"Unfair Genetic Advantage"

[papaver]

Apparently tests have shown that her male hormone levels are 3 times higher than normal

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-sto...5875-21622252/

[witeowl]

Apparently tests have shown that her male hormone levels are 3 times higher than normal

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-sto...5875-21622252/

So all our wailing and gnashing of teeth about discrimination based on appearance may have been based on naught...

Tests carried out before the start of the World Athletics Championships proved the 800m gold medallist had very high levels of the male hormone, according to sources close to the investigation.

It is believed this information led to the IAAF's decision to ask the South African athletics body to carry out a detailed "gender verification" test on the athlete.

Well, it was an interesting intellectual exercise nonetheless.

[smilingcat]

I really feel for Semenya. I think I would be crushed if media started in on me to say hey that's a man there!! A wolf in sheep's clothing to get on a podium.

My understanding is that IOC has dropped karyotyping because lot of women came up as XXY? or XY female???

So if you look like a dude, have dude parts, and XY obviously you can't compete in women's category.

But if you are XY female or XXY or mosaic, are they allowed??

The other thing too is that what was her name Merriam Bagger? the semi- or professional golfer who had the sex change operation to become a woman. I thought LPGA as allowing her to compete. so XY with sex change can compete.

I looked up on "intersex" on the internet and came to a non-profit organization on intersex. Reading some of the explanations just made me more confused. I thought your body chromosome were uniform but this isn't so in person who is mosaic. they could have XX for part of their body and XY in another. and they were talking about androgen insensitivity where no amount of testosterone will make you masculine and so XY could end up looking like a girl. Pretty strange stuff...

so where do we draw the line??

some girls are born without uterus... so specifying need for it will exclude them.
has to be XX chromosome will exclude some women.
has to have female genitals... will a guy could have a sex change surgery...
and how much testosterone is too much??

I am too illiterate in this area to speak on this matter. And let the officials and medical experts decide. And I sure wish the stupid media stops hyping the story and let the poor girl alone.

[GLC1968]

Apparently tests have shown that her male hormone levels are 3 times higher than normal

http://www.mirror.co.uk/news/top-sto...5875-21622252/

At the bottom of that article, it says that a man's testosterone is 40 to 60 times that of a woman. Should only 3 times as much really be enough to disqualify someone?

[Thorn]

In 1996, 8 female athletes tested XXY. All were allowed to continue competing. The cases were not made public. Semenya's was leaked to the press.

Reuter's summary
http://www.reuters.com/article/sport...dChannel=11611

Interesting historical document
http://ai.eecs.umich.edu/people/conw...erTesting.html



Oh, and Mr. Silver, take Karen (Tuckerville)'s advice. Read the articles. She took the time to find them for you, take the time to read them. You may find them enlightening.

[KnottedYet]

Normal Average testosterone for a pre-menopausal female: 0.6-0.7 nmol/L

Normal Range of testosterone for a pre-menopausal female: 0.2-2.9 nmol/L

[Eden]

That new article is horribly written -even to the headline....

Well yeah she has "male" hormones - we (women) all do.....
and there's lots of natural variation between human beings. What they appear to be intimating in the article is that the testosterone in her system may be synthetic, but it really doesn't look like they have any evidence of that, so they can't come out and make the claim. She's just associated with a coach who's been caught doping his athletes in the past....

You all want something interesting to listen to? This American Life did a show based all around testosterone once, including the staff being tested for their own levels - and yes some of the women had higher levels than some of the men...http://www.thisamericanlife.org/Radi...spx?sched=1230 This is much more about feelings around masculinity and femininity than hard core science.