When the lowest gear isn't low enough

[Miranda]

I was just pondering my gearing with the new upcoming ride. I'm losing some higher gears for lower ones. Thinking if I should change my cassette.

My heartrate can take a lot typically. So, my theory was on the one hill I needed the small ring of my triple was pedal like mad. But, at the top I thought I might stroke. Now, I'm thinking my goal is to become profient climbing standing in a bigger gear. Which does take more leg strength, vs heart rate for spinning fast in a low one. It's all a process... just keep at it.

If you decided to switch out your cassette to get lower gears, you could always switch it back up to the bigger ones once you are stronger to climb.

I'm a Spinning certified instructor. One of the nice things about training inside is that you get off the bike, and you are done. If mid hill climb you decide it's too much on your knees... take some resistence off, and bonus you don't cartwheel backwards down a real outside hill.

One thing I hate as a roadie/mtb with some of my fellow spin teachers is queing adding resistence so low I *know* it's bad for these peeps knees. Outside, I would shift or dismount. I have some joint issues and know my limitations.

I'm with Mr. Silver... walking a hill is NOT the end of the world... it beats crawling into an orthopedic surgeon's office any day.

[txred9876]

Or that they have a bigger cassette in the back. - Count the number of teeth on the smallest/largest cog: what's yours-11-23?? what's theirs? a 12-25 or 12-27?
I don't really think spin class is needed to teach you better spinning.

I was not referring to spin class teaching one better spinning. I think the cardio and endurance one can gain out of spin classes is valuable. I know in my case it has made me a stronger rider (in a very quick time frame).

Tina

[crazycanuck]

Marfa,

Just a couple of things about Perth hills.

If you're doing the hill just past Matilda bay going towards claremont (the one where you go round the roundabout by UWA & then turn left towards the end of the road) then you need to get your speed up along the flat section. ONce you get past the roundabout by the old Steve's pub, keep your speed up as the hill you come to is best attacked by jumping out of the saddle.

If you're doing Welshpool Road East (for non Perth folks, this road does not have a shoulder & the only place to stop is right at the top) do a combination of jumping out of the saddle & in the saddle. Just remember it's a hard hill to conquer & best done very first thing on a weekend morning!!!

Kings Park-After a while, the uphill sections are easier! There's only one hill that i find a bit hard-the area that was scorched by the evil arsonist . Hill repeats in Kings Park are good!!!

Perth hills are manageable! The hardest hill in the CBD is Mount Street but that can be conquered by doing the bottom section first. Great for mtn biking hill skills too!!

[marfa]

Or that they have a bigger cassette in the back. - Count the number of teeth on the smallest/largest cog: what's yours-11-23?? what's theirs? a 12-25 or 12-27?
I don't really think spin class is needed to teach you better spinning.

Hey chaps
Thanks for all your replies - and yep to those in Perth, it was Reobald hill I was going up !! Nightmare..

I've just counted the number the teeth I have 11-23.

What does that mean then?

Thanks

Marfa

[Becky]

I've just counted the number the teeth I have 11-23.

What does that mean then?

It's good news It means that you have what amounts to a higher-geared racing cassette, and there are plenty of options for lower-geared cassettes. You should be able to get something like a 12-25 or 12-27 pretty easily, and I think SRAM might even make a 11/12-28.

When changing cassettes, just make sure that your rear derailleur can handle the bigger cog and that your chain is long enough. Your shop can definitely help with this.

[sundial]

I'm with Mr. Silver... walking a hill is NOT the end of the world... it beats crawling into an orthopedic surgeon's office any day.

Amen!

SRAM does make a compact 11-28--I have one on my Roubaix.

[Grog]

Hey chaps
I've just counted the number the teeth I have 11-23.

What does that mean then?

I'll try a different way to explain this, bear with me:

Every time your back wheel rotates, you go forward about 2 meters or 6.5 feet.

When you are in the 11-tooth cog, the effort is divided by 11. So for every cog you go forward 7.5 inches or so.

If you are on the 23-tooth cog, the effort is divided by 23. So for every cog you go forward 3.5 inches or so.

Think of it as lifting weights: I can't lift 100 lbs. But I can lift a 10 lbs weight ten times.

Just the same way, if I'm going up a hill, I have a hard time moving forward 7.5 inch at a time in my 11-tooth cog. So I switch to an easier gear with more teeth (so a bigger cog) and I go forward, say, 4 inches at a time.

