Driving:when will you stop?

[Aquila]

I worry about my mom driving, and in all sorts of ways, about what I'm going to do as I get older. Driving is one thing I worry about; as a single woman, in a community with lousy public transportation and low property values, how will I get around? And if I can't get around, how would I ever get out into an area with better public transportation?

My Mom, though, I worry about driving, because she just doesn't seem to pay close attention. But then I wonder if I'm just being really judgmental because we have conflicts. I can't imagine she'd respond well if I tried to tell her not to drive, so I hope when/if the time comes, my brother will be part of the conversation.

[emily_in_nc]

My grandfather, who lived to 96, asked my mom nearly every day for the last few years of his life (after my grandmother died and my mom had to move him to NC), where his car was, when he could drive again, etc. He had Alzheimer's so the driving thing became an obsession with him. It seems to be one of the last things that men in particular just can't give up on or forget about, at least when they have some dementia going on.

Myself, I hope to live in a place where I can be car-free once I get "too old" to drive, or MUCH earlier. Just wish there were more places that were car-free-friendly.

[shootingstar]

Well this situation is real, my partner's mother died last year at 93.

After her husband died, she lived in the same city as my partner or earlier, at least 100 kms. away from him. Or other years, she lived with her other son (who lives in the US) at different times of her life. Whenever she lived in the same city/near same city as my partner, my partner never had a car. She also never learned to drive. But she did take public transit or walked to do grocery shopping right up until she was 86 yrs. old. Store would be approx. 2 kms. away at most.

It never occurred to her to demand her son (my partner) to buy a car to transport her around. When she lived in Vancouver right up to her death, she was close enough for us to bike over or walk to her place. My partner faithfully visited his mother several times a week by getting there on bike or walking. The furthest she ever lived from us was about 5 kms. away..she lived in 3 different places over a period of 6 years, each place signifying a different level of independence/care.

When she became wheelchair bound she truly missed her walks, even during the time she was using a walker. Walking to her, was like cycling is to us. I mean it was amazing for her to do her 2 km. walk with my partner walking along side at age 91 yrs., up a 6-7% grade long hill.

She was very fortunate to have family near by in a big city ....who like her, didn't have a car at all. That includes her grand-daughter who doesn't have a car either.

And occasionally we had her take taxi during bad weather times. Averaged about 1-2 times per month.

[Geonz]

One of the reasons I don't drive much at all and sold my car is because I like being independent... without endangering others. I suspect that I'm not really much more distractible than most people but two or three times (in many thousand miles of driving) I've only avoided tragedy by dumb luck.

[shootingstar]

Some interesting but sad stories. I know a number of women who are single and now into their 40's and onward. They still don't have a car but live close to public transportation. It's not a big deal for them because they continued on with life for long enough so far.

It is an active choice to live in areas with public transportation ..or even local taxi company in operation for the occasional necessary lifts and bulky groceries.

[tulip]

There are grocery delivery companies in many cities. That would be really helpful if you lived without a car and were not able to do daily shopping on foot.

[OakLeaf]

I don't have an answer, but in thinking about it, I'm realizing that living where a car is necessary is not only poor planning for the planet, it's poor planning for our personal future.

I honestly don't expect my Florida home to be above water by the time I'm no longer able to drive. Even so, as a healthy middle-aged adult it would be very easy to forego a car here. But if and when my eyesight, reflexes and/or judgment no longer allow me to drive a car, I won't be able to ride a bicycle here safely either, and public transit is minimal. Where we live in Ohio it would be EXTREMELY difficult to go without a car, and it would definitely require a high level of physical and mental fitness.

So... can we take this thread in a slightly different direction? Who lives someplace, or knows of a place, with good public transit and access to a variety of physical necessities, arts, services and social activities, where someone could live without a motor vehicle, without being terribly isolated and deprived? WHERE will we go when we stop driving?

I nominate D.C. off DuPont Circle where my grandmother lived for several years. (Just a few miles from the house where she'd lived for decades.) It always seemed like a terrific place to live at any age. Where else?

[tulip]

DC, NYC, Boston area in the US (I'm an east coaster). Other cities, too, just in the right location. Downtown Asheville, Richmond (where I live) is pretty good if you are downtown or in the Fan, although there's no grocery store right downtown. Also Durham and Raleigh have great downtowns. Those are just the places I am familiar with.

I'm considering Europe as well. In general, European countries have much better health care systems than the US. Fortunately for me, I'm an EU citizen so I can just move there without visa worries. So for me, Paris, Nantes, Bordeaux...what wonderful possibilities! Even the small towns have stores downtown and many have train service to other areas.

[MomOnBike]

We had a conversation with my mid 90's Mother-In-Law recently about her driving. It was not a congenial talk. When her driver's licence was renewed about a year ago, I felt like driving the 600 miles and strangeling the examiner with my own two hands. MIL scared me white 30 years ago when she drove, and she can't have improved over the years.

Me, I'd love to give up driving at any time. I just don't care for it. Sadly, I'm not quite in a position to do so, yet.

As for WHERE one gives up driving, my thought is that one can, with careful attention to the particular block of the particular street you live on, be able to go car-free in almost any medium-to large city, and quite a few small towns. It's all about location, location, location. Of course, whether or not you can afford such a location is a concern.

