My Motorist Exchange...

[crazycanuck]

I'm not sure which ship's in town but anyways a USS (will find out name) docked in Fremantle today. I saw it as I rode down the coast but thought nothing more of it.

UNtil...I was picking up some fish etc from a supermarket quite a distance from the port. Some of the sailors were there w a friend & I started talking to one of them. He kept calling me "Ma'am" I felt so old He was cool & we laughed that today when they arrived, it was a boooteful day..compared to the last few...no rain!!! Nice gents & are stationed in Maryland.

Conversation went sort of like this & I have to giggle...

Me (forgetting that they're still on tour): Where are you headed after Western Australia?
Officer: Sorry Ma'am, that's classified.
Me-Whoops, right..sorry! (I thought of a Kelly McGillis line from Top Gun but I don't know how he'd respond...)

[Crankin]

I guess to me, the use of ma'am connotes the attitude that Oak speaks of. And yes, it represents a whole lot of culturally loaded regional/political things that I don't like. When I moved to Miami as a teen and some of my friends started calling my mother ma'am, she had the same reaction. I do not see it as a sign of respect. It seems like a "false" respect.
I have no problem being called "Mrs...." in a work situation, because for 30 years that's how I was addressed as a teacher. But, I couldn't stand being called "Mrs..." by my kid's friends. In my social circle in AZ all of the kids called parents by first names. When we moved here, it was different. Although, once I told the kids I wanted to be called by my first name, they did. And in the end, all of the families we became friends with felt the same way.

[bmccasland]

I think some sort of formality ought to be taught to kids, and that they shouldn't be calling adults by their first names. I like the southern solution - Mr. or Miss. First Name, although some ladies may prefer being Mrs. Husband's Last Name. Children are corrected if they don't use titles when addressing adults, so my friend's kids or the neighborhood children call me Miss Beth. If it's your parent's generation or older you'd better use a title when addressing them!

[PamNY]

I like the Southern tradition of "Miss Firstname" as well. It's a charming way to recognize a familiar relationship and show respect at the same time.

I'm always surprised when people object to ma'am, but I grew up in the South. Nowadays I hear it mostly from cops or merchants who moved here from countries where elaborate courtesies are common (mainly the Middle East).

Is anyone familiar with cultures where women are called what sounds to my ear like "mommy"? I think it's Caribbean.

Mr. Silver, your motorist exchange is great.

Pam

[tulip]

Well, if you are in the south and someone calls you "Ma'am," please don't be rude and bristle at them. When in Rome...

[Becky]

I frequently "sir" and "ma'am" people. I work in public service in a state that has both strong northern and southern roots, depending on which county you're in. It's become a habit, and it's meant with nothing but the utmost respect. The "northerners" don't seem to mind it, the "southerners" seem to like it, and it's more polite IMO than "hey you" when I don't know someone's name.

That said, I really dislike being called "Miss Becky", although I tolerate it if it's children who are doing so. I had a boss call me "Miss Becky" once in an office-wide meeting, and I didn't like it. I guess that occurence has left a bad taste in my mouth for the expression.

[VeloVT]

I don't have a problem with "sir," "miss," "ma'am" etc as forms of addressing a stranger. I am chagrined that at age 29, I have recently crossed over from being a "miss" to being a "ma'am." I have mixed feelings about it actually -- on the one hand, "ma'am" seems to imply that I'm being taken somewhat more seriously ("miss" is a little bit like "young lady"), but it makes me feel old too.

What does bother me is when people use "miss/mrs" instead of "Ms." in professional correspondence/settings.

[Becky]

What does bother me is when people use "miss/mrs" instead of "Ms." in professional correspondence/settings.

Agreed- that makes me crazy!

[TrekTheKaty]

Hoosier Giant inspired to go off and do a homework assignment. I thought I was knowledgeable about the bicycle laws of the road (from here), but I have neglected to actually check my state driver's manual until now. WOW! Impressive! Sorry it's so long, but there's a whole chapter on sharing the road Guess I should send another donation to MoBikeFed

Some things you should know when sharing the road with mopeds or
bicycles:
• Most collisions with bicycles and mopeds happen at intersections, where
smaller, slower bicycles and mopeds are especially easy to overlook.
Scan carefully for bicycles and mopeds before proceeding through an
intersection, giving them the same consideration you would any other
vehicle.
• Bicycles are often overlooked by motorists.
• It is not always easy to judge the speed or distance of a bicycle.
• Accidents with wrong-way bicyclists frequently occur when a motorist
wants to turn right onto a main road and is only looking left for
approaching traffic. Be sure to look right and check for wrong-way
bicyclists on the road or sidewalk before proceeding.
• On residential streets, especially those with parked cars, travel at or
below the speed limit.

