cadence

[ginny]

hi - I'm really quite a newbe. I am a distance runner though, and I have this pace at which I can run (quite literally) all day. So, I was just reading about cadence. I think I probably have a pretty slow cadence on the bike (when I run, I have a pretty slow turn over, but a H U G E stride - can't help it, it's just my conformation). Anyway, this article I was reading said to aim for 88-92 rpm for a good cadence. Apart from a computer, how would I figure that out? Also, I have a bianchi eros donna with the cassette that came with the bike, are there recommendations for a different cassette for riding in the mountains (I ride mainly in the Rockys)? Thanks!

[NJBikeGal]

Count! Count the rotations of one leg in a minute and that is your cadence. Granted, there are a ton of other factors: wheel size, gear ratio, etc. But, this is a simple way to figure it out.

Everyone's cadence will differ. A men's pro racer may have a cadence between 90 and 110/120, a novice rider more like 70-80. What you want to focus on is not mashing your pedals. You shouldn't have to exert tremendous amounts of force to get the pedals to move...that's mashing (I used to do this A LOT!). Developing a higher rate of cadence takes some work, but you'll get it!

As far as a cassette...(I only speak Shimano, not Campy...and I don't know what you have on there now)...I would expect that you would want at least a 25, if not a 27 rear cassette for climbing mountains.

[Torrilin]

If you don't have musical training (yay for hours of tempo drill), a bike computer is probably the best tool for the job.

You can approximate cadence by counting the number of pedal strokes you make in a defined time period. This doesn't work so well if you've got poor short term memory tho. And your cadence will vary some over a ride, so you'd need many samples to get a good estimate.

[mixie]

Im a total newb too, but this has helped me some. My gym has stationary bikes with RPM counters. Im guessing thats the same as cadence? Anyway, I go to the gym to run but I'll hop on the stationary cycle to warm up for a few minutes and focus on keepin gthe RPM at or above 90. Then I try to "memorize" how that feels. Sorta like a rythym, and tell my legs "ok legs, this is it!" When aI get on my bike I have more of a feel for how my cadence is. Also, I dont know if you are clipless yet, but that really helped keeping the cadence up w/o slipping off the pedals. For me anyway.

[indysteel]

hi - I'm really quite a newbe. I am a distance runner though, and I have this pace at which I can run (quite literally) all day. So, I was just reading about cadence. I think I probably have a pretty slow cadence on the bike (when I run, I have a pretty slow turn over, but a H U G E stride - can't help it, it's just my conformation). Anyway, this article I was reading said to aim for 88-92 rpm for a good cadence. Apart from a computer, how would I figure that out? Also, I have a bianchi eros donna with the cassette that came with the bike, are there recommendations for a different cassette for riding in the mountains (I ride mainly in the Rockys)? Thanks!

Ginny, I generally agree with the 88-92 rpm as the "ideal" cadence, although I think that range is a bit narrow. I, myself, usually spin between 90-100. I would further state that a high cadence assumes flat terrain. When climbing, I would aim to pedal about 75% of your normal cadence. I, personally, liked having a computer that measured cadence when I first started, but I don't pay any attention to it now. You eventually develop a good feel for it. Keep in mind, in figuring out what works for you, that finding a good cadence is really about efficiency. Spin too fast and you blow your lungs; spin to slow and you blow out your knees. Spin just right and your lungs and legs equally share the burden, allowing you to go faster and longer.

As for your cassette, I would suggest that you may already have the gears you need for climbing since the bike comes with a triple crank. I would take it on some climbs to at least see before buying another cassette. Admittedly, I've never done a long, Rocky Mountain type climb before but the hills we have in Indiana are short and, often, very steep. The 12-25 cassette on my Eros Donna provides small enough gears to climb grades in the 20% range.

What year Eros Donna do you have? It appears from Bianchi's website that the 2007 model comes with a 13-26 10-speed cassette (I think last year's model was a 9-speed cassete, but I don't remember the spread since I changed my bike from a 9 to a 10-speed and got a new cassette in the process). In any event, a 13-26 cassette, along with the triple, will give you some pretty small gears that, IMO, will likely be more than enough for even the steepest of climbs. I think Campy makes a 12-27 rear cassette, but that might also require changes to your chain and rear derailleur. Your LBS should be able to determine that pretty easily.

[Look]

Great post indysteel! Truly helpful.

I still depend on my cadence monitor and find that I'm not always accurate at guessing my cadence. And I certainly don't attain 75% going uphill!
I'm heartened to know that it will improve because I certainly have been working on it !

[rij73]

You can buy a cheap metronome for music and carry it beeping away in your jersey pocket. Something like a Qwik Time QT-5. That's what I do. It's like having a coach! I am trying to develop a steady cadence. Working on 84 right now. I pedal slower on the climbs, but as it starts to level out, I get back in sync with the metronome. People must wonder why my bike makes a strange beeping sound!

[ginny]

Oooo good metronome idea... I already have one of those! Thanks for the replies everyone! I have the 2006 Bianchi... campy deraileur and stuff (three cranks in front dunno how many on the cassette on back). I should go look at the specs again... duh! Anyway, thanks! I 'll stick the metronome in my pocket next time I ride - I'm perfectly okay with ticking away on my ride

[ginny]

okay, I looked at the specs, here is the cassette info:
Cassette
Campagnolo, 13/26T 9spd

Translation? Am I good? I will say that climbing big hills was easier on my mtn bike, but I haven't had to walk up anything yet and I've been ambitious on the climbing thing so far...

