Help with motivating a teenager

[Irulan]

Mom of two GATE boys here. (GATE = Gifted and Talented Education, typically 97percentile and above) One is off the charts and we almost lost him as a student forever in the lower grades he was so bored.

The best thing we ever did was put them in our district's magnet program for gifted kids for middle school (grades 5-8, 4 classes, total 100 kids). Do you have access to ANYTHING? Most bright kids start blowing school off because they are bored, not interested in the curriculum, feeling superior to the regular kids etc. In addition, it's very normal developmentally for teen boys between the ages of 13-17 or so to really not have much motivation or follow through unless they are particularly interested in something. This is actually a brain chemistry/development fact, not just about attitude.

Chances are he's either bored to tears or has a learning disability ( which is different from giftedness) that is getting in the way of his success.

If you have access to anything to augment the school experience, go for it - even if they go kicking and screaming. if they have the option to work at their speed and create some of their own study plans, that is what I would recommend. I was lucky to have it through the public school, but in some areas you have to go to a private school to get the challenges. It's really a shame that the lower level kids in general get a lot more funding and attention that the high level kids who can "fend for themselves".

Where my kids did the best was in self study math: they were allowed to work on district math as fast as they could inhale it, and in what was called, Independent Projects where they could take ANY topic and make a full semester of study on it, covering as many aspects as possible. They entered high school at the Senior level of the district math program.

I hate to break it to you, but straight A's in most elementary schools isn't that great of an accomplishment. Any bright kid that's focused can do that, unless the curriculum is particularly challenging. Middle school has so many distractions, too - it's full of raging hormones and social drama - who has time for learning?

If your school has a counselor, you might talk to them about what kind of options are out there. One idea that other parents used was a super special extracurricular activity that would be funded/permitted if they could get their grades up. An example that comes to mind is fencing. I Knew a kid that really, really wanted to do it, and that was the carrot on the stick that worked for them.

Also inquire if there's an honors program at the high school level, and what it might take to get him into it. Good luck. If he's got the habit already of being a slacker, you might really have your work cut out for you. Somehow, you, or an inspirational teacher has got to trigger that love of learning switch.

Another resort might be home schooling - giving him the opportunity to follow some of his interests with guidance to keep it learning based. This however requires a HUGE commitment form the parents. I certainly couldn't have done it.

A side note. The teachers working with my kids and others were really big on parents NOT micromanaging their kid's work load. The thinking was, let them see what failing and forgetting things feels like, and learn from it, in middle school where it doesn't really matter instead of high school, where it does. God Bless Mrs. Mai, who literally got in my face and told me to butt out of my kids business, and let them learn how to be accountable for their own stuff.

as you say, take what you like and leave the rest. This is just my experience.

Irulan

[DDH]

Thanks girls. He has been in the gifted program for public schools since 2nd grade so he is already in, what they consider the higher level learning here.
He says school is boring, however the school system here doesn't really offer anymore. Also, they will not advance him or do any extra when he shows no initiative to do any more than he absolutely has to to get by.
This is where it becomes a two edged sword. I'm very involved always have been, but I have stepped back to try to make him accountable, but when he doesn't do what he needs to, then I feel I have to step in.

My parenting belief is that when kids don't do the responsible thing then we must step in and require it from them. Just as I wouldn't let him get away with not brushing his teeth because he doesn't' like it, I won't let him not do his school work because he is bored.
There are extra programs for the kids to do as you suggested, however my son has no interest, nor would they let him with his lack of motivation.

I just get so frustrated because I know his abilities and IQ level yet he doesn't live up to even a close amount of his potential.
I just have such a hard time sitting back and waiting to see if he is going to pick it up, and I can't just hope that it will get better.

I mean, I do hope it gets better, but I can't sit back and do nothing in the mean time.

We live in a military town that is city sized in population, but still country minded when it comes to resources. There just isn't a lot in the way of mentor type programs or extra learning outside school in the arts or music, or museums or things like that. I guess I could get him into FAA or 4H, but he is to techy minded to want to farm or raise animals and has no interest in any of that stuff either. So I am left raising my hands in defeat half the time, trying to figure things out.

I appreciate all your suggestions and you are right, it's not a huge deal for elementary kids to get straight A's, but it makes it no easier to go from that to C's and D's in his core courses and only an A in PE, or Art.

I just wish I could motivate him, and get something out of him about what he needs to help him enjoy school a little more.
If he would put in even a small percentage of effort he would be doing very well, he just refuses to do any more than he has to to get by.

Drives me crazy!!! I need a little smiley that is pulling her hair out. LOL

[Irulan]

Where is his Dad in all this? At the age your son is at, many times they respond much better to males than females. This is the age where they start to move away from their moms, and this includes just listening to them. Maybe if there is a strong male role model to read him the riot act (which you do have to do once in a while) that might be more effective. Just a thought.

