Distance Climbing Help

[GLC1968]

Yep, what MP said!

I can also give you a more moderate picture of what we were doing prior to my work/illness issue.

An example of one 'cycle':
wk 1: 65 miles, 4500 ft climbing
wk 2: 55 miles, 5500 ft climbing - this was tougher than it looks because those climbs were much steeper than our normal terrain in order to get to 5500 ft in only 55 miles
wk 3: 85 miles rolling terrain (probably 2500 feet overall)
wk 4: 75 miles, 6000 climbing

After doing this just once, I noticed that wk 4 was MUCH easier for me than week 1 was, on the same general terrain. There could have been other conditions that made it seem easier, but I do recall that many of the climbs we had done in wk 1 that were repeated in wk 4 (we did both rides in the same county) were 'flatter' to us. I also know that after completing some of the climbs of wk 2, everything seemed easier in comparison (though that was definitely a mental benefit).

Week 5 was to be another shorter, steeper route, but that's when I got slammed with work....

Oh, and two other benefits to training like this are 1) that you can get to total fatigue in a shorter distance on some of those weeks like wk 2, so they are a bit easier to fit into the rest of life's schedule. And 2) if you have to travel to get to the bigger hills/climbs, you don't have to do that travel every weekend.

[Starfish]

These examples, and the advice with them, are really helpful. It is great for me to see some jumps in mileage from 65-85, for instance. I understand that the climbing alters the distances, but even so, it is good for me to see the large jumps in mileage.

I have tended in the past to be so afraid of burning myself out (it has happened!), that I adhere to the no-more-than-10%-per-week rule of progression. That can get tedious and uninspiring.

I am liking the alternating longer, flatter weeks with the shorter, steeper weeks.

GLC, thanks much for weighing in ...I'm sorry for your work overload!

[Starfish]

An example of one 'cycle':
wk 1: 65 miles, 4500 ft climbing
wk 2: 55 miles, 5500 ft climbing - this was tougher than it looks because those climbs were much steeper than our normal terrain in order to get to 5500 ft in only 55 miles
wk 3: 85 miles rolling terrain (probably 2500 feet overall)
wk 4: 75 miles, 6000 climbing

Ummmm...so which week is the regeneration week? Week #4 doesn't exactly look like an easy week, compared to weeks 1-3?

[GLC1968]

Ummmm...so which week is the regeneration week? Week #4 doesn't exactly look like an easy week, compared to weeks 1-3?

The idea is that week 2 and week 3 work your muscles in different ways, so essentially, week 2 is 'resting' from distance and week 3 is 'resting' from climbing. Then, when you put them together, you are stronger.

This is also assuming that you are taking some off-bike rest days during the week. After the crazy climbing weekend, I did an easy spin day (literally, easy...15 miles tops) and then took 2 full days of rest. Had we been closer to the target date, I might have only taken one rest day, but two felt like the right thing to do at the time.

Another point of note, if you are stressing your muscles more than normal, you want to make sure that your diet contains plenty of lean protien and plenty of fruits and veggies so that it has all the fuel it needs to build and recover. Good quality sleep is also essential.

Oh, and the 65 to 85 mile jump is only because we were already doing rides of that length and our goal was to be able to go that distance AND climb. If your longest ride ever is more like 45 miles (as an example), I wouldn't make regular 20 mile distance jumps. Even if your muscles can handle it, it's probably not so great for tendons, ligaments, connective tissue, etc. This is even more true for those of us whose bodies aren't 20 anymore!

[maillotpois]

I'd actually add in a week here and there of both shorter distance and climbing. True periodization. But it's what works for you that's important. (And I have to say that I have not been that good about the shorter weekend rides myself because of the events I've been doing, and I do tend more to take the rest time for the off weeks during the weekdays instead. But I do make sure to put in a week here and there in the calendar for the people I'm training for DR.)

[Starfish]

This all makes a lot of sense, and I really appreciate your input and discussion. Saturday is an organized ride, and it fits in well with the alternating long vs. climb weekend. It will be 70 miles with about 3000 feet, whereas last weekend was 40 miles with 5100 feet.

