heart rate concerns

[Lynne]

Good points you made, but reminds of a few things I should have included in the post. I think I'm probably average weight, but a bit short. 5'3", about 130lbs. So, I'm really not lugging a lot up the hills. The BF mentioned that to me as well...so I should be much better on hills than flats and downhill, but it's been the reverse for me.

And I am eating. I never used to eat at all when I hiked, but now I make myself bring some powerbars. I eat before the ride (at least a latte and a scone or something like that) and have at least one powerbar while I ride. My rides are usually 2-3hrs (can be longer and are shorter during the week). I also drink gatoraide and am getting xtran to mix w/the gatoraide as that gives a good boost as well. I'm eating enough that it takes me a while after my ride to get hungry (but then I'm really hungry). I'm also finding that even drinking the gatoraide makes me feel a little nauseated...it's really hard to eat while doing physical activity!

Hmmm...and I did not think of the improvement in those terms. I was thinking more overall...that I need to get up to 9 or 10mph on the uphills (and comfortably). Maybe in a year, then.

Good to know your warmup is a bit longer...20 mins is still a lot shorter than 40, but I thought most people are closer to 5-10 mins.

So, is a higher heart rate a measure of cardio fitness? Or does that simply mean I'm pushing too hard in the warmup and doing damage? Do I need more muscle or more cardio to get up the hills? I'm confused and don't know what to work on. Plus, if I add weight training, how do you ever have a day when your muscles aren't torn? You do a ride one day (which tears the muscles) then you do weights the next day, and then a ride....you either don't get to ride as much, don't get to workout as much or you never heal.

[Veronica]

How do your legs feel when you're climbing?

V.

[neuroticcyclist]

I am 45 and need about 30 mins to feel warmed up. I make a point of taking it easy before tackling any hard part of the ride during that phase or else I feel my pulse going up too fast, triggering soreness, etc. However (and I have had a complete workout ith Vo2 max, etc.), if I do it right, I am very productive in terms of energy output, pulse never goes really high but I can do any climb I want to.

I think you need to figure out why you want your heart rate to go high. Many of us try to schedule Zone 1 and Zone 2 heart rate rides for long, base conditioning, trying to KEEP the heart rate in that zone. Then, other days, we do hill repeaters to get the heart rate up and have recovery intervals. Going for max or high rate all the time isn't the way my team's training program is put together.

I suggest you read Carmichael's The Ultimate Ride. He is Lance's coach and knows a lot about how to train (our program is based on those principles).

As for food - you need to learn to eat and ride or you will max out. Gatorade is sugar water and I cannot swallow it. Try something made for cycling like Indurox or Cytomax. Gel packs work too.

As for lifting, I do that in the winter. The rest of the training program is alternating, so you get the hard stuff in anyway. For example, yesterday was 25 miles of hard hill repeaters, so today was a fast 35 miles of "magic carpet". Tomorrow is a Zone 2 LONG training ride. (A little off the norm due to holiday weekend). So, the hard work that is similar to the lifting was done on the hills, finished off with the quick pace/spinning workout and tomorrow is a day of rest! But, variety gets it done.

[Lynne]

Veronica-my legs are very tired and I definitely frequently feel lactic acid buildup, even on days where I'm doing nothing other than a few stairs coming home (I assume lactic acid buildup is that feeling like you have no blood in your legs?). I've had a few days that ended with my legs shaking, although it's been a few weeks since that last happened.

Neuroticyclist-Ok, so when doing hills, slow way down on the flat or downhill to give your heart a chance to settle down? (I'd been doing hills once or twice per week, but I just started cycling to work, so I will have 10 miles each way (20 a day) with pretty good hills in there -I will be doing that every other day). What should it settle down to (what percentage of max heart rate)? And how many miles is a short hilly day? I've been doing about 30 miles w/hills and trying to do 40-55 on longer flatter days. And, on those flat days, what percentage of max heart rate do you try to keep yourself at?

After yesterday's ride, I did decide that I need to start riding mostly flat for about 20 mins before I take off on my ride (there is no other way to get where I need to go without hitting those hills which start the ride,short of driving somewhere which isn't feasible during the week). I think that might help; I can't help but think that getting my heart rate up to the max immediately into the ride isn't a good thing. And no, I really don't want my heart rate to go so high. It just tends to do that in a warmup. Even on days we've started on fairly flat terrain, I can feel my heart racing just getting warmed up (I didn't have a monitor, but it's not hard to tell your heart is racing). Based on the days I've worn the monitor, it seems my initial heart rate even on a flat will be in the 170's. I assume based on Veronica's comments that my max heart rate is probably not really 179 (well, it can't be if I hit 184 and that's far from the worst I've felt). If I assume it's closer to 185-186, then I'm starting out at at something like 92% of the max...is that detrimental to improvement?