[derailed]

I work with a lot of very bright people of different ages. I have noticed that a lot of exceptional young people do not "connect" with their teachers or parents til a bit later, but often do connect with an adult with hobbies or interests in common.

He may not be able to let go of his frustrations to talk to you yet, but if there is a personable counselor in the school system, perhaps you can arrange some time for your boy to communicate openly and privately, and step back.

Letting him have the freedom to speak his mind with an adult, and learn some methods to communicate to you what his stresses and frustrations are might help him open up some. He may lack the language at this point to explain the problem in an effective manner.

[sfa]

Have you asked him what you think you all should do? If he was an A student before and is doing poorly now because he's bored, he has to be aware on some level that continuing like this will only lead to more boredom--he'll either fail and have to repeat a grade or he'll be put in lower level classes with even more dull work. If you can talk to him in a sit-down, heart-to-heart kind of way and lead the conversation in such a way that he admits that he's not happy with his grades and would like to do better, then you can also lead the conversation around to HIM deciding what he should do to change the situation. It may well be your idea, but you can manipulate the conversation so that it comes out as his idea. With his "ownership" of the solution, it's far more likely to be successful. Some of that might just be admitting that it IS boring and tedious to do this stuff, but sometimes you have to put up with boring and tedious to get where you want to be. He may surprise you with some ideas--perhaps some activity he'd like to do that can be his reward for getting through his homework (along the lines of if he does his homework every day of the week, then he can go to the movies with his friends on the weekend, or he can't go out to play basketball until he's finished studying--don't make it be a big expensive reward, but rather something he likes to do daily or weekly already that he only allows himself to do once he's done the stuff he has to do).

Some of what he's dealing with may just be internal disorganization, which is pretty typical of the age, and he needs to learn for himself what it takes to get himself moving in the right direction and keeping on track with his work. Again, see if he can come up with ideas for solving the problem--maybe he needs visual reminders like a dry erase calendar with all of his tasks on it, or maybe a good alarm clock to keep him on task while he does his work.

But I really think the key is to get HIM involved in the solution. I suspect that if you just add work on he'll see it as punishment and dig in his heels further.

Sarah

[DDH]

His dad is here. He and his dad go head to head worse than I do with him. My DH is a SGT at the police department and has worked at the department for 28 years. He is very preachy and strong handed. The strong handed I do not mind, but the preachy stuff drives me as crazy as it does my son.

I have talked to my DH, (not in front of the boy of course) about making his point and then dropping it. It is a proved fact that most children will hear you for about a minute or 2 or maybe a little longer and then they begin to tune you out. Shoot, I do it myself if someone is going on and on about something. It's not intentional, but I catch myself tuning out too.

His father gets on him hard about things. We agree on punishments and things that need to be done, it's just that he gets very long winded and then I tend to lean to the more lenient side because of it. His approach needs as much if not more work than mine. Our son thinks that when we talk to him we are fussing. We can't seem to say anything even in the sweetest tone without him thinking that we are getting on to him.

I think you are right about the getting him to figure out what he thinks needs to be done, and letting him take ownership of it. I just don't know how to open up a conversation about it anymore.
He shuts down a lot of the times as soon as I broach the subject and then of course I get upset and start fussing at him, or just shut down too.
I always thought I would make sure I would have open communication with my child and tried to make sure he knew he could talk to me about anything. Somewhere I failed at that. He doesn't seem to trust us to open up to us and I guess that is our fault.


I will try again though. I never give up, I just feel like it sometimes.
I am always looking for new ways to approach him or help him.
I know he must be frustrated also, he just doesn't do anything about fixing the problem so the frustration goes away.

He really is a great kid. He's very responsible and trustworthy at home and when we go out. He behaves very well anywhere we go and never gets into any trouble at school. He's been taught to be polite and respectful. He loves to try to make people laugh once he gets to know them. He can be very silly and funny. His teachers and others usually find him very pleasant and love having him around. He can be very loving when he wants to be, but he's a teenage boy so that is not nearly as often as it use to be.

It's just school and getting work done. He test great most of the time so if they could just teach and then test, he would do fine. LOL

[crazycanuck]

I don't have kids & understand my ideas may not be welcomed in this thread.

I thought of two places I see often near my work & although i don't know much about them, they might be of use/interest?

http://www.kipmcgrath.us/

http://www.kumon.com/

Just a thought.

[Grog]

I do not have much to offer in terms of advice.

But I remember an older thread about taking care of things in the home and sharing tasks with kids and spouses.

I seem to remember - and it rings right with what I read now - that your son doesn't do much around the house.

Maybe it's a good time to start. Maybe it's a time to do more together that's not necessarily focused on you telling him to do school work, but something that's productive, in which he gets to see you accomplish things and he gets to accomplish things in front of you.

