What would you like to know?

[Eden]

Vivian! Thank you so much for your passionate response.

BTW, 54 is not old. On our very first race team, one of the racers (who had never raced before) was 52 years old. She is still racing 6 years later.

In our organization, I've found the demographic pretty representative of the women's demographic in the bike industry in general. There's a pretty distinct bell curve, with the critical mass falling in the 35-50 range with a smattering above and below. I think our youngest member this year is 10 and our oldest is 73.

This is exactly what we've experienced here too - we have a lot of women who come to racing relatively late in life and are successful at it. I started at the age of 34. One of the other people who started the same year I did is in her early 50's and is incredible. Most of our riders above cat 4 also qualify to ride masters (and in fact many of the top riders in the area too). We have some younger people but I think the 35+ crowd out numbers them. Our two youngest members I think are 17 this year. (there are already several excellent organizations for juniors in the area so I think we might hesitate to take on very young children)

[Geonz]

Hmmm.... a gathering, somewhere accessible to Portland and Vancouver....

[Eden]

Hmmm.... a gathering, somewhere accessible to Portland and Vancouver....

Sounds like Seattle to me

Shooting Star has a great point - how do you get teenage girls involved. Our junior women fields around here are pretty bad... same two or three girls in every race, though the junior boys have pretty good turn out.
When I was a teenager I don't think I knew anyone who rode like me.... (boys or girls for that matter) The people I went to high school with thought I was crazy and mostly just asked "what's the matter with your hands..." because of my glove tan lines.

It's interesting. I've never been one to be much bothered by co-ed events. Most of my friends have always been guys, so it just doesn't even come into my head to be concerned about it, though I did end up on a women only team. Cascade runs some great programs around here for non racers, but as far as I know they don't do anything that is not co-ed. There are however a great many women who are working in the club. I went and did some volunteering at one of their bike fixing parties recently (they have a fleet of bikes for teaching kids to ride) and the women out numbered the men in the room by at least 2 to 1.

[shootingstar]

Well maybe Seattle or further inland abit as a convergence point..

I looked over my data and realized I hadn't updated my thinking.. it's returning to cycling at 32 yrs. and cycling for nearly past 17 yrs.

For all my years of cycling so far in 2 major Canadian cities where I've lived (toronto & Vancouver), only about 2% of my mileage, has been cycling with groups of 3-15+ cyclists. Otherwise, around 60% of my mileage I cycle with my partner and rest of the time, I simply do it solo...for hrs. Some years I was cycling solo 100% when my partner was living for 2 yrs. in another city.

It would have been great to cycle occasionally with another woman who lived within cyclable distance to meet up and ride together. I am not sure I would have always wanted to be locked in to a meet time for a regular group ride...for certain not right now, my personal schedule is very limited.

Knowing a network of women cyclists locally would be helpful. Right now, what does keep me on bike, even though it does feel solitary at times, is to remain healthy,, save money and...because we don't have a car.

When we had our info. table at an annual bike trade show that drew 10,000 people, it was abit strange where some women just treated us /our group like lepers when we tried to provide them merely info. These women were with their male friends/spouses.

Honest, some women have insecurity issues that they don't want to associate at all with an all-female cycling group.

To reach teenage girls, the focus should not be on competition nor racing for the majority of girls at that stage. Instead more focus on cycling competency, endurance and confidence to take on long routes, busy traffic ...while also having fun. When there is clear evidence that many teenage girls (to me) look heavier than teenage girls were 30 years ago, cycling certainly can become sellable option as healthy fun thing to do ...if the girl doesn't feel safe or too exposed to be jogging solo. At that age, I would tend to build in some social time for teenage girls during a ride/workshop(s).

I was an awkward, brainy nerd in high school and for certain, suggestions of racing/competition would have intimidated me from cycling. thank god at that time, I was still cycling in cemeteries where I felt safe from roaring traffic But then I was wierd and abit of a loner who did my own thing.

[mtbdarby]

Hi Lorri,
Great topic and here's my take on it.

I live "up nort". We have smaller towns that are 30-60 miles apart. There is a cycling group in the larger town but I've struggled with them. Wanna know why? In central WI people are very cliquey. It's HARD to "break into" an existing group. I was the first new member they'd had in many years. So here are some questions I would ask myself:

-how do I hit a female "target" market given the geographical challanges?

- there's only 2 bike shops around and they don't seem to take me seriously as a biker but it does depend on the day. How do you get their support for a program?

- what kind of training programs or rides would be effective for women starting to bike so they aren't intimidated and will stick with it through the seasons?

- knowing you would get a diverse group of abilities how do you do rides together while pushing those that want it and providing social interaction for all? (I highly doubt you would get a lot of people to join at first).

- what types of city/town committees, organizations, etc. would you approach for any help funding, advertising, support etc.?

- how do you start raising funds just to get started?

