Need some more thoughts thanks

[VeloVT]

my predictions

McCain takes the Repub nomination. He's already got it wrapped up.

Obama wins the popular vote in the dem primary. I am crossing my fingers that superdelegates do not overturn this if it happens. If they do they will alienate a whole bunch of people who vote dem because of one or two issues but don't have strong party ID. And this would be BAD (in my opinion, hope that's not saying too much here). Personally I am not a huge fan of the institution of superdelegates, I think it's really undemocratic.

If Obama-McCain, I predict an Obama win.

If Clintion-McCain, a likely McCain win. Not that I'm in love with Hillary, but I think a lot of the negative sentiment towards her stems from vague, irrational, unexamined "feelings" people developed while Bill was in the WH. The press was brutal to her when she was first lady (her makeup and hair were mocked, one minute she was too feminist and the next too "little woman-y", etc), and the republicans in Congress did a great job convincing the American people, who by and large don't have a very clear understanding of how Congress actually works (and how the party in power controls committees and procedure & thus the entire legislative agenda), that Hillary was meddling in a way that bordered on illegal. I think it's a sad fact of American life that most people don't think about the news in more than a peripheral way, and so that spinning was fairly effective, in the same way that negative campaigning is often effective. I think she's gotten a bit of an unfair shake. (BTW I'm sure everyone here DOES read & think about the news so please don't take offense at that comment. I think the fact that turnout in national elections is so low (even when it is **relatively** high) shows how tuned-out much of America is to politics).

Anyhoo...

personally, I have never been undecided this long. I would love to be able to vote for a dream candidate, but practically speaking in this election I want a democrat, and I will vote for the democrat who appears to be most likely to win the general election. (I really liked Chris Dodd. Too bad nobody knew he was running for president).

And don't get me started on that... because I really have issues with the primary system in general and also the way the press tends to distort the process. We get this artificial "momentum" that affects voters in a non-rational way. And the current primary calendar gives some states far too much influence. Why should Iowa be so much more important, over and above population size differences, than Vermont, for instance? I think we should have a national primary day the same way we have a national general election day. I hope that doesn't make me sound too much like a crackpot .

[mimitabby]

Liza, well said, I agree with you on all points.

[divingbiker]

In my hometown in Nebraska, they held a Democratic caucus for the first time. Nebraska always votes overwhelmingly Republican. But in this very small county, 150 people showed up at the caucus, some of whom were lifelong Republicans who had switched parties because they were so excited about Obama this year.

Something special's going on here.

[Skierchickie]

Well, I have no party affiliation, and I refuse to declare a party. However, I was seriously depressed for about 2 weeks after the last election, if that tells you anything. I'm kind of to the point where I feel like my vote just does not count. My parents are fairly conservative, and generally sway toward the Republican side, and even they were absolutely shocked when you-know-who won again (or, as I remember it, was allowed to steal it again). Of course, they were so sure he couldn't win, Dad basically threw his vote away on someone who could not possibly win, even if he had very good ideas, and Mom didn't vote for President.

Living in Michigan, I decided not to vote in the primary this time, for the following reasons:
1) I hadn't made up my mind (would anyone just address the issues, and stop talking in circles?)
2) I refuse to declare a party, and this time they were making you declare in order to vote, and then sending names to the national committees
3) I would have been voting for a Democrat this time, and because the state decided they wanted more influence than anybody else and moved the primary earlier, the DNC is punishing the state party by not seating their delegates. All because the powers that be are basically greedy. There. Robbed of my vote. Now they claim they are "negotiating" to seat the delegates, so I feel doubly robbed (yes, it was my own decision, but they can't impose these sanctions one day and just erase it all the next).

Anyway, rest assured that this midwesterner will definitely be voting anti-war (no offense to military families - it certainly isn't the fault of the troops, just the people making the decisions. I want them all to be safe.), anti-stomp-around-the-world-throwing-our-weight-around. Pro-environment. Etc. I've been very unhappy for 8 years. I don't know if any of them will actually do a good job, or if they'll ever stop bickering and actually work, but at least we have a chance now. Not sure any of it will help in Iraq now, though. We have to try.

[shootingstar]

Let's turn the table on you, crazycanuck:

What's Aussie politics like in past few years? My partner said that Aussieland and Kiwiland (NZ) relationship is....something like CAnada and U.S. ..a slightly wary neighbourly relationship. That was his observation when bike-touring for 5 months in Kiwiland a few years ago.

