OT - Politics, Religion... the taboos

[Trek420]

bcipam writes and so we're

"I'm straight, like being straight, will be nothing other than straight."

All well and good! As for me I can't even ride my bike straight. I hope you don't think anyone who is gay wants to change any of that, we don't.

We think you're fabulous just the way you are.

"I realize that overly flamboyant, lisping gays do not represent that vast majority of the gay community."

Actually, you are wrong, yes they do represent me and I'm proud of them.

Just how flamboyant do we get to be?

How much is too much?

You might see me, work or ride with me and never know I'm gay. I look like any other 50 year old gal out there...except with waaaaaay better legs, thanks TE gals.

But what rights I have were won by folks who could not "pass" as straight, frankly by butch D*kes and Nelly men. They had nothing to loose, they couldn't hide or pass for straight they fought back. I love them.

"I do have a belief system. It is that marriage is a Christian ideal. Marriage is a commitment between a man and a woman under the moral and idealogy that is taught by my Christian faith."

Good, I'm glad to hear that you do have a spiritual path, me too. From what I've read of Christianity I appreciate the teachings.

Taking a deep breath, counting to 10, thinking happy thoughts about this board. OK. I'm Jewish, they call it Judeo/Christian for a reason. I'm hearing you say that marriage is a Christian ideal? I'm glad you feel that way, that it's an ideal but ya didn't invent it ;-)

Uh, I'm not observant or anything I even eat shrimp (see thread above) and I'm not going to debate scripture with you because I'll loose. Our calendar starts 3,760 years and three months *before* Christ was born. Christ was a Jew, the last supper was a Passover meal, we go back a bit.

I've always felt that for one to call oneself a Christian you should understand a bit about our Jewish faith just like for one to know where you are going you gotta know where you've been. But then that's just me.

Marriage is practiced in other religions, Hindu, Buddhist, Shinto, Muslim all have the ideal of commitment to another it's not just a Christian thang. I think it's a value we all share worldwide, a human thing.

And yes there are millions of Gay Christians and those of us who practice other religions too. I'm getting the feeling that some think it's mutualy exclusive like if you're Gay you can't be religious.

"Does this mean that only a man and a woman could make a commitment to each other? Of course not. I truly believe most states should allow civil commitment ceremonies for gays and straights (obviously there are straight people who do not want to be married in a Church)."

Yes, my parents were married in City Hall, happily married for 62 years. My Dad died last year.

Ask a million gay people and you'll get a million different answers. I'm just speaking for me, it's not the commitment ceremony, I can do that without any states permission. It's not the toasters and blenders you get, I can do that too although a blender would be nice. I got enough toasters recruiting straight gals (I am soooooooooooooooo kidding, really. Just could not resist the jab) but please continue to send the fondue sets ;-)

You can call it marriage, civil union, call it PBJ on toast, whatever you want I don't care what you call it. I do care about the thousands of rights priveleges and yes, responsibilities that come with it.

Should I be so lucky to find the gal o' my dreams to ride off into the sunset with were talking about the right to make medical decisions, I know people kept out of hospital rooms while their partners lay mortally ill, who lost their homes because they were considered "legal strangers", protecting the custody of kids and so on.

"I'm divorced. That means I cannot morally engage in sex unless I am in committed relationship with a man. The same applies to the gay community. What I think has upset many Christians is the casualness that some gays (and I realize many gays are in monogamous, long term relationships there is nothing wrogn with that) engage in sex."

I'm sorry to hear about the divorce although I know sometimes it's for the best.

Our conundrum in my community it seems to be the argument is made that we shouldn't marry is that we are considered promiscuous, but folks don't allow us to be "civilised" so you see round and round that goes.

Well, give us the right to marry or whatever you want us to call it and let's see what happens. Bet you'd be pleasantly surprised. Don't know the figures on average but my long term relationships have lasted longer than any of my brother's 3 marriages.

"Not trying to preach here. Just stating my opinion."

Me neither, me too. Didn't take it as preaching at all, thankful for the space to share oppinions and beliefs and to hear yours. Not meaning to make this forum or even this thread a debate about Gay rights, just one gals oppinions and there are lots more important things to do like protect kids and....just get out and ride.

"I appreciate the candor and opportunity to discuss some serious topics, away from cycling (yes there are other things in life than bikes)."

there are things other than bikes?