[aly]

Personally, I already avoid driving and would be happy to stop completely. However, I'm facing the same issue as many others concerning my grandfather. My grandparents live about 2000 miles away. They are both 86. My grandma has many, many health problem and can barely get around now. My grandfather still shovels his own snow, mows his own yard, cares for my grandma, and drives. He has heart surgery about 30 years ago. He has bad diabetes. However, he's still pretty together for his age. This doesn't stop me from concern over his driving. He just isn't nearly as quick as he used to be, and I worry.

The problem is that they live in a small town and aren't physically able to walk everywhere. The doctors appointments are in a nearby town (and some are about 40 minutes away). The grocery is a few minutes away by car. They have hard winters, so this limits things. There really aren't available car services. All of their children are deceased, and the only other grandchildren are my brother (who lives near me and is disabled) and my cousin, who lives about 20 minutes away from them, but he's very irresponsible and can't be bothered. Most of their friend have passed and they don't really have a strong community anymore because of their inability to go out much because of my grandmother.

Driving means life to my grandfather. I know he would deteriorate quickly if he wasn't able to drive. He also refuses to leave his home to go to any type of assisted living. They have been in the same house for 60 years and after losing all 4 of their children, they want to hold onto the memories, comfort, etc.

I tried to discuss the driving issue once, but was quickly shut down by both of them. It's a tough situation. Unfortunately, I think this is a common situation for a good number of our elderly population.

[Grog]

Many, many places in Europe, of course.

In North America, it's harder:

Vancouver, B.C., would be do-able, but you'd have to choose carefully. Montreal, Quebec, is much better, in most places within city boundaries. New York City, Boston/Cambridge of course. I think Portland would be pretty good in many areas, but I have found Seattle to be very car-centered and divided by deep highways. I don't know the city all that well though. I don't know a lot about Winnipeg, Edmonton, and Calgary, but the outlook seems grim to me. Toronto? I guess.

San Francisco, maybe? But it's steep.

Following Kunstler (The Long Emergency), small, former industrial towns (New England style) are best for the long term, if one lives in the centre. However considering the standard of health care that is required to keep so many of us alive, it would make it difficult in smaller towns with no high-level medical infrastructure.

[GLC1968]

I don't have an answer, but in thinking about it, I'm realizing that living where a car is necessary is not only poor planning for the planet, it's poor planning for our personal future.

I honestly don't expect my Florida home to be above water by the time I'm no longer able to drive. Even so, as a healthy middle-aged adult it would be very easy to forego a car here. But if and when my eyesight, reflexes and/or judgment no longer allow me to drive a car, I won't be able to ride a bicycle here safely either, and public transit is minimal. Where we live in Ohio it would be EXTREMELY difficult to go without a car, and it would definitely require a high level of physical and mental fitness.

So... can we take this thread in a slightly different direction? Who lives someplace, or knows of a place, with good public transit and access to a variety of physical necessities, arts, services and social activities, where someone could live without a motor vehicle, without being terribly isolated and deprived? WHERE will we go when we stop driving?

I nominate D.C. off DuPont Circle where my grandmother lived for several years. (Just a few miles from the house where she'd lived for decades.) It always seemed like a terrific place to live at any age. Where else?

I nominate Portland. Even if you live in the outlying areas like Hillsboro - it is still totally possible to get where you need to go by light rail or walking (depending on where you live) and downtown Portland is only an easy 40 minute ride. Plus, TE is here...so there's that.

Actually, I have never really thought about my own time to give up driving. I fully assume that everyone will be car-free by then - there won't be anymore oil so the age of cheap fuel will be well over with... I do worry about my parents though. They are both fiercely independent (but still in their 60's, so there's plenty of time) and live in a place where biking or walking is taking your life into your hands once outside their neighborhood/club area. Even when I visit, I won't ride a bike there - too fricken dangerous! I hope that changes sometime in the next 20 years so that they will have options when the time comes.

[Possegal]

My mother lived in Pittsburgh and never drove. She got around just fine, as did I when I lived and worked there and owned no car. Great city with good access to transportation, if you live in the right areas of course. And unlike some of the other cities (like DC), it is quite affordable. I'd love to live in DC here, rather than the MD burbs. But I can't afford it! But man, what I could afford to own back in the 'burgh!

[redrhodie]

My little city is pretty good for having everything in walking distance, but the big problem (other than there's no Indian restaurant) is that no one shovels their sidewalks. It must be really awful for the elderly and wheelchair bound to get around here in winter. Just something to consider about New England.

[denny]

Gosh, this thread has really made me start thinking about the unthinkable. I really do have to start planning more.

I just got back from Fort Myers, FL yesterday and it seems like there were so many people on bikes both old and young. Interestingly, many don't seem to be concerned with wearing helmets. I did notice there were some elderly people who were on tri-cycles complete with panniers and flags who had been shopping somewhere. I thought that it was such a neat option to continue getting around in the absence of public transport.

I think NYC is great for it's transit system, but generally unsafe and cold.
Miami sounds nice and warm,not sure about affordability. The Golden Girls sure made it look like fun though.