Training for Time Trials

[equus123]

one thing that i find interesting about that idea of sitting more forward on the saddle for more power - if that's the case then why don't they move the saddle more forward? i really don't see the purpose in sitting on the nose of the saddle if you could just shift it forward so that you're in the same spot but sitting on the normal saddle position. anybody else wonder about that too? it seems pretty "der!" to me. lol

i think i have a very special private area because i can't sit on ANY other saddle than my Terry CrMo cutout otherwise i'm ready to scream within 5 minutes. even though this is the only comfy saddle for me, i can't even scoot forward or else that hurts like crazy. i don't know WHAT my deal is. so when i change my road bike into TT mode (i only have 1 bike), i just shove the saddle all the way forward and tilt down slightly.

[RoadRaven]

Hi there Equus... you're right... it is very logical to just move the seat forward.

However, the time-trial set-up is governed by strict UCI regs. So the boys in the Tour and indeed all other UCI sanctioned races MUST have the geometry "just so" or they will not be able to race.

So, you say, Raven rides in club races, she doesn't need to have her bike geometry "just so".

Well, my partner and sons ride in BikeNZ sanctioned races - which conform to UCI. Next year I will be entering some of these races too.

Therefore, even though most of our racing (every Saturday) is at club level, and of those races only about 10-15 per year (including Thursday evenings in Summer) are Time Trials, we set up our bikes according to UCI regs so that we can ride in whatever race we wish to without having to make adjustments to our bicycles.


Rules govern seat post angle/position of the nose of the seat... hence why male racers trying to get the most power possible sit "on the rivet" in time trials, and in power efforts during road/bunch race stages. They already have their seats as far forward as they can - but they want every millimetre they can make work for them.

I have not thought about this before when watching women race - and the few dvds I have of women's racing has not shown me women sitting "on the rivet". Surely there is a trick to it?

[smilingcat]

I'm not convinced that going that forward really helps with power.

Too much of good thing isn't good. little bit of aspirin is good too much will kill you. And I wonder about what effective seat tube angle, or rather the position of the seat in reference to the BB will give you the most amount of power.

On a hill climb, if my body is pushed back a bit, I can get more power into the pedals at the top and at the bottom then if I were sitting in the regular spot. But for TT, I think I prefer to sit bit forward cause it feels like I can sustain the power output with high cadence. I guess only way to know is use a power tap and measure on a hill, flat, & TT rides.

My newest seat, jett130, has a nose that is curved downward so trying to "ride on the rivet" is less worrisome. Its like the seat is tilted down on the nose even though the seat is more or less level (slightly pointing down for me.) Mind you I don't exactly ride right on the nose even when I'm forward.

smilingcat

[equus123]

Hi there Equus... you're right... it is very logical to just move the seat forward.

However, the time-trial set-up is governed by strict UCI regs. So the boys in the Tour and indeed all other UCI sanctioned races MUST have the geometry "just so" or they will not be able to race.

So, you say, Raven rides in club races, she doesn't need to have her bike geometry "just so".

Well, my partner and sons ride in BikeNZ sanctioned races - which conform to UCI. Next year I will be entering some of these races too.

Therefore, even though most of our racing (every Saturday) is at club level, and of those races only about 10-15 per year (including Thursday evenings in Summer) are Time Trials, we set up our bikes according to UCI regs so that we can ride in whatever race we wish to without having to make adjustments to our bicycles.


Rules govern seat post angle/position of the nose of the seat... hence why male racers trying to get the most power possible sit "on the rivet" in time trials, and in power efforts during road/bunch race stages. They already have their seats as far forward as they can - but they want every millimetre they can make work for them.

I have not thought about this before when watching women race - and the few dvds I have of women's racing has not shown me women sitting "on the rivet". Surely there is a trick to it?

excellent explaination. thank you

[equus123]

while on the topic of the phrase "on the rivet" - i learned where it's derived from yesterday while watching the Tour. for those who were curious as well...

"on the rivet" = back in the day when riders had leather saddles, they were anchored using rivets around the edges. some of these were placed on the nose so when riders slid forward on the saddle they were actually sitting on the rivets. hence the phrase was coined for whenever a rider is sitting forward like that. nifty!

[RoadRaven]

Yup... on the rivet... it was a good explaination in yesterdays (or is that the day before's - confusing myself with time differences...) coverage.

I think being on the rivet is something that happens when the heat goes on in a race - like when the peloton lifts the pace, or near the end of a TT.

Gonna experiment a bit this weekend - haven't been able to get on the road this week due to weather/early sun sets.

I'd like to see if it gives me more power - remembering that, historically, much cycling technique is based on how it is for men...

[RoadRaven]

Here... Cancellara's saddle from the prologue...

He has done away with the rivet altogether!


SOURCE:
http://www.cyclingnews.com/road/2007...chopped_saddle

[Eden]

I finally have a bit of what I consider to be a comparison between using and not using my disc/deep wheels on the TT bike.
So this weekend was the TT championship, its really the only long one around (unless you do triathalon) at 40K - most of the stand alone TT's around here are around 10 to 12K.
My hubby and I went out and pre rode the course the day before, since it was supposed to rain hard (ended up dry!) and we didn't want any suprises. The pre-ride I used my TT bike, but had my training wheels on it (Velocity Deep V's). Now we didn't do the whole ride at TT pace, but we did a few fast sections.
What I found was that I really noticed the disc when there was a cross wind. I've always heard that its actually an asset in a crosswind - unless of course its a really strong crosswind and blows you over...., since it acts like a sail - much like when a sailboat uses a crosswind to tack and go faster - and I really do think I could feel the extra boost. Doesn't do much for you in a direct headwind, but the course was really twisty so there were few sections going directly into the wind.
So I definitely think the disc works well, though it's not the lightest wheel available, for relatively flat courses its more of an asset than a hinderence. I wouldn't use it for anything hilly - mainly because of the weight, but also because its older and an 8 speed, fine on my TT bike on the flats and small rollers, but I would want something bigger than a 21 for real climbing