bike fit--art vs. science (long)

[Veronica]

You said KY what I couldn't quite articulate yet this morning. I was thinking, "Why didn't he have her get on her bike to see how it felt?"

My bike fit guy sent me out for a ride after watching me on the trainer.

Cleat positioning was included in my bike fit and he did both sets of my shoes.

V.

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

Did you ever get the problem solved with shims that enable your fingers to reach well around the brake levers?
I had the same problem and it was MAJOR unpleasant (and unsafe feeling), but now I have shimmed levers and it's a dream to be able to actually wrap my fingers around the brakes instead of just pulling at them with the tips of my fingers and hoping they don't slip out of my grasp.

[divingbiker]

The dude you saw stopped before he got to the most important part!

Well, now you tell me! Maybe this is why: he had to install the Poco handlebars and the shop was busy when I picked up the bike, so the actual on-bike fitting just didn't happen. Or maybe he never does on-bike fittings, I don't know.

Did you ever get the problem solved with shims that enable your fingers to reach well around the brake levers? .

Not quite. Once the bar tape and gel were installed, and I put gloves on, the levers are still a bit too far away. I've already got shims in them, but the mechanic at the shop is going to rig up a little bit more of a shim next weekend (had to order some special glue or something.) As it is, it's workable, but I'll be a bit more comfortable with a little less distance to the levers. The new bars really help.

[mimitabby]

what a crazy story. who ever heard of a bike fit where you don't get observed riding the bike?
My bike fit included science, measuring and comfort. Yes, you don't know how it's supposed to feel, but if you're feeling pain, something's not right. and the cleats and the handlebars were part of the whole thing.

having said that, i'm not sure i'll ever have it just right, i wonder why they put the brake levers out there anyway! ps, I don't understand the shims.
where would you put them?

[Starfish]

ps, I don't understand the shims.
where would you put them?

http://www.bikemannetwork.com/biking...PSHRDSH/LD7803

(Slight hijack)

MimiT, if you go to the link (a picture of some Shimano hoods/levers), see right at the top of the hood where the metal meets the black part? When you pull the lever, a little space naturally opens. The shims go in that space to bring the lever closer to start with. The cables have to be adjusted to take up the slack.

I have a love/hate relationship with shims. Right now I have one set on, and they help, but they are not perfect...the reach is still a stretch. I used to have 2 sets of shims, and I could reach my brakes, but the braking was crummy.

I am dragging my feet on getting new bars, because I LOVE the curves in my current bars.

[tulip]

Ain't Jill great!? I've had two fittings with her on two of my bikes, and have been oh-so-comfy ever since.

I bet that computer didn't catch your discrepancy in leg length. Who knows what else it didn't catch.

I will drive all the way from Richmond to have Jill give me a fitting. She is well worth every cent. And she's not just intuition. She's science, too, but knows that the best fit is a combination of both.

[Triskeliongirl]

The way my fitter explained it when I went to get fitted for a custom crank set for my LLD, is that things like saddle height, fore/aft position, crank length, cleat positioning, are very scientific/measurement based, but reach is much more comfort based. Yes, the more aero your body is positioned the faster you can go in a wind tunnel, howerver, if your body can't hold that position comfortably it gets you no where. So, while my fitter set up all the scientific things for me (including designing a custom crank set with a dropped pedal that corrects a 3 cm LLD), he left the reach part up to me (of course a fitter can recommend a starting point, but you need to tweak it). He recommends riding with a fit stem to find the right balance between aerodynamics and comfort for your body.

[SouthernBelle]

what a crazy story. who ever heard of a bike fit where you don't get observed riding the bike?
My bike fit included science, measuring and comfort. Yes, you don't know how it's supposed to feel, but if you're feeling pain, something's not right. and the cleats and the handlebars were part of the whole thing.

having said that, i'm not sure i'll ever have it just right, i wonder why they put the brake levers out there anyway! ps, I don't understand the shims.
where would you put them?

Aw, Mimi, don't you remember the pic of my shimmed levers with the orange tape?

[mimitabby]

Aw, Mimi, don't you remember the pic of my shimmed levers with the orange tape?

no. i remember folks talking about it though.
Thanks for the explanation!!

[BleeckerSt_Girl]

having said that, i'm not sure i'll ever have it just right, i wonder why they put the brake levers out there anyway!

Because they design them for men's larger hands.

[HillSlugger]

Well, now you tell me! Maybe this is why: he had to install the Poco handlebars and the shop was busy when I picked up the bike, so the actual on-bike fitting just didn't happen. Or maybe he never does on-bike fittings, I don't know.

I had a fitting done at the same place and I, too, was never observed riding my own bike. Whatever he did with my cleat position and seat setback made a huge difference, but he struck out with the stem length and I ended up putting back the shorter one myself. Before I went I was never comfortable on my hoods and did most of my riding on the drops. He did manage to fix that up for me with different bars and brifter placement.

[Kalidurga]

The dude you saw stopped before he got to the most important part!

Well, now you tell me! Maybe this is why: he had to install the Poco handlebars and the shop was busy when I picked up the bike, so the actual on-bike fitting just didn't happen. Or maybe he never does on-bike fittings, I don't know.

OK, I feel like I need to defend the Serotta dude. I'm the friend who had the fitting and recommended him. In my fit session, there was a lot of "How does that feel?" He took a lot of measurements while I was on the fit cycle, but he also spent time just standing back, watching me pedal, and asking me how it felt. Plus, I made a point of paying a lot of attention to the specific issues that I was concerned with, and kept asking him to make adjustments so that I could feel what sort of difference there might be. And when I picked up my bike after he had made alterations to it, he had me go out and ride it for a while, then come back and let him know how it felt. He very clearly told me that I might need to ride several times to get used to some of the changes, and to let him know if there was anything I just couldn't adjust to. And I got everything from him that GLC1968 got from her Serotta fitter. The result of my session was that I've had none of the neck and shoulder pain that I did before the Serotta fitting with this dude.

I think that a caveat has to be added to this conversation. Yes, there are a lot of elements that go into making someone a good fitter. There are also a lot of elements that can make one fitting process better than another. But I also think that rapport and communication with your fitter are very important. It's probably safe to say that no one fitter/fit process is going to be perfect for every cyclist, just like no one bike is perfect for every cyclist.

Janice, I'm glad you were able to get your issues worked out. I've heard a lot of great things about Jill, and it seems she was the perfect person for you to go to.

[HillSlugger]

I should correct/elaborate:

Yes, he did ask a lot of "how does this feel" questions while he kept an eye on the computer readout.

Overall what he did was a huge improvement, especially the new cleat positioning, but it did need some tweaking. As far as I'm concerned a good bike fitting is a combination of science and art.

[7rider]

As far as I'm concerned a good bike fitting is a combination of science and art.

Here, here.