High Heartrates and HR Zone training

[BabyBlueNTulsa]

I have a situation/question for you gals..

My HR is consistently high on the bike. I stopped using the strap with my PowerTap b/c I never saw changes (lowering) while training over months. I got stronger and faster, but my hr didn't go down. This first ride I did with my Garmin yesterday, I wore the HR strap. Big surprise, my HR is still high. It said my average was in zone 4-5 (aerobic/anaerobic) for most all the ride.
I was doing some reading today about calorie consumption calculations, but stumbled upon HR zone training. Now I know maybe some people just naturally exercise at a higher HR, but maybe that combined with our heat here (getting to triple digits) is taking more out of me than it should. Am I training (riding) too hard? I needed to do yardwork today, but I really didn't feel consumed by a desire to ride after yesterday's excursion (4hrs, nearly60miles, >2K climbing, 94+ by ride's end). In fact, I was watching the Tour this morning and fought it hard not to sleep through most of it. I had to MAKE myself get up and go mow the yard. Felt so tired...

I'm 38 (nearly 39) and am starting to feel hormone changes (for you ladies who know what I'm talking about). Is there more to this HR zone training stuff, or do I just need to take it easier? I can hop on the bike and I'm already at 105.

Then again - - -Maybe I just needed a lazy Sunday?

[maillotpois]

Zone 4 - 5 according to what? Just wondering how you measured those thresholds. Was it a blood LT testing series or through gas exchange or how?

Heat definitely makes some people have higher HR. We had some guys on the team we coached for Death Ride rise precipitously when it was hot. And it does sound as though you may be somewhat overtrained for the conditions.

Helpful to know a bit more about your training and testing background, though.

[Eden]

Generally it is resting HR that is watched as a symptom of over training. You need to know what your typical resting HR is. If you find that it is consistently high that could be a sign you are over training.

Were you using the preset age based HR zones..... they are usually pretty wrong. It's pretty hard to do most of a ride in your true zone 4-5. If I used the formula all of my zones would move up one!

[maillotpois]

Were you using the preset age based HR zones..... they are usually pretty wrong. It's pretty hard to do most of a ride in your true zone 4-5. If I used the formula all of my zones would move up one!

That's why I wondered how she established those zones.

[BabyBlueNTulsa]

Oh yes... see, I assumed that was standard practice - using the preset age thresholds. I had no idea there was any other way.

My resting HR usually sits around 67-75. My avg riding HR on this Saturday ride was 155-161 (depending upon whether you ask GC or MB). They were around the same from my PowerTap data previously too.

I was riding more often last year, I believe.. but I've been doing more consistent "long" (around 100K) rides this year. I haven't all-the-sudden increased anything or tried to bust any of my speed records. The past few weeks though, I've only been riding Wednesday evenings (37 miles, plenty of hills), and Saturdays (usually 55-65 good mix of hills and flat). The HEAT has only really come on in the past 2wks.

Hard to convince myself that I'm overtraining... but hey..what do I know?

[maillotpois]

Is that your resting HR right when you wake up or at some point during the day? (True resting HR is calculated right when you wake up in the morning. Then compare day to day to see how it goes up or down.)

The preset age thresholds are a nice starting point, but if you are really going to maximize the training tools you have invested in (the powertap or garmin), then you should really consider a blood lactate threshold testing or gas exchange testing. Both use lactate threshold as the key value for setting the HR zones. The former (blood lactate testing) is where you ride a computrainer for about a half hour total, and the power level is raised every few minutes and you have blood taken and tested every few minutes as well. Your HR is constantly monitored. This tells you at what HR and power output you are no longer able to clear lactate from your blood.

Gas exchange gives similar values, but that's the one where you're hooked up like a scuba diver to hoses you breathe through.

There's got to be some sports med facility nearby that does this sort of testing.

This testing also gives you peak power values so you can use power for training instead of or in addition to HR testing.

So here's an example of comparing the age based and clinically tested HR values: An online zone calculator based on my age (41) gives me 135 - 147 for zone 3, 147 - 160 for zone 4 and 160 - 169 for zone 5. By contrast, my most recent blood lactate testing in March gave 145 - 168 for zone 3, 168 - 173 as zone 4 and above 171 as zone 5. And I know those March values have increased since then because my level of fitness has improved since the (I was tested shortly after a 2 month break from riding because I'd broken a bone.) So my zones are actually slightly higher than as tested.

So you can see those calculated age based values can be wildly off.

[ima_bleeder]

My resting HR usually sits around 67-75. My avg riding HR on this Saturday ride was 155-161 (depending upon whether you ask GC or MB). They were around the same from my PowerTap data previously too.

Just another point of reference ...
I'm 39, and my resting HR is around 60 - 65.

And here's my HR profile for a race I did back in April. I was absolutely maxed out, and there were a couple of moments where I felt lightheaded and nauseous. I wouldn't have been able to push myself that hard outside of a race, but it did give me good data for figuring out my max.

Based on that profile, the coach I worked with to train for a race in June estimated that my actual MHR is a little over 200. I discovered that on "shorter" rides (no more than a couple of hours), I can spend a fair bit of time around 180 and not burn out. On endurance rides (2 hrs +), I need to keep my average in the 160's or less. I know we've got a lab in town that will do LT testing, and maybe I'll get around to visiting them the next time I set a cycling or fitness goal.

Here's a little quote from Joe Friel on the "220-Age" formula for max:
"This formula is as likely to be wrong—way wrong!—as it is to be right. In sport science, where a reliability quotient of 0.95 is considered good, this formula’s reliability is 0.51. In other words, it’s reliable about half the time."
There are other formulas that may be better on average, but as a rule I don't think you want to use a generalized formula.

If you want to go low-cost and easy ... just pay attention to how you feel at various HR. You'll start to kind of figure out how high you can work and maintain for an endurance ride, vs. what you're only able to maintain for a few minutes ... half an hour ... an hour.

If you want more specific help, but don't want to pay for a coach, you could check out one of Friel's training bibles and follow his formula for finding your LT and HR training zones. And if you can find a lab nearby that will do the LT testing for you that'd be pretty awesome data.

If you have more time than money, hire a coach and let them help you sort through all that information.

And have fun with your Garmin! I love mine.