SHARING THE ROAD WITH MOPEDS AND BICYCLES
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• If you are following a bicyclist and need to make a right turn, slow down
and remain behind the cyclist until you are able to turn.
• Cyclists often travel at surprisingly fast speeds. If you need to make a left
turn, yield to oncoming bicyclists unless you are absolutely sure you can
make the turn before the cyclist reaches the intersection.
• Bicyclists change speed and lane position when encountering bad road
conditions, such as manhole covers, diagonal railroad tracks, drain
grates, road debris, or in strong winds. Be ready to react.
• When you are passing, give bicycles and mopeds a full lane width. Do
not squeeze past these road users. The bicycle is generally a slower
moving vehicle and this may require you to slow down. Wait for a clear
stretch of road before passing a cyclist in a lane too narrow to share.
• Check for passing bicyclists before opening your car door into a traffic
lane or bicycle lane.
• A bicycle lane is a portion of a roadway designated by striping to be
used by bicycles. You may cross a bicycle lane when turning or when
entering or leaving the roadway. You must yield to bicyclists in a bicycle
lane.

WHERE TO RIDE MOPEDS AND BICYCLES
On public streets and highways, you have the same rights and
responsibilities as a motor vehicle operator. Always ride with traffic, never
against it. When operating at less than the posted speed or traffic flow,
generally ride as near to the right side of the roadway as safe. The right
edge of the road often has hazards like ditches, gutters, sand, and gravel
shoulders. Leave space between yourself and these hazards as needed for
safety.
You may move more toward the middle or left of the lane or roadway, as
appropriate:
• when making a left turn;
• when avoiding hazards;
• when the lane is too narrow to share with another vehicle; and
• when there is a right-turn-only lane and you are going straight.
Always check traffic and signal before changing lanes or changing your
position within a lane. On a one-way street, bicyclists may also choose to
ride as far left as is safe.
The law does not allow you to ride a moped on any part of the federal
interstate highway system.

SAFETY TIPS FOR MOPED AND BICYCLE RIDERS
1. State law does not require you to wear a helmet. However, wearing a
safety-certified helmet can prevent serious head injuries or death.
2. Be sure your bike is in safe condition and has all the equipment
required by law.
3. Make sure motorists see you. Wear bright colored clothes and stay out
of a vehicle’s blind spots. Use proper lights and reflectors when riding
after dark.
4. Make sure you signal before you slow down, change lanes, or turn.
Before merging, changing lanes, or turning, scan behind and in front to
ensure that it is safe to make this maneuver. Do so in plenty of time
and in cooperation with other drivers who will be affected by your move.
If it is not safe, continue on a straight course and scan repeatedly and
only move once it is safe. In conditions of heavy traffic, less proficient
bicyclists may find it easier to wait near the curb for a safe gap to
appear.
5. Be careful when passing to the left of a parked or moving vehicle. You
should leave 3 to 4 feet of clearance to avoid suddenly opened car
doors or to allow for a vehicle to swerve.
6. Be extra careful at intersections. Do not assume your right-of-way
when there is a vehicle approaching. Be aware that motor vehicle
drivers may not see you approaching the intersection, or may believe
that you are moving at a slower speed than you are.
7. Keep a steady line and be predictable as a courtesy to other traffic and
to increase your personal safety.
8. For teen and adult bicyclists, studies show that riding on the street with
traffic, not against it (following the same traffic rules that other vehicles
do), is far safer than riding on the sidewalk.

MOPED DRIVERS NEED A DRIVER LICENSE
To drive any motorized bicycle such as a moped on the public streets, you
must have a valid driver license. A motorized bicycle is defined as any twowheeled
or three-wheeled device having an automatic transmission and a
motor with a cylinder capacity of not more than fifty cubic centimeters,
which produces less than three gross brake horsepower, and is capable of
propelling the device at a maximum speed of not more than thirty miles per
hour on level ground.