[Starfish]

Oooo good metronome idea... I already have one of those! Thanks for the replies everyone! I have the 2006 Bianchi... campy deraileur and stuff (three cranks in front dunno how many on the cassette on back). I should go look at the specs again... duh! Anyway, thanks! I 'll stick the metronome in my pocket next time I ride - I'm perfectly okay with ticking away on my ride

I LOVE the metronome idea. I have a cadence feature on my cyclometer, but I love the idea of having the audio reference! I'm going to try that!

Depending on your weight, strength, etc, your triple up front and 26 in back should be fine. However, just for a different point of view, here's what I did:

I have a triple up front, and I had a 27 on the back. As a new rider, in a very hilly area, and overweight, I was seriously struggling with my rides, and it wasn't as much fun. My cyclist friends told me to just keep going, that whatever didn't kill me would make me stronger. Well, I did that for a couple years. Then I decided to heck with it, and got a mountain derailleur and a 32 cassette put on the back. Now I have a billion low gears and I just finished my first 10,000' century this weekend. Even Arnie Baker says why not go for a bunch of low gears if you are doing sustained climbing all the time. Sometimes I climb 20 miles at a time without any level ground, and my knee never hurts!

I hope and plan that by next year, I will have lost some weight and gained more strength...and I might put the old cassette back on. But, I know that having these granny gears have helped me get out for a lot longer, on a lot more difficult rides. And that, in turn, has motivated me to lose weight and train harder than I ever felt when I was struggling all the time with climbing.

[indysteel]

Great post indysteel! Truly helpful.

I still depend on my cadence monitor and find that I'm not always accurate at guessing my cadence. And I certainly don't attain 75% going uphill!
I'm heartened to know that it will improve because I certainly have been working on it !

Look, thanks.....

As for attaining 75% going uphill: I often hit hills too fast, picking too small a gear for them and then blowing up my lungs in the process. When I try to slow my cadence down a bit by picking a gear that allows me to pedal at 75%of my normal cadence (or about 67 rpm), I do better. Of course, on really steep climbs, I don't worry about my cadence. I'm too busy trying not to throw up/fall over. BTW, I read about the 75% thing in one of my cycling books. It was suggested as nothing more than a guide for balancing the load between legs and lungs. It's just a guide though; climbing technique boils down to personal preference and ability.

Ginny, if you end up needing a larger cassette, by all means get it. As I said in my post, we don't have the long climbs in Indiana that you Rocky Mountain people are blessed with, so I have no personal experience what the gearing one needs to climb 10 or 20 miles at a time. That anyone can climb that long in any gear impresses me!

BTW, if you end up deciding to get a cyclometer with a cadence feature, Sigma makes some that are fairly reasonably priced and work well. While I don't necessarily think you need one, they are helpful in many ways.

[rij73]

Glad you ladies like the metronome idea. It just popped into my head when I first read about cadence. I'm a pianist and piano teacher, so a metronome is something I use many times a day already. Seemed like the perfect thing!

[Look]

Look, thanks.....

As for attaining 75% going uphill: I often hit hills too fast, picking too small a gear for them and then blowing up my lungs in the process. When I try to slow my cadence down a bit by picking a gear that allows me to pedal at 75%of my normal cadence (or about 67 rpm), I do better. Of course, on really steep climbs, I don't worry about my cadence. I'm too busy trying not to throw up/fall over. BTW, I read about the 75% thing in one of my cycling books. It was suggested as nothing more than a guide for balancing the load between legs and lungs. It's just a guide though; climbing technique boils down to personal preference and ability.

Thanks again indy! It is sooo helpful to see someone else describe my experience. It is frustrating to be cruising along over 20 mph, hit a hill and go down to 15, ok, then 9, then 7 then barely 5 mph and really straining to pedal. I always get the idea that if I'd just attacked a little more aggressively at a little earlier point in a slightly lower gear I would have had a much easier or at least faster climb. No worries though, there's always another hill just ahead to practice on!

[indigoiis]

From the Guide to Women's Cycling book by Susan Weaver... she says cadence is basically saying "one potato two potato three potato..." where one potato = one circle. That's been working for me.

And on hills, I've been doing the thing where I count ten pedal strokes and then go into an easier gear.

I have hills all over my neighborhood and can't get away from them, so I am getting plenty of practice. I often don't have to switch at ten - I can sometimes wait til 15 or 20. I have not yet run out of gear.

[Torrilin]

Some of hill climbing is just *doing* it. If you have to walk your bike, that's ok. Just keep trying. If you're not used to hills, your lungs and heart don't work as effectively on hills as they do on the flat. Generally you can bail out and walk up a hill at any time... and even walking the bike will help you get better at hills.

This does not mean I'd let someone take away my granny gears mind . I do use them on hills, and I'm getting better at using them. It's a skill and it takes time to learn. And I won't learn if I don't practice.

I *do* attack hills aggressively early on. In one case, I have a small downhill right before a 5% grade. If I can use the downhill to get into a higher gear at my normal cadence, I have a wider range of low gears available for the big hill. Time the downshifts right so I'm maintaining a good cadence, and I go up further. It's taken me a fair bit of time to learn when to downshift to keep my cadence up so my legs don't hurt or turn to rubber on me.