But if the hill is really steep, maybe 4 inch at a time is still too much. Maybe 3 inch at a time would be better. So I would need to have a 28-tooth cog at the back to be able to do that.

As someone else mentioned, you can get a cassette (a set of cogs) with more bigger cogs at the back. That will give you an easier time on steep hills. Think again of lifting weights: what you have currently is like the weights of a weightlifter (bike racer): lots of 20-25 lbs weights. If you're merely human like most of us you will probably appreciate 5-8-10 lbs weights. You'll find those on a 12-28.

[To understand this fully, you would have to take into account the chainring at the front. The chainring multiplies your effort at the back. But you just asked about 11-23 so I'll leave it at that.]

[Becky]

Great explanation, Grog! I've never truly understood gearing and found it really helpful

[shellkay1212]

Grog,

Thanks for the explanation! I GET IT!!! After two years of totally not getting it - amazing! THANK YOU!

[wackyjacky1]

+1 on props to Grog. Ah ha!

[pinkbikes]

Hey chaps

I've just counted the number the teeth I have 11-23.

What does that mean then?

The other way I have used to explain to friends what Grog has said so well is..

If you have 52 teeth on your big front ring, then every time you turn your pedals around one full revolution, you move forward by 52 teeth. This is because for every tooth you move your chainring around, you move your rear wheel around a tooth too. So you will move your rear wheel around by 52 teeth too.

So, if you are using your 11 tooth gear on the rear then you will turn your back wheel around 52/11 times (ie. 4.7times) each time you rotate your pedals once. That's hard work!

But if you are using your 25 tooth gear on the rear, then you will turn your back wheel around 52/25 times (ie. 2.1times) each time you rotate your pedals once, which is a lot easier.

Similarly, if you are using your small ring on the front, it may have 39 teeth (or 42 or some other number depending on what type of gearing you have). In this case you will go forward say 39 teeth each time you turn the pedals.

So when you use the 11 on the rear, you are turning your rear wheel 39/11 times (ie. 3.5times) each time you turn the pedals, which is easier than if you were turning it 4.7times on the big ring. Or if you are on the 25 at the rear it will be 39/25 times (ie. 1.6times) each time you turn the pedals. And that's got to be a lot easier!

Who loves their MTB that has a 22 on the front and a 34 on the back? That is 22/34 times, in other words, two thirds of a turn of the rear wheel for each pedal rotation! We LOVE the granny!

[Miranda]

Ahh... I love this forum. It has taken me many times of reading things like the explanation above, trying to even look at good ole Sheldon Brown's on-line gear ratio calculator, to *finally* get what my gears were all about (in terms of comparison).

Besides this wonderful explanation as such in this thread, I did this the other day (I need to see it and touch it to learn "it" btw)...

I took a pad of notebook paper and pen and camped out next to my bike in the formal dining room (aka bike room). I made myself a grid-table on paper with the teeth numbers on each ring of what I have now (plus what the proposed gearing would have on another grid)...

Then I looked at where the most chain grease and grime was on my cassette from where I usually shift/ride (yes, bad bike mommy-she's dirty, but w/helpful evidence to my puzzle)...

I marked those teeth numbers off on my paper grid...

Then I compared to what my new proposed cassette teeth wise and front chain rings would be to see if I had equal gears, OR... got more teeth to turn around... or less (I also drew lines sorta like an elementary school kids' matching work sheet ).

SUDDENLY at that "line drawing moment", everything I have read/been told about gearing "clicked".

Signed,
Miranda
Thick-Headed Proud Rider Of The Short Bus...
(who NOW understands gears)

[TxDoc]

I suspect it's a combination of training and technique...but hey, worse case, there's no hill that can't be walked!

True, as King Fabian recently showed us after his chain broke...
http://www.pezcyclingnews.com/?pg=fullstory&id=6924

[OakLeaf]

yeah, phew, excuse me...

I knew the OP was Australian which is why I posted a price range in USD (sorry for not checking the exchange rate )... but what I didn't know was that the price of cassettes has doubled since I last replaced mine last summer! We were discussing that on the club ride this morning, it's true across brands and price ranges and none of us knew why.

[marfa]

hey Grog

Just wanted to say what a fantastic explanation- especially the weight lifting part, totally get it now why I was struggling!

Thanks again this forum rocks!