I have the passion but tend to get bogged down in details like this. If you could put a "How to get a womens cycling group together manual" and make it available to the masses I think it would be a great tool for those of us who don't have the time for the learning curve of getting it going. Of course, that could just be me

[Eden]

To reach teenage girls, the focus should not be on competition nor racing for the majority of girls at that stage. Instead more focus on cycling competency, endurance and confidence to take on long routes, busy traffic ...while also having fun. When there is clear evidence that many teenage girls (to me) look heavier than teenage girls were 30 years ago, cycling certainly can become sellable option as healthy fun thing to do ...if the girl doesn't feel safe or too exposed to be jogging solo. At that age, I would tend to build in some social time for teenage girls during a ride/workshop(s).

I was an awkward, brainy nerd in high school and for certain, suggestions of racing/competition would have intimidated me from cycling. thank god at that time, I was still cycling in cemeteries where I felt safe from roaring traffic But then I was wierd and abit of a loner who did my own thing.

I don't necessarily agree with this. While not every girl wants to be on a competitive sporting team I think that girls should absolutely be encouraged to get involved in competitive cycling. I would never have dreamed of trying to join the basketball team or the volleyball team when I was in high school. I definitely was about as opposite as possible from being a high school jock, I was a pretty poor swimmer and too small to be useful at any ball sports, but I was an avid cyclist and I probably would have jumped at the chance to join a cycling team. Unlike ball sports its something that is easy to continue into adult hood, competitively or not.

I was a pretty akward brainy nerd too - but I felt very much at home out on the road and used to do 70 mile solo rides when I was 14 (which probably only served to mark me more out....). I can respect that competition isn't for everyone, but I also think that it's not a reason to not encourage girls to do it. There are track and cross country teams and that doesn't discourage girls from jogging for fitness.

[shootingstar]

Another topic for female cyclists providing leadership locally to other women and girls... to help them understand when group cycling is beneficial vs. solo vs. competitive cycling/racing.

is how to look at sports and what a person's personality is like. Cycling can be a "social" oriented sport riding in groups to push one's competence further and for the social aspect. Or it can be pursued in a more solitary manner...for folks (like me) who are tend to be loners, independent and carve their own road.

Nowadays I advise people to choose a sport that they love to do..often enough...for many years to come. Doesn't matter if it's golf, running, bowling, etc. Also some people just don't realize that perhaps why they don't enjoy group/team sports...it may not fit their personality profile. Or they need group /team sport/exercise activity to stay motivated/be pushed to excel.

Keep in mind some girls might want sport to be a great workout with some fitness pushing to the limits, but non-competitive because already in other parts of their life they ARE competing (ie. academically) or they are competing on the job to stay on top of their profession.

[Starfish]

What would I like to know?

How to start a recreational cycling program for at-risk adolescent girls that would form the base for a life in cycling, regardless of whether that base led to competition, recreation, or commuting. Question areas I would have would include:

-Liability & parental consent issues
-Finding bike donations and mechanical support
-Finding volunteers to lead, teach, train
-Fund raising
-Involving moms for mother/daughter lifestyle changes together
-Mentoring issues to help girls compete if that was their wish
-Partnering with schools, YMCAs, or other existing programs
-Adding additional prevention components
-And probably lots more questions I haven't thought of!

[smilingcat]

The biggest problem I see in my area where there are literally hundreds of clubs for all walks of life and trying to get the word out to average Jane Doe. The women who might be casually interested in riding never try to find out on what is available to them.

We have clubs whose main interests are touring only, racing only, mtn biking, commuter oriented, socializing & riding, casual riding for fitness. But even for someone like me who is seasoned has a hard time finding all the clubs and groups around. You occasionally run across a free local cycling paper with a listing of "all" the clubs and groups. So how do you get the word out?? If you pick a LBS to meet, you won't be able to put a flyer in other LBS.

Then there is starfish's concern of if you wanted to start your own group biggest obstacle I see is liability. I don't want to lose my house just because someone had an accident.

and the other problem is how do you sustain the group once it started as pointed out by shootingstar. There are times when you just really feel burnt out with leading a ride. It's a lot of commitment so to spin this around a bit. How do you keep from burning yourself out as a ride leader or organizer? There are days when I JUST DON'T WANT TO GO OUT!! OR I JUST WANT TO TRAIN ON MY OWN

After ride/workshop social is a must. You don't have to supply with soft drinks snacks. The successful and ongoing rides usually finish at a bikeshop near a donut place or finish at a coffee house or a deli. Occasional party at one of the riders house also helps.

One thing that has irked me over the years is that there are always small group of people both men and women who tend to develop a clique and basically alienate new members. so how do you keep exisiting members from alienating potential new members

I guess I'm just reiterating what others have said.

These days, I prefer to ride alone because most groups never do what they claim.

They hog the road, rotating pace line is never smooth, squirrly riders allowed in pace line, hand signal or not to hand signal.

Biggest two peeves of mine is blowing through red traffic lights/stop signs and dropping people on no drop ride. I used to be the one who went back and picked up the straggler and encouraged them and humored them to continue with the ride. I ended up being the mechanic often times for the stragglers with impromptu "how to fix a flat clinic" out on the road.