Honestly, I'm not trying to get in shape for a competition or anything like that. I just really enjoy taking myself as hard and far as I can go. I know most ladies either train for some competition or just enjoy the rides-I'm kind of a combination of those two. I immensely enjoy pushing myself as hard as I can for as long as I can, but I don't want to hurt myself. That will just screw up future rides, you know?

[Dogmama]

It is possible that a high heart rate might be normal for you because of the size of your heart. Only a cardiologist can determine what is going on. Just for grins, why not schedule an appt with your doc?

As for lifting, I lift harder in the winter but I don't quit in the summer. I believe that lifting is an essential part of being healthy. I do more upper body work in the summer and work legs once or twice a week (and then I don't push heavy weights - I try to keep my reps at 12-15). If I ride the next day, I keep it moderate to easy. My leg work is primarily glutes & hams, I don't do direct quad work. So, I'll do deadlifts, squats, lunges and for the hammies, leg curls (seated is good because it approximates riding) and straight legged deadlifts. Oh, and calf work - standing and seated.

Hang in there.

[emily_in_nc]

Good points you made, but reminds of a few things I should have included in the post. I think I'm probably average weight, but a bit short. 5'3", about 130lbs. So, I'm really not lugging a lot up the hills. The BF mentioned that to me as well...so I should be much better on hills than flats and downhill, but it's been the reverse for me.
...
Good to know your warmup is a bit longer...20 mins is still a lot shorter than 40, but I thought most people are closer to 5-10 mins.
...
So, is a higher heart rate a measure of cardio fitness? Or does that simply mean I'm pushing too hard in the warmup and doing damage?

Hi Lynne ~ I can't answer all your questions but will attempt a couple. Firstly, I am 5'2", 105 lbs (probably 110 when wearing a helmet and cycling clothes), and hills are definitely my weakest point. I should be a great climber since I'm so light and often ride a carbon-fiber road bike, right? Wrong? I'm definitely a better climber than I used to be, but part of being petite is having a smaller lung capacity than the guys. Coupled with asthma (which I take meds for, but still...), I huff and puff way more than my companions on the climbs, and my heart rate goes up and up. At 44, I figure my max HR to be around 185 or so because I've hit as high as 182 on a killer climb, most climbs get me to 172-175 bpm.

A high heart rate is not a measure of cardio fitness. Usually just the opposite. My DH, who is fantastic shape, tends to average about 30 bpm lower than me on a ride. So if my average HR is 158 for a ride, his might be 128. He is a fantastic climber, and his HR rarely climbs above 150 on a climb, as he beats us all to the top! What I have read as a good measure of aerobic fitness is recovery heart rate: i.e., after you've hit a good, high HR on a climb, how quickly does your HR decrease by 30 bpm? If it happens within a minute, that's considered good - 30 seconds is even better. I notice that when I hit, say 170 bpm on a climb, my HR quickly goes to 140 bpm or even lower on the downside, so I consider that my aerobic fitness is pretty good, despite the high HR. Women also tend to have higher resting heart rates than men, no matter how fit they are. Smaller people (just like birds!) have higher HR than larger people.

I'm 44, and it takes me probably 30 minutes to get into my groove and really warmed up on a ride as well. We have hills from the very start of most rides I do, like you, and my HR also tends to soar early in the ride when I'm not warmed up yet. It moderates as I ride, but I am still able to get it up high later in the ride when I hit a good hill, so I can't address your question of why you can never reach your early-ride HR later in the ride. I can (unfortunately - because it doesn't feel good!) I can ride pretty long with a HR in the low 160s, where my husband will be cruising in the 130s, so I try to tell him that I am working a LOT harder than he is. Still, being larger and heavier, he burns more calories than me on every ride, even with his lower HR. Just isn't fair!

Anywho, I doubt there's anything wrong with you...the max. HR calculations are notorious for being wrong, so don't worry about that part of it. I do think we require longer warm-up times as we age, but you don't mention your age that I saw, so I am not sure if that applies to you or not.

Hope this helped at least a little!

Emily