Frankly, even if I was in the best school in the province, a gifted student among a thousand ultra-gifted students, school itself would never have been enough to make me want to go to school and do well. It was all the other stuff, leadership opportunities, social activities, volunteering, etc. that made me want to go. School stuff in itself never quite motivated me, it was too easy. I procrastinated my way to a PhD. But all the side aspects, that's what really gets me going.

Sorry that's all I can offer. Good luck!

[shootingstar]

He really is a great kid. He's very responsible and trustworthy at home and when we go out. He behaves very well anywhere we go and never gets into any trouble at school. He's been taught to be polite and respectful. He loves to try to make people laugh once he gets to know them. He can be very silly and funny. His teachers and others usually find him very pleasant and love having him around. He can be very loving when he wants to be, but he's a teenage boy so that is not nearly as often as it use to be.

It's just school and getting work done. He test great most of the time so if they could just teach and then test, he would do fine. LOL

I hope he sees /hears what you wrote here. Praise for what he is good now as a person ..while he improves in other areas..you can never go wrong here.

[DDH]

Quote:
Originally Posted by DDH
He really is a great kid. He's very responsible and trustworthy at home and when we go out. He behaves very well anywhere we go and never gets into any trouble at school. He's been taught to be polite and respectful. He loves to try to make people laugh once he gets to know them. He can be very silly and funny. His teachers and others usually find him very pleasant and love having him around. He can be very loving when he wants to be, but he's a teenage boy so that is not nearly as often as it use to be.

It's just school and getting work done. He test great most of the time so if they could just teach and then test, he would do fine. LOL

I hope he sees /hears what you wrote here. Praise for what he is good now as a person ..while he improves in other areas..you can never go wrong here.

Most definitely, I try to make sure he understands that. I gave him a valentine card that stated how proud I was of him and he said "well I know that's a lie". I looked at him and I said "of course it isn't a lie."
I told him, there a many things to be proud of him about other than just grades and then I named these many things to him.
I told him, he is good looking, very smart regardless of what his grades say, funny, polite, well behaved, pleasent to be around, helpful when he wants to be, and everyone else likes him too. I told him "son, your grades don't make you who you are."

He is very much loved, and it amazes me that I can look at him and know he is my heart, yet he doesn't know it, even with all I do for him and as often as I tell him how much I love him. One negative thing going on in your life an so easily and quickly erase all the positives. I guess we are all guilty, I have to make myself step back at times and go, wait, things aren't so bad.

[shootingstar]

well, DDH hope you and your hubby just continue to believe in the best of him while he works to ramp up the rest. And if there's a low-cost/no-cost activity on weekends or after school, that will naturally fall into his natural strengths/interest, even better. It makes me cringe when nowadays school budgets have trimmed down on the fine arts, music, sports, etc.

Unless, DDH you suspect something else, he doesn't sound like ADD at this point in his life. He just doesn't know of other alternatives for himself because as you say in your immediate school district there aren't specialized programs for gifted. My niece at around 15, was bored and approached her parents to see if she could go to a specialized school for bright/gifted kids. I don't think she was gifted, just very focused and bright when she put her little mind to it. Parents were abit surprised but ..in the end, she got a little bursary to help her along.

I don't have children so my thoughts aren't as useful. I'm only a bystander to watching my partner deal with his 2 children as they grew up. His daughter is self-directed learner and always did well. She has her Master's in English Lit. His son felt he was always in the shadow of his older sister's accomplishments (sounds familiar to some of us??). He was an average student and more of a social animal. He (nor his sister) got into drugs and they each had a crowd of good friends. At 16 yrs., he started to fail...and eventually not go to school. Finally each of his parents (who were divorced by then, but thankfully had parallel parenting styles and values), each told him, either he stay in school or find a job.

To make this story shorter, he left home, hung out with some friends...and THANKFULLY found jobs in restaurants in Victoria, lived there. Got a girl pregnant...let's see by then, he was 20. Needless to say my partner was more than surprised.

Split up with girlfriend, came back to Toronto,..got his high school diploma, took some community college courses to become a chef.

He is now 28, happily married to another woman who just finished her university degree. He faithfully pays his child support and has his son with him in visits when it's his turn. He voraciously collects and reads cheffy cookbooks. Whenever he or we visit him, he cooks us these incredible gourmet chef meals..like the stuff you see in TV. Kinda like black box of ingredients ..and pouff,..a tasty meal.

Most ironically, his son was a supervising chef for a major chic restaurant in toronto where my brother-in-law also worked for awhile. All coincidental.

And I firmly believe, that his son would have fallen much further down the pit if it weren't for:

a) a father who consistently listened, communicated and visited his son.
b) a mother who did the same as well.
c)child is held accountable for his /her own life decisions as they grow into teenagehood and beyond.

And that the parenting styles for the child needs to be good and parallel.