New Windows For My House

[Crankin]

You may be able to pass off a paper from the installer, but the claim form clearly asked for a sticker for each window. We just didn't try after that.

[FlyingScot]

I'm not trying to pick a fight but I wanted to give some food for thought.

http://www.myoldhousejournal.com/pro...c-wood-windows


I just restored 12 double-hung windows in my 90+ year-old house. It was dirty and hard and took forever but I now have weather-tight, environmentally friendly and historically accurate windows. The cost to me was labor and time and a little extra for the glass I accidentally broke. But it was worth every scraped knuckle when I see my beautiful windows. This room that was once the coldest room in the house is now the warmest. Personally I'm a little miffed that I won't be eligible for a tax credit after all my hard work.

[Tuckervill]

I live in an historic house (not in an historic district), and I looked at that little piece about restoring wood windows. They totally lost me when they said "it can take up to 240 years to recoup enough money in energy savings to pay back the cost of replacement windows."

Um, no. I paid about $3500 for 13 windows, and I am saving at least $100 each of the months I have to run the HVAC. Let's say that's 10 months a year, that's 35 months. Of course, other's mileage my vary. But the credibility goes out the window when they make outrageous claims like that.

Karen

[Mr. Bloom]

You get a tax credit for new furnaces too. Guess how I know that.

Veronica

...and let me tell you a story about that...

When renovating my office building, we made the decision to spend $48,000 on totally new HVAC expecting a 10 year pay back. This was a difficult decision.

The first winter, the power company called to say they were investigating a problem with our gas meter.

"Oh", I asked, "Has our usage gone down with our new furnaces?"
"Yes", she replied.
"Great", said Mr. Silver, "How much did it go down?"
Her response: "To nearly 0!"

They thought the meter was broken, IT WASN'T! Instead of a 10 year payback, it's less than 4!

[FlyingScot]

I live in an historic house (not in an historic district), and I looked at that little piece about restoring wood windows. They totally lost me when they said "it can take up to 240 years to recoup enough money in energy savings to pay back the cost of replacement windows."

Um, no. I paid about $3500 for 13 windows, and I am saving at least $100 each of the months I have to run the HVAC. Let's say that's 10 months a year, that's 35 months. Of course, other's mileage my vary. But the credibility goes out the window when they make outrageous claims like that.

Karen

I get your point but that was only one source. I've heard outrageous claims by window manufacturers as well. I just wanted to present another side of the story. My parents replaced wood windows and their bills went up! Also, if your wood windows were not in good repair (not just painted nicely) then really you can't credit the new ones with the energy savings. Not saying yours weren't but that is often the case. Of course new vinyl windows will be better than broken down wooden ones I'm just not convinced that they are actually better than wooden window that are properly cared for.

[Tuckervill]

My old windows were 113 yo single pane wavy glass. The wood was fine. The sash cords had been cut by some idiot previously. They wouldn't open. That could have been fixed, but there's no way that single pane glass would keep out the heat and cold the way the new windows do. Plus, now that I have windows that open, I can take advantage of the way they were placed and designed, in conjunction with tall ceilings, to provide fresh air circulating through the house when the weather is nice out.

Karen

[Crankin]

Well, even without the tax credit, our heating bills are about 1/3 to 1/2 less and the AC doesn't go one until about 1 PM, even if it's 95 out. So it's definitely paid off.

[Chicken Little]

I did them myself, with Lowe's Pella version. About 1 a month for a year. Sure went alot quicker on the 12th one, than the first. I am also miffed my own work isn't recognized, but I did a far superior job that the window company who installed my neighbors. I guess in the end it's for the earth, anyway.

[FlyingScot]

My old windows were 113 yo single pane wavy glass. The wood was fine. The sash cords had been cut by some idiot previously. They wouldn't open. That could have been fixed, but there's no way that single pane glass would keep out the heat and cold the way the new windows do. Plus, now that I have windows that open, I can take advantage of the way they were placed and designed, in conjunction with tall ceilings, to provide fresh air circulating through the house when the weather is nice out.

Karen

I'm sorry, I should have been more specific. I meant wood windows in good repair AND with good quality storms. I'm glad you are happy with your choice though and perhaps we'll just have to agree to disagree. It's the preservationist in me.

[Tuckervill]

Being preservationist doesn't gain me anything in my town. The historic houses stay on the market for years before they're sold. I can count 3 in my neighborhood (which I think are still overpriced) that are empty and/or still on the market after more than a year. It only takes one buyer, but those that want to take on a big old house (or a small old house) are few and far between around here. Fortunately, I knew I would be leaving this house feet first when I bought it, so I'm not fazed by the chance I couldn't sell it.

I fought it hard, getting the new windows. I didn't want to do it. I wanted to have the storm windows repaired, but they were hideous aluminum. The $300 gas bill (plus electric) in the winter for a 1200 sq ft house was just way way too much for the long haul, so I gave in. I'm very very happy with them, and I still have the old windows, which some of my artistic friends have begged me for (for art projects).

There is no market for the old windows (I looked for a year before I found anyone else even selling their old windows--this was before I replaced mine.) So, it seems to me that people are either keeping their old windows, or replacing them with energy efficient ones.

Now my preservationist bent is being challenged again because I can't find anyone to replace the plaster in the upstairs bathroom. They all want to just slap up drywall and call it good, but I'm just not doing that. All the plaster in the house is good, except where they glued paneling to it! I won't be doing traditional plaster (we'll be putting in veneer plaster, which goes over blueboard) and we'll have to do it ourselves, I think.

Karen

[FlyingScot]

There is no market for the old windows (I looked for a year before I found anyone else even selling their old windows--this was before I replaced mine.) Now my preservationist bent is being challenged again because I can't find anyone to replace the plaster in the upstairs bathroom. They all want to just slap up drywall and call it good, but I'm just not doing that. All the plaster in the house is good, except where they glued paneling to it! I won't be doing traditional plaster (we'll be putting in veneer plaster, which goes over blueboard) and we'll have to do it ourselves, I think.

Karen

Keep your old windows in case you decide to sell the house at a later time. It will be a good selling point. As far as the plaster. There is a product called Master of Plaster that is really easy to use. I only had to do a skim coat though and I don't know how far gone your walls are. If you go to the Old House Journal Website there is a poster named Clarence Bauer ( I think I spelled that correctly). He is a master plasterer and he highly recommends the stuff and gives great instructions on how to repair walls. Are there holes or did the whole wall get destroyed?

[tulip]

My house is 70 years old with the original single-hung windows. I love them. They have four vertical panes on top and one single pane on the bottom. Vinyl replacement windows would just look terrible and really diminish the character of the house.

I plan on repairing my existing windows (like FlyingScot did) and putting up good-quality storm windows and screens. The storm windows are not all aluminum frames these days. They can be painted to match whatever color scheme you have on your house. With properly repaired windows (sash repaired, weatherstripping, storms), the savings is at least as good as the replacement windows, and there are no old windows to add to the landfill.

Thanks for the link, FlyingScot. I may not get the tax credit (but I think you still can for stormwindows), but for me, it's important to retain the character of my house while still increasing the energy savings.

While I have not looked into it, there might be replacement windows that are wood framed, copy historic patterns, and are super efficient. But you still have the problem of how to dispose of the old windows.