[NbyNW]

Anyone else think it's odd that the gadgets they have in shoe stores to measure your feet have sliders to measure, length, width, and length of arch, but it can be very difficult to find a shoe in anything but an "average" width; and I've never seen shoes that are sold with different choices in arch length.

[OakLeaf]

It's no different from anything else that's sold pre-made - shoes, bicycles, clothing. Even the cockpits of automobiles, which aren't offered in different sizes but definitely vary in size. Each make of shoes has a general "philosophy," different models will be variations on that theme, and sizes of each model will keep the same proportions. Measuring your foot gives an experienced fitter an idea of what makes and models to try.

There are still some custom cobblers around, but like custom anything, it's going to cost you.

[ginny]

thanks for the link, Oak. Interesting... yeah, I have blamed my mom for years for putting me in shoes that were too small (family joke - you know, blame mom). Since I work in a chemistry lab, open toed shoes are out of the question... bummer, but big, clown type shoes are perfectly acceptable. I will look into that book...

[zia]

I wouldn't think you'd need to pad the 1st met head in a pair of VFFs.

Don't forget, "Morton's Foot" is a perfectly functional foot. Entire civilizations had "Morton's Feet" (Greeks, Celts) and they were vibrant powerful cultures. They weren't hobbling around on crippled feet.

What they had were shoes made for THEIR kind of foot. (or sandals/soft shoes) Morton's foot only becomes an issue when you try to cram a long 2nd metatarsal foot into a shoe designed by and for folks with long 1st metatarsal feet.

(and, of course, they weren't constantly exposed to flat hard surfaces, which I still swear are the bane of ALL modern tootsies)

One of my readings -- which I of course can't find now -- indicated that the prevalence of Morton's Foot had increased dramatically over the past several hundred years. It used to just be 5% of the population, but now it's 25%. In another time, I would have been the one left at the hearth, sewing... or starving.

I'm with you, OakLeaf. Running barefoot is painful. I feel like I am on the brink of a catastrophic injury when barefoot. I love the idea, but I'm not sold on it for my particular foot type. Yet. (Even though I want to be!)

[Bike Chick]

Well this post has been an epiphany! I was diagnosed with a stress fracture a couple weeks ago and the dr described the foot condition to me without calling it Morton's foot. After reading all the posts and checking out the links, this describes my problem to a tee. I bought some moleskin and placed 4 layers under my first metatarcel bone and OH MY GOODNESS what a difference it made! I can walk without pain for the first time in weeks. Forget about walking barefoot anywhere or anyplace because I hobble like an old woman. I still have a copy of my xrays and when I took a look, my second metatarcel bone is a good inch longer than my first.

I have suffered so on the bike with a hot foot on my right foot. I've changed pedals, bought 3 different pair of shoes, then it just got worse when I started running again resulting in a stress fracture. I'm realizing now maybe there's some hope.

Zia and Oakleaf, do you ride with clipless pedals and has it been much of a problem on the bike?

[OakLeaf]

an INCH??? wow.

I don't actually have any trouble on the bike. I've used Look-style pedals, and toe clips before that. Before I learned about all this stuff, I put the intermediate Specialized arch supports in my shoes, just because they were available and I had custom orthotics in all my athletic shoes; but in my first incarnation as a cyclist, I didn't have any arch trouble or arch-related knee trouble. It's likely I still put more weight on the second met head on the bike, but it doesn't seem to cause the kinds of trouble it does for me on the ground. But the difference in length in my metatarsals isn't near what yours is.

Knot, I really want to make barefooting work. I know it won't happen overnight, but I've struggled for almost a year now in Yoga. In all the standing poses, they're talking about "four corners of the feet" and "creating the arch with your big toe mound" and meantime, I can have my ankles in neutral, or I can have my big toe mound on the mat, but not both at the same time, no matter how hard I try. I can't even take my hands and force it down to the ground without my ankle caving, it just doesn't reach. So that's why I asked about stretches.

[Bike Chick]

Well, Oak, your reaction made me go measure the xray........don't have me guess your height or weight because I apparently suck at guesstimates. It was actually between 1/2 and 3/4 of an inch.

Do the custom orthontics help? I'm getting some next week.

[OakLeaf]

Do the custom orthotics help? I'm getting some next week.

As I said in the other thread (or maybe at the top of this one ), they relieved the arch pain and some of the knee pain, but caused all manner of other issues.

I'm transitioning gradually to padding the first metatarsal heads. In the meantime I'm still using the orthotics intermittently. I can't wait to be rid of them! If I didn't have this half-marathon coming up before I've made the full transition, I wouldn't even be using the orthotics at all. I just don't think it's a good idea to do a long race in the pads before my muscles and tendons have had a chance to adjust completely.

If I can then transition to unsupported barefoot, I would really love to do that.

[zia]

. Do the custom orthontics help? I'm getting some next week.

I developed a stress fracture in my second metatarsal in ~1992. I am now on my third pair of custom orthotics since that time. As I mentioned before, not! one! podiatrist/sports medicine doc/physical therapist ever paid any attention to my feet beyond the arch/ankle area. NONE of those orthotics had any type of forefoot padding. And I have experienced knee pain on pretty much every single run since 1990 (I am good at ignoring it, and it never lasts long) -- until I self-diagnosed Morton's Foot last weekend and added my own little pads. No knee pain!

My arches are horribly flat, and I think the orthotics were good for them at a certain time and place, especially when my knees were at their worst. My mentor has a pair of customs and she successfully off of them (after 10+ years) about a year ago and I would like to do the same!

Now off to go hook my bike up to the trainer and play around with padding in my bike shoes.

[zia]

Zia and Oakleaf, do you ride with clipless pedals and has it been much of a problem on the bike?

I do ride with clipless pedals. I have always struggled with the strange sensation that I'm not transmitting enough power through my feet, and that my cleats were in different positions on each of my shoes. (My MF is significantly more pronounced on the left, where my third metatarsal is also longer than the first.) I've actually taken my shoes off to make sure the cleats were in the same spot!

When I was recently professionally fitted, the fitter had me mark on my shoes where the ball of my foot (aka first metatarsal) was and placed the cleats directly beneath that. They actually had been further forward, and moving them back has felt very strange, and not in a good way -- again, I just feel like I'm not transmitting much power through my feet, if that makes sense. Of course this is so -- all my energy is going through my second metatarsal, not my first! Sooo... I'm going to try padding up my bike shoes (perhaps a little thicker than my running shoes) and see if it makes a difference. Maybe it will make me more balanced. And faster.

OakLeaf, you sound like me at yoga. I am constantly wobbling and crashing. I'd always thought I was just uncoordinated... now, maybe not!

[Bike Chick]

I hear you Zia about wobbling and bobbling! The website's description of Morton's foot says it's like walking on an ice skate. I resemble that remark