EQUIPMENT REQUIRED ON MOPEDS AND BICYCLES
You do not have to register your moped or bicycle and it does not have to
be inspected. However, Missouri law requires certain equipment on
mopeds and bicycles.
BRAKES —Your brakes must be able to stop you within 25 feet when
traveling 10 mph.
LIGHTS AND REFLECTORS — The number of bicycle-auto crashes rises
dramatically between sunset and sunrise. Almost all such crashes can be
prevented with proper bicycle lights and reflectors. You must have the
following lights and reflectors when riding your bicycle from ½ hour after
sunset until ½ hour before sunrise:
1. A WHITE LIGHT on the front of your bicycle or carried by you that
other drivers can see from 500 feet.
2. A REAR RED REFLECTOR, at least two square inches, or a REAR
RED LIGHT that drivers can see when reflected by their vehicles’ low
beam headlights at 600 feet.
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3. REFLECTIVE MATERIAL OR LIGHTS on the pedals, crank arms,
shoes, or lower legs that drivers can see when reflected by their
vehicles’ low beam headlights at 200 feet.
4. REFLECTIVE MATERIAL AND/OR LIGHTS ON EACH SIDE OF THE
BICYCLE or bicyclist that drivers can see when reflected by their
vehicles’ low beam headlights at 300 feet. This does not apply to
mopeds that comply with the National Highway Traffic Safety
Administration Regulations.

[Tuckervill]

Well, if you are in the south and someone calls you "Ma'am," please don't be rude and bristle at them. When in Rome...

+1000

[shootingstar]

Other canucks are welcome to give their opinion on the use of ma'am:

Where we are in this part of Canada or Toronto, simply rarely hear to it or it's used rarely at all the where I've worked where the biz dealt with customers/public.

However methinks I do hear 'sir' abit more often.

I don't use it. It's just not part of my English conversational style which is partially influenced where I grew up. HOWEVER, I have noticed if I attempt to speak French, I will use "madam".

And in Chinese, there is a similar term to use for a woman in conversation. I will use it.

I can't even explain why on earth I don't use ma'am or sir hardly at all.
But it doesn't bother me if people address me as ma'am, even though more people tend to refer to me as 'miss'...without using my name.
_____________________________________________________________________________
I can't remember when I ever spoke with an errant motorist. I've dealt with angry strangers before in the past, but it had absolutely nothing to do with cycling or while on bike. Because of these non-cycling-related, angry stranger situations, (well actually they were racist incidents), I have no interest in challenging any angry stranger when there is only a few mins. or secs. to remind /warn/explain anything to them while they are in a car and I'm in on bike.

[crazycanuck]

Umm, I'm not saying that I was annoyed at the gent using the term " Ma'am"..i was honoured to be called "ma'am" & don't hear it at all down this way. I just had to giggle about being called "ma'am"

I'll use Sir if i don't know the person but for a woman, not "ma'am"..

[cosc]

I too was taught early to show respect by addressing my elders as Ma'am and Sir. A simple "yes" or "no" was not acceptable.
Not following through with this expectation might have dire consequences as a youngster.

Mr. Silver I'm glad you talked to the driver. She definitely put her back up, but I imagine she learned something good from the confrontation.

[Crankin]

I may be speaking only for myself, but I don't know anyone who was taught to address people as ma'am and sir and the impending dire consequences if you didn't. It definitely is a regional thing and it will always make me bristle. I don't say anything unless it's in a comfortable situation; like in a store i don't say anything, but the chance of someone calling me ma'am around here is slim.
My son in the Marines uses it now and I have told him to cool it when he's around me. He doesn't address me as ma'am, but I heard him saying it in stores, etc. when we visited him last fall.

[witeowl]

Up until my middle twenties, I bristled a little upon being called ma'am, but that's gone away since I certainly can no longer be called miss. (Besides, I actually feel "miss" is a rather dismissive term, as in, "Don't you worry your little head about that, miss.")

So, for those that are offended by the use of ma'am... What is the alternative? In a situation in which you would use "sir" out of deference or respect, what would be the way to respectfully address a woman?

I'm genuinely stymied.

On a competely different tangent, I hate when people use "lady" to call out to a woman (or, worse yet, address a woman). I can never keep myself from hearing in my head, "Hey, Laaaaddddyyyyyy!" a la Jerry Lewis.