I guess Aussieland never has to contend with the underlying English-French bilingual issue...for any national Prime Minister that is elected in Canada. But then you were from Edmonton, Alberta and I don't sense Western Canada having same awareness as Ontario and of course, Quebec. My opinion now living here in Vancouver for past 5 years.

[shootingstar]

To give context to Canuck's comment on Obama comparison to , the former Canadian Prime Minister Pierre Elliot Trudeau....Trudeau was highly respected, no matter whether or not Canadians agreed with som eof his political decisions.

this was reflected..even long after he stepped down from PM position, there was still public interest and desire to know him for what he was doing with his life. When he died, the outpouring was respect was enormous and went on for days. I doubt very much other existing former national PM, when they die will receive the volume and breadth of recognition of that Trudeau received and ongoing coverage in history texts.

Here: http://archives.cbc.ca/IDD-1-74-73/people/trudeaumania/

http://www.thecanadianencyclopedia.c...=A1ARTA0008141

Canuck, no. 1 Trudeau was single when he assumed Office in 1968. No wonder why the women went crazy.

Trudeau came from a wealthy French-Canadian family. Of all our Canadian Prime Ministers in past 4 decades, the greatest respect for him in my opinion his strongest points:

a) his incredible intelligence. Sometimes hard, cold and analytical (turned off his wife who later divorced him But she was abit of a flighty person). Our current PM is just a patsy bimbo. You need a PM like that to handle serious matters of Canada's constitution and Charter of Rights.

b) his international statesman diplomacy on the world stage and a), which won the respect of other world leaders.

c) his athleticism was amazing. Geez, the guy was doing backflip jumps on trampoline in his 50's! ANd backflip diving in his 60's and up. Loved canoeing...so Canadian that image..into his 70's.

Oh yea, remember Trudeau wasn't afraid to be good friends with Fidel Castro. He didn't care what others thought. (Not much different than former prez. Jimmy Carter good friends with Castro)
It was Canada that opened up diplomatic relations of mainland China to Western nations...after a 30 yr. freeze out from mainland China. It was not Nixon. Trudeau made the lst formal overture to China. In his youth, Trudeau was hiking around in mainland China shortly after university ....could you even imagine Bush doing that on his own????? Bush would be too paranoid and stuck on his ranch.


I really think Obama is quite different in what he represents vs. Trudeau. Trudeau was so obviously gifted in oratory in English and French. He did anger alot of Quebecers, but he was seriously committed to federalism and united Canada. His most long-lasting political legacy is the repatriation of Canada's constitution and introduction of Charter of Rights.

I wish our next PM will have the stature of Trudeau...

[OakLeaf]

You might be interested in this from one of my local papers.

[Eden]

What the heck - I'll out myself. My first choice would have been Kucinich, even though I knew he didn't have any chance, but he dropped out before he even made it to our state.

I grew up in a primary state. I figured I'd just go and vote at the primary here - then too late I learned that the dems are not going to use any of the primary results so it doesn't even matter. Really, I'm registered as an independent, but we can still pick a primary and vote in one, just as long as we don't vote in the other. hmmmm maybe I still have time to go mess with the Republicans...

[OakLeaf]

What the heck - I'll out myself. My first choice would have been Kucinich

I'm glad I'm not the only one. I actually worked for his campaign in '04. The point being not that he had a hope of getting nominated, but because the convention sets the party platforms as well. We were trying to get a few delegates elected so that human rights would have a tiny voice at the convention.

Six (I think) anti-war delegates out of however many thousand it was. Then the party leadership threw all of them off the convention floor. That was the end of my last bit of tolerance for the major parties. Not allowing Dennis to debate this year was just bitter icing on the cake.

[mimitabby]

You might be interested in this from one of my local papers.

interesting article Oakleaf;

Gals what a wonderful CIVIL conversation! I am SO impressed!!!!

[crazycanuck]

Just wanna say thanks to those who responded to my PM's. I will get back to you with my reply(ies) when i have a bit more time.

Thanks

[bmccasland]

interesting article Oakleaf;

Gals what a wonderful CIVIL conversation! I am SO impressed!!!!

Yeah, we can talk politely about politics, but which BICYCLE is best, now them's fighting words!