Occasionally, I rode back to the starting point with a rider who either blew up or bonked. It's not easy to keep them motivated sometimes. How do you convince a newbie to a group that they are not inconveniencing an experienced rider in situation like this? I don't want them to become alienated just because they couldn't keep up on one of the outings.

I guess my thoughts are on how to get new members to join in on ongoing basis.

Smilingcat

[shootingstar]

Good points to mull over, smileycat. It does help to have a small core group..at least 2-4 other women who share in leadership /organization of "stuff". But even the little core group of leaders get burnt out too.

Another thing is:

Understanding leadership (if you want to be of the spearheaders of an organization) and your own personality style in cycling. It can set the tone for the organization and group dynamics. It's quite different to be just a competitive racer vs. a leader for an organization to have a viable membership that doesn't stagnate.

How to see and understand the relationship of your cycling group to other local cycling related organizations. It helps that the group leaders aren't just solely racers/competitors, from a marketing perspective and building bigger membership.

In our core group we had a transportation policy analyst who was a tourer, a woman who toured and ran her own cycling/walking touring business, etc. Some of us had cross memberships with cycling advocacy organizations. Cross-organizational linkages are great for getting the word out about our group because people will send referrals to us. I remember the lst year when we folded our organization and I was at a bike trade show...painful to hear someone unable to give referral to a women's organization when the women were looking for support.... they came from out of town to the show....and I was standing nearby..

Seems like so far for most co-ed large cycling events, rides..etc. that I've participated, is usually is less women in the group.

Still lots to drum up participation. It's difficult to build racing numbers among women..when the foundation needs to be laid first.

[velogirl]

wow! I somehow missed a bunch of these replies (busy breaking up with my boyfriend last weekend). Alas.....

Here's where I'm going with this. Any thoughts?

Creating a Meaningful Women’s Cycling Program

Why Velo Girls – How it all Began

Why Programs Specifically for Women – Gender Differences in Cycling
• Desire for Community
• Need for Education
• How we Approach Competition
• Why we Begin Riding

Various Business Models
• Women’s Program within an Existing Co-ed Cycling Club
• Women’s Cycling Club
• Programs for Women within an Existing Coaching Organization
• Coaching Organization focused on Women
• Regional Organization
• Women’s Cycling Group within a Multi-Sport Club
• Women’s Event/Program within a Sponsor Organization (ie bike shop, health club, fitness center, corporation, local race association).

Developing Women Cyclists
• Why Women Start Riding
• How to Find Them
o

Partnering with bike shops
o Partnering with other Women’s organizations
o Partnering with other Cycling and Fitness Organizations

• How to Recruit Them
• How to Retain Them

Developing Women Racers
• Just What is Development Anyways?
• Competitive Athletes from other Disciplines
• Recreational Riders
• Demographic of “Typical” New Woman Racer

Retaining Women Racers:
• Life gets in the Way (Career, Motherhood, Partner’s Priorities)
• Keeping Women Engaged
• Overcoming Fears
• Providing Opportunities (ie working with Promoters)
• Dealing with Failure
• Managing Success

Does One Size Fit All?
• Juniors
• Masters
• Elites
• Recreational Riders
• Multi-Sport Athletes

Ideas for Success:
• Skills Education
• Health & Fitness Education
• Mentorship
• Community
• Sustainability
o L

eadership
o Group Dynamics
o Variety of Opportunities
o Measuring Success

Challenges of a Gender-Based Organization:
• Geography
• Working with Women
• Reaction of the Other Gender
• Competition with other Women’s Organizations

How to Overcome the Challenges to Being a Leader in a Man’s World

Concluding Thoughts

[snowtulip]

Wow Velogirl!! Lots of information to discuss, I wish I could be there to hear your presentation.

Good luck and I hope you get lots of additional feedback, this has been a great thread to read.

[velogirl]

I just want to express how much I appreciate all of you taking time to share your thoughts. I actually had a hard time wrapping my head around this topic and it was all of you who helped me focus in.

Thank you!

Lorri

[salsabike]

That outline looks great! Wish I could hear it too.

[tulip]

GLC made me think of another question.

If you have "something" for women in your area, what are your frustrations?

What would you do differently?

I guess that's two questions.

I haven't read all the comments yet, so I hope this isn't a repeat. I am a former racer, but I have very little interest in racing now. I like riding, touring, centuries, and organized rides.

When I lived in DC, there was a group of seemingly energetic and interesting women called Babes on Bikes. They are still around. Perhaps someone on this forum is a member. They had rides of varying levels and I would have loved to go riding with them. However, they were SAHM and the like, and only had organized rides during working hours on weekdays. That's great for them, but I (and I imagine alot of other interested women) could not participate because I worked during those hours. That was frustrating because I bet there is alot of energy and fun and good ride vibes in that group. They did not go on weekend rides (but there are other good cycling groups with weekend rides in the area--men and women mixed)

Ironically, now I work from home and could manage a ride or two a week during traditional working hours, but there's no such club here. Maybe I'll start one...I'll finish reading the posts now.