And, I am really tired today...I think next week is going to be a true regeneration week.

[Starfish]

Well, on Saturday I did an organized ride of 69 miles with 3445 feet. This included about 4-5 short climbs of higher grades that sent my HR into the red.

This ride turned out to be harder for me than I had hoped. It was definitely harder than last week's long ride, which was 40 miles with 5100 feet of steady mountain climbing. I seem to be weaker on the longer distances with relatively less climbing, but with higher % spikes in climbing.

I notice that as my weekend rides have gotten harder (and I have added a hard spinning class on Tuesdays), I am doing fewer aerobic workouts during the week, and more recovery.

I wonder if my aerobic endurance is eroding, or wasn't that great to begin with? I am considering doing a 10 day endurance overload block to boost it. Chris Carmichael did his Bicycling column about this a month or two ago. I would do a regeneration 6 days, then a 10 day block of longer, back to back, aerobic endurance rides, then a few days of recovery again.

I have about 10 weeks before my goal event. I am thinking this would be a 3 week endurance block, and then I could get back to a couple more blocks of climbing & intervals?

Or, should I just stick with the alternating long rides that we have been discussing here?

I feel like a babe in the woods with these training plan ideas. I am grateful for any thoughts (haha...these days, my thoughts are so few and far between! LOL )

[Veronica]

Were you eating and drinking enough on your ride yesterday?

Can you control your heart rate during a climb to keep yourself from spiking? I can set my HRM to beep if my HR gets too high or too low on a ride. When it's too high, I control it by either down shifting if I can or slowing my cadence slightly and breathing evenly.

V.

[maillotpois]

some rides turn out to be harder than they "should" be. often it's impossible to know why. V's questions about food and HR are on point.

I think you will have more endurance/recovery zone stuff during the week as your weekend rides get harder. but don't forget to try a day or 2 in there of harder interval training. I think that's what I've been missing and I paid for it yesterday.

that Carmichael plan sounds good. you can never go wrong with a base building week thrown in. and I think you have plenty of time to try it out.

[Geonz]

Yep, what MP said!

I can also give you a more moderate picture of what we were doing prior to my work/illness issue.

An example of one 'cycle':
wk 1: 65 miles, 4500 ft climbing
wk 2: 55 miles, 5500 ft climbing - this was tougher than it looks because those climbs were much steeper than our normal terrain in order to get to 5500 ft in only 55 miles
wk 3: 85 miles rolling terrain (probably 2500 feet overall)
wk 4: 75 miles, 6000 climbing

After doing this just once, I noticed that wk 4 was MUCH easier for me than week 1 was, on the same general terrain. There could have been other conditions that made it seem easier, but I do recall that many of the climbs we had done in wk 1 that were repeated in wk 4 (we did both rides in the same county) were 'flatter' to us. I also know that after completing some of the climbs of wk 2, everything seemed easier in comparison (though that was definitely a mental benefit).

Week 5 was to be another shorter, steeper route, but that's when I got slammed with work....

Oh, and two other benefits to training like this are 1) that you can get to total fatigue in a shorter distance on some of those weeks like wk 2, so they are a bit easier to fit into the rest of life's schedule. And 2) if you have to travel to get to the bigger hills/climbs, you don't have to do that travel every weekend.

Okay, I"m confused. In week one you ride 65 miles? Or is that every day? (I'm justcurious. Hills are a little hard to find here, as are long distance events...)

[GLC1968]

Okay, I"m confused. In week one you ride 65 miles? Or is that every day? (I'm justcurious. Hills are a little hard to find here, as are long distance events...)

That 65 miles was one weekend ride. The schedule I posted was only my weekend long rides. I also ride during the week at least a couple of times (more, if I'm commuting) and do some other activities. If schedule permits, I also try to do a ride on the opposing weekend day either as a recovery ride or as some other type of training (usually a short ride).