Clipless pedals: Frogs vs. SPDs

[Kathi]

So I was on the fence between frogs and candies b/c I was worried about too much float v. not enough float. I have a bad knee, and at the advice of the wonderful members of this board I scheduled an appointment with an orthopedist to figure out if I wanted to allow movement or to stabilize the knee, but I had to schedule it way out and then ultimately had to cancel at the last minute b/c my husband was sick. I'd been riding in a great a pair of Specialized MTB shoes with a really stiff sole (not carbon, but very, very stiff) and love them, but they're hard to get into the toe clips, so I got fed up and just went and bought frogs the other day. After two short rides I've got pain all around my bad knee (underneath mostly on the inside, but sensitive all around the kneecap and behind the knee) and pain in both ankles. I've found that if I bend my knee, turn my heel out and press down (as I might when pedaling) I have a lot of pain on the inside below the kneecap, and I'm sure it's from the float that I now have (that I didn't have with the toeclips) allowing me to turn my heel out.

Mudmucker - your post confirmed what I was thinking and saved me another week of trying to make it work. Thanks!!!

I'm off to get the candies...

I have that kind of pain too. It started long before I got Speedplay Pedals. It's called Chrondomalacia or patellofemoral syndrome. It's a chronic condition that requires stretching and strengthening the muscles around the knees to keep it under control. When it flairs up I have to back off my cycling, take anti-inflammatories, stretch, ice, etc.

High mileage at the beginning of the season and pedaling at low cadences or hill climbing too soon also sets it off. When it started this year I only felt pain on the bike but I know if I let it go it will become painful all the time.

If the Candies don't help see your orthopedist.

[Beane]

I have that kind of pain too. It started long before I got Speedplay Pedals. It's called Chrondomalacia or patellofemoral syndrome. It's a chronic condition that requires stretching and strengthening the muscles around the knees to keep it under control. When it flairs up I have to back off my cycling, take anti-inflammatories, stretch, ice, etc.

High mileage at the beginning of the season and pedaling at low cadences or hill climbing too soon also sets it off. When it started this year I only felt pain on the bike but I know if I let it go it will become painful all the time.

If the Candies don't help see your orthopedist.

Kathi-

I just found out that I too have patellofemoral syndrome and my doc showed me some exercises to do, etc. But reading this thread I realized that I only have had the pain this year (when using speedplay light actions) but had none at all last year (with look pedals). Admittedly I have done a lot more riding this year and certainly more hill climbing, so that could be it too. The knee pain really started on about the 3rd day or so of bike tour colorado. Do you think there's a chance the knee pain is related to the pedals? Just curious..

[Kathi]

Kathi-

I just found out that I too have patellofemoral syndrome and my doc showed me some exercises to do, etc. But reading this thread I realized that I only have had the pain this year (when using speedplay light actions) but had none at all last year (with look pedals). Admittedly I have done a lot more riding this year and certainly more hill climbing, so that could be it too. The knee pain really started on about the 3rd day or so of bike tour colorado. Do you think there's a chance the knee pain is related to the pedals? Just curious..

I can't answer your question but here's how I approach my knee pain. First I look at the bike and think about "what changed?"

When you changed to Speedplays did you change your saddle height to accomodate the differences in stack height between the two pedals? Incorrect saddle height can really mess up sensitive knees.

How long did you have the Speedplays before doing BTC?

Making a change in equipment, no matter how small, can cause havoc to the body if you don't deal with the changes slowly. Even though I don't notice the "float" or don't consider it any more than on pedals with less float it could bother your knees if you went to far to soon. I had one of my bikes professionally fitted and made all the changes at once. Then I went on a 3 day tour and road 50-60 miles each day. I continued long rides and it took me a month to get used to the changes (aches and pains in places I never had) and I was thinking the fit was all wrong. Finally, after the aches and pains went away I realized how much better off I was with the new fit.

If I can't find any thing different with the bike then I take a look at my training so:

How much did you train before you did BTC? How hard and how fast did you start out? Did you do hill training? Did you train for long distances?

When I start a new activity I start small. Since I ski in the winter my first spring bike rides are not over 10 miles, mostly flat. I slowly increase the mileage each week. After 500 miles or so I start hill training, easy at first then adding tougher hills. After 1,000 miles or so I seem to be able to ride anything without issue. Keeping my cadence high 80-90 rpm keeps my knees happy. While I can climb at 50-60 rpm's I can't do it for long.

My last thought is are you doing your exercise and stretching routine on a regular basis? It's hard to do it when you feel no pain but for this kind of knee condition it's imperative that you do it on regularly.

I messed up my knee in June because I didn't follow my own training guidelines, wasn't doing my exercises and stretching and tried doing a 3 hr climb near the Canyon of the Black Gunnison. Even with the long downhill my average cadence wasn't over 70 rpm. The next day we rode the "easy" side of the Canyon of the Black Gunnison and I only made it 6.5 miles before I had to turn around. I'm still feeling the effects.

Foam rollers and self massage helps alot and, of course, ibuprofin and ice.

This condition is tricky and one ortho I saw told me "you can be doing everything right (meaning exercise, stretching) and still have pain, or you can be doing nothing (no exercise, stretching) and be fine". I let myself coast from the intensive ACL rehab I did 2 years ago and am now paying the price.

If you decide to do another Colorado tour, or just a tour, Ride the Rockies has training guidelines to help riders prepare for the ride. I'm currently using the guidelines for a ride next month in N. Dakota.

Hope this helps you. Unfortunately, this condition is one you will have to learn to manage, it is lifelong, and will not go away.

[Beane]

I can't answer your question but here's how I approach my knee pain. First I look at the bike and think about "what changed?"

When you changed to Speedplays did you change your saddle height to accomodate the differences in stack height between the two pedals? Incorrect saddle height can really mess up sensitive knees.

How long did you have the Speedplays before doing BTC?

How much did you train before you did BTC? How hard and how fast did you start out? Did you do hill training? Did you train for long distances?

My last thought is are you doing your exercise and stretching routine on a regular basis? It's hard to do it when you feel no pain but for this kind of knee condition it's imperative that you do it on regularly.

I think the main thing was just not putting in enough miles before the miles and climbing of BTC.

I had the speedplays on the bike all spring before BTC.. I did maybe 1300 miles or so on them. The other issue is that it was my first real season on my new bike (less than 20 miles before winter hit.. and while I did trainer miles its not the same..), so it really could be any number of things. I guess I will just need to be diligent about the exercises & stretches and get used to the pain!

Thanks for the advice!